Shawbrook Bank - Ignores undelivered maturity emails- assumes you've received them.

HUMBUG

Rich1976 said:

HUMBUG said:

TheSpectator said:

HUMBUG said:

Albermarle said:

When I asked why they transferred my cash isa's into an account that only paid 0.1% rather than their 'Easy Access Cash ISA' at 3.7% , she kept repeating 'Its Our Policy'.  That did annoy me because I said it might be their policy but it doesn't make it right.

Different providers have different policies about what happens to matured fixed rate accounts ( ISA or not). A few  default to opening a new fixed rate account, most default to an easy access account but often one paying a low rate of interest.
Some of us like Shawbrook as you can add to their fixed rate ISAs during the fixed rate term, which although not unique is quite unusual and customer friendly, especially when rates are dropping ! 

That may be a positive for Shawbrook , but the  parking of ISA's after maturity date into some holding ISA account at  0.1% interest is a big negative imho.

Which you could have wholly avoided by one of the following

a) Keeping your contact e-mail address up to date
b) Diarising your maturity dates
c) Logging onto your account on a regular basis. Don't know about others but if I have a few grand parked anywhere I like to 'check in' on it on an at least monthly basis.

I do  b and c  but forgot one account 'Shawbrook' because it was setup in 2010 and I import all emails from plusnet webmail automatically into gmail. So one tends to forget that the old plusnet one still exists.  Yes , this is a pain in the proverbial but I still think it's worth going through the Financial Ombudsman as he will have access to the recorded call I had with the 1st line rep.  She definitely said that if emails are bounced back they would contact me by other means . But if their systems are setup not to receive bounced emails , then the fault is not wholly mine.

So what sort of outcome are you expecting from the Ombudsman considering that this is all down to you using an antiquated email system and not keeping your records up to date?

I would expect all you would receive is a standard goodwill gesture but nothing more.

You need to bear in mind for the future that not all company’s processes are slick as you would like and whilst you undoubtedly expect the failed email to be reported on, I have never known or indeed worked for any organisation that does that considering the thousands they must send out automatically.

Yes a goodwill gesture would be nice considering I have been saving with them since 2010 and this is the 1st time  there have been any issues regarding communication.  

In this high tech age, surely there must be automated incoming email management processes that are able to filter specific replies such as  'Undelivered' or 'Address Unknown' type responses. Further, they could easily use those replies to filter off the email addresses and link them to the 'Profile' database and send automated SMS text messages to your mobile number with a standard message saying 'We have received returned email from address xxxxxx  , please log into your account and update your Profile with the correct email address'.  The fact that they send emails out with DO NOT REPLY is obviously an easy way to reduce your costs in managing customer email issues. 

I will repeat what I previously posted :

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If a bank attempts to communicate via an email that no longer exists, they should receive a bounce-back message indicating the email address is invalid. The bank should then investigate why the email is no longer valid (e.g., user changed their email, account closed, etc.) and update their records accordingly. 

Here's a more detailed breakdown:

1. Bounce-Back Message:

Most email systems will automatically send a bounce-back message (also known as a non-delivery report or NDR) back to the sender when a message cannot be delivered to a specific email address. This message will typically explain why the delivery failed, such as the address being invalid or the user no longer accepting emails at that address. 

2. Bank's Response:

Upon receiving a bounce-back message, the bank should:

Verify the email address: The bank should confirm with the customer or the account holder that the email address is indeed invalid. 

Update Records: If the address is confirmed to be invalid, the bank should update their records with the correct email address or the user's new contact information. 

Follow-Up: If the bank cannot verify the email address's validity or reach the customer, they should investigate further and may need to consider alternative communication methods (e.g., postal mail, phone call). 

3. Preventing Future Issues:

To prevent future communication issues, banks should implement procedures to verify and update email addresses periodically. This might involve requiring customers to update their email information regularly or using email verification tools to ensure that email addresses are valid. 
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As I said previously , I don't know if the above is something obligatory that a bank must do or just a recommendation for good business practice.

dunnm1

VNX said:

It is a big negative putting matured accounts into a 0.1pc account, which is exactly why you would act and move the money to another option paying more. (I appreciate the whole old email info)

At the end of the day shawbrook, like all banks are businesses and it suits their purpose to move people into 0.1pc accounts.

a bit like car insurance companies like to up peoples renewal quote hoping they will be apathetic and just stick with what they know, or forget to haggle, same principle.

Or is is it a lack of principles?

Businesses in the past used to have very different values. Capitalism has and is changing, as all things do, but perhaps not for the better. Maybe why so many on here wanted/want out, just stopped sitting well with me? Perhaps we accept what is fundamentally wrong because we feel unable/helpless to change it?

Is my 89 year old Mother in Law apathetic in wanting to remain completely independent but not quite up to speed on renewing her home / contents insurance, internet, utilities, phone etc. every year?

A look at the large corporations of the 1950's (a golden age in capitalism in my opinion) and how they acted as regards local community, employees etc. whilst still making enough profit maybe enlightening? it was for me, another straw that helped to brake the camel's back. If me and mine end up somewhat less financially well off for it, so be it. I sleep a lot easier these days.

HUMBUG

Hoenir said:

HUMBUG said:

TheSpectator said:

Most of these outbound notification e-mails are from a 'do not reply' mailbox and in all likelihood do not accept incoming mail so they wouldn't have got any bounce back.

I'm with the majority, this is your own fault. Set up some system of your own to monitor maturing accounts.

I think its a fault from both parties. 

You knew that you had redirected mail but failed to take any corrective action prior to the email account being deleted. 

As soon as I moved over to EE , my old Plusnet webmail account was deleted. I very rarely used that webmail account and had setup my gmail to import any emails sent to my Plusnet Webmail. 

No, I forgot that the Shawbrook emails were being redirected from my Plusnet email which was setup back in 2010.  So when it was deleted , it didn't occur to me that my Shawbrook Profile would need updating.
Unfortunately, these redirected emails easily look as if it they were being sent directly to my gmail rather than being redirected from my xxxxx@broadplus.plus.com .   

Look below at the email header I received from an old redirected Shawbrook email back in 2023.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Important Message - Your Fixed Rate ISA Bond is about to mature

Shawbrook Bank <Savings.DoNotReply@shawbrook.co.uk>	Fri, Jan 13, 2023, 3:52 PM
To  xxxxx ---------------------------------------------------------------- The xxxxx will be my Christian name only so it never occurred to me that it came from my plusnet webmail account.  I admit I forgot , but should I really be penalised about £666 for that oversight?  Does it say in their T & C's that the customer will be held responsible for detrimental impact on their savings accounts due to incorrect email information?   I don't know for certain but maybe the Financial Ombudsman will, if it gets that far.

Barkin

Does it say in their T & C's that the customer will be held responsible for detrimental impact on their savings accounts due to incorrect email information?

Already covered up thread. In so many words...yes.

It's down to you to keep your contact details up to date.

HUMBUG

Barkin said:

Does it say in their T & C's that the customer will be held responsible for detrimental impact on their savings accounts due to incorrect email information?

Already covered up thread. In so many words...yes.

It's down to you to keep your contact details up to date.

I've just looked at the T&C's for Shawbrook Personal Savings and just searched for the word email . I found these to be the only clauses that could be relevant to my issue.

Although I failed in my responsibility to update my email address,  they didn't fully comply with clause 6.3  because no text messages were sent to me about the maturity edocuments they raised.  They can claim to have sent the emails and secure messages but not any text messages.


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Contacting Each Other

6.3  We will contact you by text message, by email and by Secure Message to give you information about your savings account or to let you know that a statement or document is ready to view in your account.

13. Security
13.1. You must take all sensible steps to protect your accounts. For example, if you change any of your details such as your name, address, email address, mobile phone number or telephone number, You must tell us immediately by amending your details through your online account (where you are able to do so) or by writing to us (either by post or by Secure Message) or by phone. We may require you to authenticate changes or provide proof that your details have changed. We will tell you if this is needed and the type of proof we will accept.

 13.4. It is your responsibility to:

 iv. make sure that your address details, email address and mobile telephone number are kept up to date;
------------------------------------------------------------------

Barkin

So they should send all communications via all 3 channels?

OTPs for login via secure message?

You obviously think you have a case, so go for it, but you'll need to go via Shawbrooks complaints process before FOS.

rallycurve

I agree with all other comments and this one is on you. Keep your details up to date and be on top of your finances. Simples.

You can't blame Shawbrook and you definitely should not be saying you are being penalised by them.

Good luck with your complaint but I suspect it won't go anywhere. You'd be very lucky if they offered you a goodwill gesture

HUMBUG

Barkin said:

So they should send all communications via all 3 channels?

OTPs for login via secure message?

You obviously think you have a case, so go for it, but you'll need to go via Shawbrooks complaints process before FOS.

Looks like I was looking at the T&C's for 2023 . 

They changed this clause sometime in 2024 and it's the same in 2025 (ie. when my cash ISA's matured).  Or does one use the T&C's that were applicable at the time of opening my fixed cash isas? I suspect I need to look at the T&C's when I opened them back in Jan and Feb 2024.

  

Contacting each other
6.1   We may contact you by post, telephone, 

email, Secure Message, mobile phone, text 

message and/or any other messaging service 

using the latest address, telephone number, 

email address or other contact information 

you have given us. When we send you a 

Secure Message or upload a Secure Document, 

we will tell you by email (you may need to 

check your junk or spam folders). It is your 

responsibility to make sure that we have your 

current contact details. We will keep sending 

information to you at the last known address 

or contact information we have for you. If you 

do not give us your up-to-date contact details 

as soon as they change, the security of your 

information could be put at risk.

HUMBUG

I actually raised a question on Google AI about the 0.1% holding account for matured funds and got the below reply:

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Shawbrook Bank's practice of transferring matured funds into a 0.1% interest account, as outlined in the terms and conditions, has been a point of contention for some customers. When a fixed-rate savings bond matures, Shawbrook will move the funds into a "Matured Funds" account if no instructions are received from the customer. This account offers a much lower interest rate than the fixed-rate bond, potentially leading to financial losses for the customer. While Shawbrook states that it is following its published terms and conditions, some customers feel they are being unfairly treated, as they are not being given the opportunity to choose the best use of their matured funds. 

Here's a more detailed look at the issue:

Matured Funds Account:

Shawbrook Bank has a "Matured Funds" account that is used when fixed-rate savings bonds reach their maturity date and the customer hasn't provided instructions on how to proceed with the funds. 

Low Interest Rate:

This account offers a significantly lower interest rate (0.1% per annum) compared to the fixed-rate bond it replaces. 

Customer Discontent:

Many customers feel they are being taken advantage of by this practice, as they are not being given the chance to make informed decisions about their matured funds. 

Transfer Instructions:

Shawbrook states that customers can choose to withdraw the funds, transfer them into another Shawbrook account, or transfer them to another financial institution. 

Ombudsman Decisions:

The Financial Ombudsman Service has dealt with several complaints related to this practice, with some decisions favoring the customer, such as ensuring that the funds are transferred as requested. 

Terms and Conditions:

Shawbrook's published terms and conditions outline this practice, stating that if no instructions are received, the funds will be transferred to the "Matured Funds" account. 
---------------------------------

Will be interesting to see how my complaint pans out and I'll update this thread, just in case some people are curious about the outcome or have similar issues.

fuzzzzy

I've always quite liked Shawbrook and do think the onus is on the account holder to keep contact details updated, but I might think twice about them now knowing that matured funds are put in a holding account with such a dismal rate of interest if maturity options aren't received.

It is all too easy, especially as you get older, to find yourself needing to go into hospital or something, and financial admin going on the backburner for a bit. I would like to think that if I could not manage my finances for any reason that any maturing funds would at least mature into an easy access account with an interest rate on a par with other offerings available at the time.

I also remember when my dad died he had a lot of fixed rate accounts, and there were a few institutions that had accounts mature into holding accounts with these very low interest rates. It was particularly irksome because probate took many months. I can't remember which institutions but one of them could well have been Shawbrook as I do remember he had an account with them.