Change of garage use

jaypwfd

My wife’s Owns a property that is like a coach house whereby we live upstairs and she has a downstairs garage. Next to that is another 2 garages that’s owned by 2 other houses that they rent off her as part of the deeds or whatever you want to call it.

The house is 2 years old. As we have 2 houses we want to live in one and want to change the garage into a living area. The garage has a driveway in front of it for one car but we can fit 2 if we park on the path to house like everyone else does!

Google says generally you don’t need planning permission, builders inspector says it’s not an issue but then someone from planning says that we would have to apply for planning as the garage is classed as a parking space and because it’s a new build it’s subject to permitted development right removal or something?

My questions and points are..

I think it’s crazy that we have to apply as we are not extending in any way. 

Not one other person either side uses their garage for their cars, just for storage - because  if you did you would be swapping them over all the time.

We are literally replacing the door with

 a window.

Can the council override the deeds? And how long does this restricted covenant last?

The builder isn’t on site anymore so would they even know unless they came back to look?

What are the consequences of this? Can you do retrospective planning? Is there a point in time where they can’t do anything about it. 

Unless a neighbour reports it is there any way it’s found? Is there a fine? What can they do to make us change it? 

I’m sure you are not even allowed to change your door colour but people do. Some people have already changed grasses area at front into Parking space?

I have a email saying it’s fine but clearly I want ti mitigate the risk. 

Section62

jaypwfd said:

My wife’s Owns a property that is like a coach house whereby we live upstairs and she has a downstairs garage. Next to that is another 2 garages that’s owned by 2 other houses that they rent off her as part of the deeds or whatever you want to call it.

The house is 2 years old. As we have 2 houses we want to live in one and want to change the garage into a living area. The garage has a driveway in front of it for one car but we can fit 2 if we park on the path to house like everyone else does!

Google says generally you don’t need planning permission, builders inspector says it’s not an issue but then someone from planning says that we would have to apply for planning as the garage is classed as a parking space and because it’s a new build it’s subject to permitted development right removal or something?

It is what planning says which matters here. The building inspector can only comment on building regulations.

My questions and points are..

I think it’s crazy that we have to apply as we are not extending in any way. 

The need for planning consent isn't limited to extending.  Would you be happy if one of the neighbours turned their garage into a fish and chip shop and devalued your property, potentially making it unmortgageable?  Planning is what stops people doing things that adversely impact on their neighbours and the wider community.

Not one other person either side uses their garage for their cars, just for storage - because  if you did you would be swapping them over all the time.

Doesn't matter.  There is a parking space there if they want to use it, rather than parking on verges or obstructing the access.

We are literally replacing the door with

 a window.

Can the council override the deeds? And how long does this restricted covenant last?

Yes.  Removal of permitted development rights, or a planning condition, last until the council decides it is no longer necessary.  Which isn't likely to be anytime soon.  You may also have a restrictive covenant, but that is something different.  The council has 10 years to start planning enforcement action.

The builder isn’t on site anymore so would they even know unless they came back to look?

Someone tells them?  But the builder isn't who you have to look out for if there is a planning condition/Article 4 direction.

What are the consequences of this? Can you do retrospective planning? Is there a point in time where they can’t do anything about it. 

You could have an enforcement notice served on you, which may make it difficult to sell the property, even if you've returned the garage back to a garage.  If you don't comply with the enforcement notice you can be prosecuted for a criminal offence.  10 years is the time limit for starting enforcement action.  Retrospective planning consent is possible, but generally unlikely in this kind of situation.

Unless a neighbour reports it is there any way it’s found? Is there a fine? What can they do to make us change it? 

As above, they can start the enforcement process. Ultimately you can be prosecuted and face an unlimited fine, or in extreme cases the council can obtain an injunction, which could lead to jail time if you breach it.

I’m sure you are not even allowed to change your door colour but people do. Some people have already changed grasses area at front into Parking space?

If those are planning conditions then the same applies.

I have a email saying it’s fine but clearly I want ti mitigate the risk.

Who was the email from?

My comments in bold.

Flugelhorn

I think the point about what others do with their garages is very valid - yes fish and chip shop, recording studio, storage of large quantities of  flammable liquid  etc etc - the covenants probably require to for the storage of vehicles only 

silvercar

If you live upstairs, how would you link the garage living room to the upstairs? Presumably you don't want to have to go outside to go upstairs?

In a house with internal garage, people can convert the garage to a living space fairly easily, often leaving a garage door of sorts in place. In a coach house there are more issues to consider, including the barrier between your garage and the adjacent one. It won't have been built to the standards required for house external walls. There may also be an increased fire risk.

Flugelhorn

silvercar said:

If you live upstairs, how would you link the garage living room to the upstairs? Presumably you don't want to have to go outside to go upstairs?

In a house with internal garage, people can convert the garage to a living space fairly easily, often leaving a garage door of sorts in place. In a coach house there are more issues to consider, including the barrier between your garage and the adjacent one. It won't have been built to the standards required for house external walls. There may also be an increased fire risk.

I had a relative live in one like this -  could have been done as the staircase up to the flat was betwen 2 of the garages and adjacent to the flat's garage so  a doorway just inside  the front door would have worked. However if the layout is not like that, then any staircase built into it would breach the fire protection for all 3 garages. 

jaypwfd

Flugelhorn said:

silvercar said:

If you live upstairs, how would you link the garage living room to the upstairs? Presumably you don't want to have to go outside to go upstairs?

In a house with internal garage, people can convert the garage to a living space fairly easily, often leaving a garage door of sorts in place. In a coach house there are more issues to consider, including the barrier between your garage and the adjacent one. It won't have been built to the standards required for house external walls. There may also be an increased fire risk.

I had a relative live in one like this -  could have been done as the staircase up to the flat was betwen 2 of the garages and adjacent to the flat's garage so  a doorway just inside  the front door would have worked. However if the layout is not like that, then any staircase built into it would breach the fire protection for all 3 garages. 

Correct it’s between 3 of the garages it isn’t going to be from the garage to the upstairs 

Albermarle

OP
If you type 'Garage Conversion' into the search box at the top of the page, you will see many threads on the subject. Probably  would be worthwhile reading some of them. 

Section62

Flugelhorn said:

silvercar said:

If you live upstairs, how would you link the garage living room to the upstairs? Presumably you don't want to have to go outside to go upstairs?

In a house with internal garage, people can convert the garage to a living space fairly easily, often leaving a garage door of sorts in place. In a coach house there are more issues to consider, including the barrier between your garage and the adjacent one. It won't have been built to the standards required for house external walls. There may also be an increased fire risk.

I had a relative live in one like this -  could have been done as the staircase up to the flat was betwen 2 of the garages and adjacent to the flat's garage so  a doorway just inside  the front door would have worked. However if the layout is not like that, then any staircase built into it would breach the fire protection for all 3 garages. 

However there would have to be adequate protection from the spread of fire/smoke between the garages for this to be Ok.  Otherwise a fire in the neighbour's garage could allow smoke to get into the converted garage and from there into the hall/stairway of the flat.  If those stairs are the only means of escape it could easily become a deadly situation.

Flugelhorn

Section62 said:

Flugelhorn said:

silvercar said:

If you live upstairs, how would you link the garage living room to the upstairs? Presumably you don't want to have to go outside to go upstairs?

In a house with internal garage, people can convert the garage to a living space fairly easily, often leaving a garage door of sorts in place. In a coach house there are more issues to consider, including the barrier between your garage and the adjacent one. It won't have been built to the standards required for house external walls. There may also be an increased fire risk.

I had a relative live in one like this -  could have been done as the staircase up to the flat was betwen 2 of the garages and adjacent to the flat's garage so  a doorway just inside  the front door would have worked. However if the layout is not like that, then any staircase built into it would breach the fire protection for all 3 garages. 

However there would have to be adequate protection from the spread of fire/smoke between the garages for this to be Ok.  Otherwise a fire in the neighbour's garage could allow smoke to get into the converted garage and from there into the hall/stairway of the flat.  If those stairs are the only means of escape it could easily become a deadly situation.

agree it would not be a good idea at all and clearly would need a lot of work done to make it all fireproof + need extra exit ?