Double Council Tax!!

Smalltownhypocrite

The cottage is not suitable as a ‘family home’ and even for a single person it’s a bit too small for a permanent home - so we are not ‘depriving locals' of anything.

How?

If its too small for even one person then it cannot possibly be a house, there are people living permanently in HMO rooms and/or studio flats that are the legal minimum of 6.5m2 or barely bigger, I doubt your cottage is smaller than a box room.

Your attitude sound quite snobbish to be honest. Everyone 'wants' a bigger house but you have what you have and if its habitable then it usable as a permanent home. The council don't care that your accustomed to something larger, they also have ZERO duty to house you if you declare yourself homeless through choice (I was homeless for years, you can always tell when people have no real world experience and think the council will just magic a house or even 'B&B' out of their !!!!!! for them... they don't send you to hotels and give you a council house, if you get anything you get dumped in a homeless hostel when a space opens and they're horrific and pretty dangerous).

Bigphil1474

ReadySteadyPop said:

lincroft1710 said:

ReadySteadyPop said:

lincroft1710 said:

ReadySteadyPop said:

lincroft1710 said:

ReadySteadyPop said:

The irony of "double council tax" is that loads of councils made massive losses on commercial property bets, now they are gouging more prudent people who can afford a second home to pay for their mistakes!

Councils don't like "second homes" because it is a property lost from the housing stock. It is central government who decreed councils could charge double CT. CT is governed by a wealth of Parliamentary legislation 

Housing stock isn`t the problem, the problem is the cost of housing has been driven up too high by too much cheap debt (this situation seems to be quickly changing thankfully) Government are telling councils to raise cash any way they can to avoid having to bail out councils who mismanaged their spending and investment, "second home owners" are just an easy target at the moment, price gouging people who own a cottage on the coast isn`t going to fix the UK`s  problems unfortunately.

I see we are back on our high horse about house prices!


The government took away a useful councils' income stream by firstly making councils pay income from Non Domestic Rates to central government for them to redistribute as they thought fit and then exempting loads of business properties from actually paying rates.


Since the 1960s I have been monitoring house prices and apart from a couple of glitches, they have risen alarmingly and show no sign of this trend being reversed. In 1976 I bought a house sold it less than 3 years later for 50% more than I paid for it, having only done some decorating. The only time house prices tend to fall is when mortgage rates become extortionate

Councils gouging people who have managed to afford a second property isn`t going to solve anything.

I don't recall anyone saying it would, but income is income especially if you're a cash strapped council!

Fair point, I just don`t agree with an across the board council tax purge, people who only spend a few months/weeks in an area/property should be getting a discount not paying double! How is that fair, you are not using council resources in the local area when you are in another part of the country? Where double council tax probably does work is in encouraging professional landlords to keep their property fully occupied, even if that means dropping the rent.

It's not just about property availability though. Another aspect is that those people who only spend a few weeks or months in an area only contribute for a few weeks or months to the local economy. There are loads of holiday type destinations in the UK that are like ghost towns in the winter. That means the locals who do have a job struggle, because what business is gonna employ a full staff if they only get 3 customers a day in the winter. It's the whole knock on effect. If these destinations are populated by full time residents, the peaks and troughs are less extreme which is better overall for those locals, and stops house prices rocketing.

Don't think anybody likes some high flyer flouncing over for a few weeks a year and flashing the cash either.

housebuyer143

Bigphil1474 said:

ReadySteadyPop said:

lincroft1710 said:

ReadySteadyPop said:

lincroft1710 said:

ReadySteadyPop said:

lincroft1710 said:

ReadySteadyPop said:

The irony of "double council tax" is that loads of councils made massive losses on commercial property bets, now they are gouging more prudent people who can afford a second home to pay for their mistakes!

Councils don't like "second homes" because it is a property lost from the housing stock. It is central government who decreed councils could charge double CT. CT is governed by a wealth of Parliamentary legislation 

Housing stock isn`t the problem, the problem is the cost of housing has been driven up too high by too much cheap debt (this situation seems to be quickly changing thankfully) Government are telling councils to raise cash any way they can to avoid having to bail out councils who mismanaged their spending and investment, "second home owners" are just an easy target at the moment, price gouging people who own a cottage on the coast isn`t going to fix the UK`s  problems unfortunately.

I see we are back on our high horse about house prices!


The government took away a useful councils' income stream by firstly making councils pay income from Non Domestic Rates to central government for them to redistribute as they thought fit and then exempting loads of business properties from actually paying rates.


Since the 1960s I have been monitoring house prices and apart from a couple of glitches, they have risen alarmingly and show no sign of this trend being reversed. In 1976 I bought a house sold it less than 3 years later for 50% more than I paid for it, having only done some decorating. The only time house prices tend to fall is when mortgage rates become extortionate

Councils gouging people who have managed to afford a second property isn`t going to solve anything.

I don't recall anyone saying it would, but income is income especially if you're a cash strapped council!

Fair point, I just don`t agree with an across the board council tax purge, people who only spend a few months/weeks in an area/property should be getting a discount not paying double! How is that fair, you are not using council resources in the local area when you are in another part of the country? Where double council tax probably does work is in encouraging professional landlords to keep their property fully occupied, even if that means dropping the rent.

It's not just about property availability though. Another aspect is that those people who only spend a few weeks or months in an area only contribute for a few weeks or months to the local economy. There are loads of holiday type destinations in the UK that are like ghost towns in the winter. That means the locals who do have a job struggle, because what business is gonna employ a full staff if they only get 3 customers a day in the winter. It's the whole knock on effect. If these destinations are populated by full time residents, the peaks and troughs are less extreme which is better overall for those locals, and stops house prices rocketing.

Don't think anybody likes some high flyer flouncing over for a few weeks a year and flashing the cash either.

I think I read about a place in Cornwall or West Wales where they didn't have enough permanent kids living local to run a primary school because there were so many holiday and second homes. People don't think about how second homes can impact an area. 

Bookworm105

lincroft1710 said:

I see we are back on our hobby horse about house prices!

you can't have seriously considered that a post would not mention impending house price crash if authored by this incarnation?

Emmia

ReadySteadyPop said:

freesha said:

It IS a home, who are you to say it's too small for a local to live in? I bet at least one local would be delighted to own a small cottage. Pay what you owe. Also you say you're not pension age but not working - why? Unless some massive drip-fee about being medically unable to?

The problem is though that if you discourage people who may have a bit of cash to spend in your community from having a holiday place in your community they won`t come and spend money anymore, will the local who buys a cottage spend as much as someone from London flush with cash?

People who live 100% in a community spend money in that community day in, day out.

People with second homes or bolt holes, tend to not be there routinely, visiting only in summer or at the weekend. Yes they spend more when there, but they're not there most of the time. You're deluding yourself if you think that's better.

RAS

Emmia said:

People who live 100% in a community spend money in that community day in, day out.

People with second homes or bolt holes, tend to not be there routinely, visiting only in summer or at the weekend. Yes they spend more when there, but they're not there most of the time. You're deluding yourself if you think that's better.

Walked into a crowded pub. LL looked over the summer weekend scrum, "What you having, Princess?" He silenced the discontent, "They pay my bills in winter when it's blowing a gale and you've all gone to the Canaries." 

Year-round locals run the local fair, the community bus, stock the school with kids, play in local sports teams, even run them, serve on the parish council etc. They run the sick to hospital appointments, and just chat to the lonely. Without the community infrastructure, you might as well be in a resort.

sheramber

My aunt lived in a popular seaside village. 

There were 8 houses in street. Her house and a neighbour 2 doors up were the only permanently occupied house.

The rest were second homes used by families who lived in a city and came there a few times  in the summer 

The rest of the months  the houses were shut and  street deserted.

That situation was repeated in other streets in that village and the adjoining one. 

FlorayG

RAS said:

Emmia said:

People who live 100% in a community spend money in that community day in, day out.

People with second homes or bolt holes, tend to not be there routinely, visiting only in summer or at the weekend. Yes they spend more when there, but they're not there most of the time. You're deluding yourself if you think that's better.

Walked into a crowded pub. LL looked over the summer weekend scrum, "What you having, Princess?" He silenced the discontent, "They pay my bills in winter when it's blowing a gale and you've all gone to the Canaries." 

Year-round locals run the local fair, the community bus, stock the school with kids, play in local sports teams, even run them, serve on the parish council etc. They run the sick to hospital appointments, and just chat to the lonely. Without the community infrastructure, you might as well be in resort.

That's reminded me of when I lived once in a village full of holiday homes when petrol was in really short supply and rationed ( around 2003?) and there was a queue of non-local people in the local petrol station moaning they could only have 5 gallons and the lady proprietor let me fill my car 

jimbog

ReadySteadyPop said:

freesha said:

It IS a home, who are you to say it's too small for a local to live in? I bet at least one local would be delighted to own a small cottage. Pay what you owe. Also you say you're not pension age but not working - why? Unless some massive drip-fee about being medically unable to?

The problem is though that if you discourage people who may have a bit of cash to spend in your community from having a holiday place in your community they won`t come and spend money anymore, will the local who buys a cottage spend as much as someone from London flush with cash?

It is about community. Housing cannot be seen just in terms of financial investment but about a network of local people living and supporting one another to improve the quality of all of their lives  

ReadySteadyPop

housebuyer143 said:

Bigphil1474 said:

ReadySteadyPop said:

lincroft1710 said:

ReadySteadyPop said:

lincroft1710 said:

ReadySteadyPop said:

lincroft1710 said:

ReadySteadyPop said:

The irony of "double council tax" is that loads of councils made massive losses on commercial property bets, now they are gouging more prudent people who can afford a second home to pay for their mistakes!

Councils don't like "second homes" because it is a property lost from the housing stock. It is central government who decreed councils could charge double CT. CT is governed by a wealth of Parliamentary legislation 

Housing stock isn`t the problem, the problem is the cost of housing has been driven up too high by too much cheap debt (this situation seems to be quickly changing thankfully) Government are telling councils to raise cash any way they can to avoid having to bail out councils who mismanaged their spending and investment, "second home owners" are just an easy target at the moment, price gouging people who own a cottage on the coast isn`t going to fix the UK`s  problems unfortunately.

I see we are back on our high horse about house prices!


The government took away a useful councils' income stream by firstly making councils pay income from Non Domestic Rates to central government for them to redistribute as they thought fit and then exempting loads of business properties from actually paying rates.


Since the 1960s I have been monitoring house prices and apart from a couple of glitches, they have risen alarmingly and show no sign of this trend being reversed. In 1976 I bought a house sold it less than 3 years later for 50% more than I paid for it, having only done some decorating. The only time house prices tend to fall is when mortgage rates become extortionate

Councils gouging people who have managed to afford a second property isn`t going to solve anything.

I don't recall anyone saying it would, but income is income especially if you're a cash strapped council!

Fair point, I just don`t agree with an across the board council tax purge, people who only spend a few months/weeks in an area/property should be getting a discount not paying double! How is that fair, you are not using council resources in the local area when you are in another part of the country? Where double council tax probably does work is in encouraging professional landlords to keep their property fully occupied, even if that means dropping the rent.

It's not just about property availability though. Another aspect is that those people who only spend a few weeks or months in an area only contribute for a few weeks or months to the local economy. There are loads of holiday type destinations in the UK that are like ghost towns in the winter. That means the locals who do have a job struggle, because what business is gonna employ a full staff if they only get 3 customers a day in the winter. It's the whole knock on effect. If these destinations are populated by full time residents, the peaks and troughs are less extreme which is better overall for those locals, and stops house prices rocketing.

Don't think anybody likes some high flyer flouncing over for a few weeks a year and flashing the cash either.

I think I read about a place in Cornwall or West Wales where they didn't have enough permanent kids living local to run a primary school because there were so many holiday and second homes. People don't think about how second homes can impact an area. 

Nothing to do with second homes, more about birth rate and the debt required to put down roots, and maybe Brexit according to this article, whatever it is shortage of houses is not the problem.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/education/more-london-schools-named-as-being-under-threat-of-closure-due-to-lack-of-children-b1183852.html