CP Plus Parking Charge

Mana2019

Here we go again...I'll never park at Prospect Place, Dartford again but I probably now need all of your advice from now on.

Last year November, I parked thinking Sundays are free. The sign, did however say "Sundays and Bank Holidays - Free" (link). When I returned to the car park, I looked at the sign again - seeing 4 hours maximum stay, but I thought it for the controlled parking days (Monday to Saturday) and when I checked the machines, none of them were working (I assumed because it's Sunday). But I took a video of the machine not working and photo'd the sign just in case anything happens.

And nothing came from it. So I thought.

So this has arrived by doorstep (link) January 11th and although the date of issue was 3rd, this gave me little time to think of something if I ever want to pay this "discount" of £60. 

I searched everywhere who's the landlord of Prospect Place, Dartford...but the website is dead, and the only numbers I can find are from CP Plus/Nexus and British Land. So I contacted British Land, they first pointed I should contact Nexus.

I appealed the decision (while saying I wasn't in the vehicle) and their response was:

Clear signs at the entrance of this site and throughout inform drivers of the 2 hours maximum stay with the option to extend with payment. Sundays and bank holidays parking is free up to 4 hours. and it is not possible to access any part of the premises without passing multiple signs. Your representations are not considered a mitigating circumstance for appeal.
In light of this, on this occasion, your representations have been carefully considered and rejected.
We can confirm that we will hold the Charge at the current rate of £60 for a further 14 days from the date of this correspondence. If no payment is received within this period, and no further appeal to POPLA is made, the Charge will escalate and further costs may be added.

Went back to British Land, and for some reason this time they wanted to investigate and put me to through to the Regional Facilities Manager for Prospect Place Retail Park. After a few exchanges the conclusion from them was:

Thank you for explaining this in detail.

 Unfortunately, as the sign clearly states maximum 4 hours free parking on Sunday, there isn’t much I can do.

 There are multiple machines and signage at the park, with the phone number on the signs itself in case there are issues with the machine.

 Have you rung them on the day when you weren’t able to put your registration in?

 If you have a video showing that machine wasn’t working, I’d suggest you send that together with your appeal to CP Plus.

 If the appeal is rejected, do get back in touch with the same video and I’ll investigate this further.

Obviously I cannot appeal to CP Plus/Nexus again because I already appealed and they rejected. I haven't sent them the video because it does look like it's a waste of time because she said there isn't much she can do with this case. 

So what are the next steps?

Nellymoser

You could:
Appeal to POPLA if you were given a code.
Await a Court Claim ignore debt recovery letters but not Letter before Claim
Get back in touch with the Facilities Manager she did say:

If the appeal is rejected, do get back in touch with the same video and I’ll investigate this further.

Mana2019

Nellymoser said:

You could:
Appeal to POPLA if you were given a code.
Await a Court Claim ignore debt recovery letters but not Letter before Claim
Get back in touch with the Facilities Manager she did say:

If the appeal is rejected, do get back in touch with the same video and I’ll investigate this further.

For POPLA, which one should I select? These are the listed options I think they may be suitable:

• The amount requested on the parking charge notice is not correct.
• I was not the driver or the registered keeper of the vehicle at the time of the alleged improper parking.
• Extreme circumstances prevented me from parking correctly.
• Other

I got the video, but she said to only come back to her if the appeal is rejected. But I don't know if she meant the CP Plus rejection or POPLA's.

KeithP

Other.

Doesn't the third post of the NEWBIES thread suggest that?

Mana2019

I read from different threads that overstay appeals almost never win with POPLA. Considering I overstayed due to their miswording, this seems like a lost cause and appealing to POPLA is a waste of time.

So I guess the video evidence is the next step. However, it's annoying there's no "owner" of Prospect Place I can talk to. Just British Land and Group Nexus.

Mana2019

Update: So sending that video was a waste of my time.

Unfortunately, as this has been rejected by CP Plus, there isn’t much I can do.

 

It seems that they have reviewed your representation fully and confirmed the charge was valid.

 

I’m sorry I couldn’t be more of a help at this time.

Of bloody course they will confirm that charge as valid, they want their £200!

Not giving it to them.

Coupon-mad

Quite right.

No paying a case involving ambiguous signs.

Tell the Regional Facilities Manager for Prospect Place Retail Park, Dartford that you will not be paying and will see Group Nexus in court.

Further, your friends & family will boycott the place now, and the case is already being discussed online on MSE forum which will be seen by hundreds of readers every time the discussion thread is updated.

Forgive the question - but why are you using car parks on Sundays, when most streets are free? Even in London boroughs, I'd never use a car park on a Sunday. Find a single yellow line or bays that aren't restricted on Sundays; park on-street every single time.

Mana2019

Coupon-mad said:

Tell the Regional Facilities Manager for Prospect Place Retail Park, Dartford that you will not be paying and will see Group Nexus in court.

Further, your friends & family will boycott the place now, and the case is already being discussed online on MSE forum which will be seen by hundreds of readers every time the discussion thread is updated.

Do threats like this work? Because if I was her, I wouldn't care - it's not my business?

Forgive the question - but why are you using car parks on Sundays, when most streets are free? Even in London boroughs, I'd never use a car park on a Sunday. Find a single yellow line or bays that aren't restricted on Sundays; park on-street every single time.

It was Dartford, not London and most of the town centre has double yellow lines. And my wife didn't want to walk more than 5 minutes. I personally would have walked if I was by myself but yeah, it's because of her we had to park in that car park.

Hope she never see this though!

Coupon-mad

Mana2019 said:

Coupon-mad said:

Tell the Regional Facilities Manager for Prospect Place Retail Park, Dartford that you will not be paying and will see Group Nexus in court.

Further, your friends & family will boycott the place now, and the case is already being discussed online on MSE forum which will be seen by hundreds of readers every time the discussion thread is updated.

Do threats like this work? Because if I was her, I wouldn't care - it's not my business?

Obviously yes, otherwise we wouldn't have that as PLAN A - and we wouldn't have an entire thread dedicated to 'SUCCESSFUL COMPLAINTS ABOUT PPCs' that's been running for years!

Even the RAC suggest that as the first step in their new Guide:

https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/advice/driving-advice/how-to-appeal-a-parking-charge-notice-pcn/#what-to-do-if-you-receive-a-parking-charge-notice-from-a-private-parking-operator

What to do if you receive a Parking Charge Notice from a private parking operator

1. ...
2. ...
3. Keep your evidence, in case you need it later. 
4. We say ‘if you need it later’ because the first thing to do with an unfair windscreen PCN, if you’re in a private car park with retail or business units, is to march in with the PCN and complain to the manager. They can often cancel a PCN on the spot. 
5. If you get a postal PCN from a private firm, again gather your evidence, being careful not to incur a second PCN by returning to the site. Always try the landowner or retailer complaint while there, and certainly before embarking on any appeal. Often, a private operator will not cancel if they’ve spent time and money on an appeal stage but you may be pleasantly surprised how successful this tip is, when tried early after receipt of a private PCN by post. In fact, it’s never too late to try the retailer/landowner complaint route, so try it now even if you’re at a later stage. 
6. If the on-site businesses (try them all, even if you were just browsing in their store and have no receipt from that day) say that they “can’t cancel the PCN because they don’t own the car park”, ask them for the contact details of the site agent. If that is refused, walk over to the site entrance because in the case of a retail or business park, the property agent that runs the location and contracted with the parking operator is very often identified on the welcome sign. Not the parking sign, the large one that lists the retail units in bright font often has the property agent underneath. Ring or email them and politely complain, saying how much you used to like shopping/eating at their establishments but can’t afford to, if risking £100 ‘fines’.