Confused about paperwork required for loft as habitable room

NervyBuyer

House I'm buying was marketed/priced as a 2 bed, with the 2nd bedroom in the loft. Agent's details stated that a window and door were being installed to satisfy building regs. They noted on my offer that it was conditional on this being fulfilled. The previous sale was 5 years ago; it was not marketed/priced with the loft as a habitable room at that time. I can see from the pictures of that listing that the conversion to a room had already taken place (proper staircase installed, dormer window put in, floor/celing/walls done), all that's being done now is adding a door at the bottom of the staircase and replacing the window with a fire escape one.

There is no mention of this work in anything I've received from the solicitors - no paperwork for the original conversion (probably doesn't exist since it wasn't sold as a room), no comment from the vendor on works in progress (not sure there would be such a thing on the forms anyway), or any enquiry from my solicitor about satisfying regs (their enquiries generally have been very thorough, but would they even know this was a thing to ask about?). 

I know the work is being done, there's no issue with that, but the person I'm now liaising with at the agent doesn't seem to understand that there is a building regs requirement. They said 'the installer will provide a certificate'. My surveyor (survey not done yet) has also asked if they have applied for Building Regulations approval, which appears to be something that needs to be done by an external body.

All I want to do is make sure I have the correct paperwork for when I want to sell on. Have I got the wrong end of the stick and this is something that comes under the competent person scheme, or does it need additional approval?

user1977

Have you not discussed it with your solicitor? Are they aware that the room exists?

silvercar

It needs to be signed off by building control.

Section62

NervyBuyer said:

I can see from the pictures of that listing that the conversion to a room had already taken place (proper staircase installed, dormer window put in, floor/celing/walls done), all that's being done now is adding a door at the bottom of the staircase and replacing the window with a fire escape one.

The pictures won't show if the loft floor structure was strengthened or shown to be adequate, nor if there is sufficient insulation on the walls/ceiling.  Did your surveyor comment on these at all?

In the absence of BC approval what you really need is for the original work to be 'regularised', but the vendor is likely to pushback on that as intrusive investigations are likely to be required.  The further modifications could form part of the regularisation process.

Replacement of the window might be covered by the FENSA scheme (depends on the details) but I'm not aware of any scheme which would cover installing the door - this would need to be signed off either by a LA or a private building control service.  The details for stairs/doors are critical as (for example) there has to be sufficient landing space.

I'd also be slightly concerned that this latest work might reset the clock in terms of enforcement - it sounds like conversion of the loft into a habitable (bed)room is taking place now, not 5+ years ago.  The point is arguable, and may make it difficult to get an indemnity policy.

FreeBear

Section62 said: I'd also be slightly concerned that this latest work might reset the clock in terms of enforcement - it sounds like conversion of the loft into a habitable (bed)room is taking place now, not 5+ years ago.  The point is arguable, and may make it difficult to get an indemnity policy.

And if the clock is reset, the council now have up to 10 years to issue enforcement notices.

Albermarle

As said just adding a door and a new window is not enough.
For it to be a habitable room, it needs to be signed off as such by Building Control.
For this normally to happen a building control inspector will visit at least a couple of times during the conversion ( and at the end ) , to check it is being constructed correctly.
If this has not been done then to get building control approval, they will need to remove plaster etc to check the basic construction is OK ( or not).

NervyBuyer

Thanks for your replies. 

"The pictures won't show if the loft floor structure was strengthened or shown to be adequate, nor if there is sufficient insulation on the walls/ceiling.  Did your surveyor comment on these at all?" - Surveyor is not attending until the door/window work is complete. I have made him aware of all the works that have been done though (not just in the loft area) by the current vendor (written in solicitor's pack) and the previous owner (verbally described to me by the vendor).

I haven't yet discussed with solicitors as I thought this was all being dealt with, the agent having said (in writing, and without being asked) from the outset that building regs approval was part of the deal - it was only today that the person at the agency seemed to know nothing about it. I'd rather get myself a bit more clued up before phoning the solicitor. It's possible it is all being dealt with by the vendor.

I don't understand about the clock being reset, indemnity policies and enforcement notices - is there a good resource online where I can read up on this?

user1977

NervyBuyer said:

I haven't yet discussed with solicitors as I thought this was all being dealt with

Your solicitor won't deal with it if nobody has (yet) told them there's a loft conversion involved.

Sometimes solicitors are usefully proactive and will look at the estate agent's schedule to check for this sort of complication, but otherwise they're likely to wait until anything gets flagged up by the survey, searches or answers to enquiries.

ButterCheese

I don't know if this helps or not, but we had a similar issue with ours.  My partner bought it as a 5 bed house; one bedroom was the loft conversion.  It was never a problem until we came to sell it.  The buyers' mortgage provider wanted evidence of the building regs/certificate - otherwise they were saying it's not fit to be a habitable room and therefore only a 4 bed house and therefore worth much less.  We contacted the relevant people and they said certificates weren't even issued when the work was done (1976).  It's basically a caravan on the top of the house, but does have its own staircase, door and Velux window.

They sent a man around to inspect it; he took 5 minutes looking at it and said "yes this is ok", and that was it.

So for us (and the buyer) it was more a requirement for the mortgage provider to be satisfied that its habitable living space so if ever they have to repossess the house, they have assurance that it can be sold on as a 5 bed and not a 4.

Our estate agents were not helpful in this regard, and didn't understand it either.  We pretty much had to do all of the legwork

NervyBuyer

user1977 said:

NervyBuyer said:

I haven't yet discussed with solicitors as I thought this was all being dealt with

Your solicitor won't deal with it if nobody has (yet) told them there's a loft conversion involved.

I wasn't expecting my solicitor to need to deal with it - I thought that this was all understood (being 'dealt with') by the vendor and they would be passing the necessary certification along (via solicitors) once they had it.

It's the agent rep that has put me in doubt. I could be concerned over nothing and it's just them that aren't aware of the situation (they are not involved at the listings/viewings/offers end of the process). Anyway, I have asked them to check on the situation w.r.t building regs with the vendor. I'll contact my solicitor depending on their response.

Section62

NervyBuyer said:

I don't understand about the clock being reset, indemnity policies and enforcement notices - is there a good resource online where I can read up on this?

Some building work requires notification and/or approval for building regulations purposes - the requirements vary by the type of work done.  If work is done that requires notification and/or approval but that doesn't happen, then the council's building control department can take enforcement action.  There is a scale of enforcement from requiring retrospective approval (aka 'regularisation') all the way through to prosecution in particularly egregious cases, or where the owner refuses to comply.

There is a time limit for enforcement.  It used to be 1 year in most cases, but as FreeBear points out, it is now 10 years.  That means in your case if the original conversion work didn't meet the requirements of the regulations the council had 1 year in which to take action, so it would now be too late unless they obtained a court order.  However, by doing further work - which is necessary for the room to be habitable - the owner is resetting the enforcement clock, so the council would now have 10 years in which they could start enforcement action.

An indemnity policy is something you may have been offered instead of the work being regularised.  Essentially an insurance policy so if the council were to start enforcement the insurer would cover certain costs such as obtaining regularisation or defending against legal action.  But indemnity policies are sold with various conditions (e.g. you mustn't contact the council about the issue) and if there is new work it is unlikely an insurer would offer a policy.

If you google the various terms there is lots on the internet about the subject.