Bank fraud (over) protection?

[Deleted User]

grumpy_codger said:

[Deleted User] said:

dealyboy said:

 Was I insulted?, Was I indignant? ... No ... I was miffed but it could have been worse, the transaction could have been blocked for a time period or my account could have been suspended.

... I'm honestly tired of this capitulation to, and normalisation of, tyrannical and unjust business practices.

You forgot to mention that these practices are imposed on banks by our nanny state.

Yes, code of practice for authorised push payment (APP) scams is 'voluntary', but it's hard to believe that banks voluntarily decided to refund tens of thousands to all idiots victims.

Hence the advice to withdraw cash.

I mentioned it in the post above that one, where mentioned the ways banks are '...compelled to operate due to government legislation.' You'd imagine that government legislation would first and foremost establish and protect the rights of the 'ordinary' customer (for example, deeming a bank account a human right, stipulating that any restrictions on utility must be communicated, justified and subject to full and timely independent investigation) but what do we get instead? The mandate that banks must take on the role of law enforcement (with all the disruption and inconvenience pushed onto the customer), and the monetary protection of people who send £50k to Nigeria in order to help Brad Pitt who's broken his leg on an oil rig and needs to be airlifted to safety.

eskbanker

grumpy_codger said:
Yes, code of practice for authorised push payment (APP) scams is 'voluntary', but it's hard to believe that banks voluntarily decided to refund tens of thousands to all idiots victims.

It's not voluntary - it was when initially introduced in 2019 but was mandated by regulatory change in October 2024.

Obviously banks wouldn't have simply chosen to start the process without 'encouragement' from the FCA and PSR, and the recognition that it was perhaps the least worst option when compared with more rigorous control being imposed, but the voluntary code was effectively a holding position while Confirmation of Payee was implemented, so now that CoP is in place, the trend of increasing APP scams has been reversed, and hence APP fraud reimbursements to individuals were down 20% from H1 2023 to H1 2024....

M25

Horrible story I would just close the account. I use Chase for somethings but there's no way I'd have them holding on to £20,000 for me I feel they're one of these fake new banks. All fur coat and no knickers.

These stories will only get more frequent now as every idiot who banks is covered for their inabilty to use common sense (of course they may not have any).

The whole retail banking system is paying for a few thousand numpties.

Cit6

Tell me about it!!!!!!
I think its gone to far.
Only last week i tried to transfer a large amount from Santanter to Convertry BS,  NIGHTMARE!!!!  
Treated like a brainless idiot
I know ALL the scams
They then said i can only transfer £10000 in 24 hours  This is to a BS !!!!!!!!
I can go on and on

To be honest, I think the victim deserves everthing they loose.  What happened to commom sence?

TheBanker

Cit6 said:

Tell me about it!!!!!!
I think its gone to far.
Only last week i tried to transfer a large amount from Santanter to Convertry BS,  NIGHTMARE!!!!  
Treated like a brainless idiot
I know ALL the scams
They then said i can only transfer £10000 in 24 hours  This is to a BS !!!!!!!!
I can go on and on

To be honest, I think the victim deserves everthing they loose.  What happened to commom sence?

You should raise this with your MP. The regulators have forced the banks to accept liability for their customers mistakes, effectively providing a blanket insurance policy, free of charge, to anyone who falls for a scam. The banks naturally want to reduce their losses which is making it increasingly difficult for people to make legitimate payments. The way the Financial Ombudsman interpret the rules means that simply warning a customer is not sufficient. And there is no way for a customer to opt out and be able to send a payment at their own risk.

I have every sympathy for people who fall for scams, but at some point we have to go back to taking responsibility for our own actions.

born_again

M25 said:

Horrible story I would just close the account. I use Chase for somethings but there's no way I'd have them holding on to £20,000 for me I feel they're one of these fake new banks. All fur coat and no knickers.

These stories will only get more frequent now as every idiot who banks is covered for their inabilty to use common sense (of course they may not have any).

The whole retail banking system is paying for a few thousand numpties.

JPMorgan Chase, through its Chase subsidiary, is one of the Big Four banks of the United States.

Far from a fake bank....

SiliconChip

One answer in this case would be to transfer the money to your own account at another bank that allows a cheque book (I did this for £20K for a Chase to Santander transfer a few weeks ago without any issue) then write a cheque to the intended recipient.

However, I'd echo the comment about confirming that the gifted deposit is acceptable:

https://www.lloydsbank.com/mortgages/help-and-guidance/first-time-buyer-help/gift-deposits.html  

Most lenders prefer when your gifted deposit comes from a relative. This could be:

• Parents, step-parents, or parents-in-law.
• Siblings, half-siblings, step-siblings, or brothers and sisters-in-law.
• Grandparents or step-grandparents.
• Aunts or uncles who are related by blood.
• Nieces or nephews.
• Partner living with applicant.
• Applicants' children, stepchildren, sons and daughters-in-law, or adopted children.

The_Unready

As an aside, and as a counter-view, I recently transferred £35k to a car dealership from my Nationwide current account via two separate transactions over four days. Both went through without a hitch.

I had previously alerted NW to the upcoming transfers via their chat facility,  but their bot told me that there was no need to do this and that the NW would consider each transfer request as and when it was created and decide whether or not to flag it based on my previous current account history.

Perhaps you need to move banks 😀.

Kim_13

They absolutely should not have advised taking the money in cash instead - and besides, it would take weeks and give them a nightmare they likely wouldn’t be able to clear at the other end.

It’s possible sending money to your goddaughter’s husband rather than to her directly is ringing alarm bells. 

M25

born_again said:

M25 said:

Horrible story I would just close the account. I use Chase for somethings but there's no way I'd have them holding on to £20,000 for me I feel they're one of these fake new banks. All fur coat and no knickers.

These stories will only get more frequent now as every idiot who banks is covered for their inabilty to use common sense (of course they may not have any).

The whole retail banking system is paying for a few thousand numpties.

JPMorgan Chase, through its Chase subsidiary, is one of the Big Four banks of the United States.

Far from a fake bank....

I've had a UK Chase account for years.

Can't pay a cheque in via the app or any other means. 

They don't issue cheque books.

Can't pay physical cash into the account in any manner.

That's a fake or if you prefer, a pretend bank.

I like them for the cashback but nothing else.