How do fraudsters get your bank details these days

bobblebob

Found out this morning my credit card was used fraudulently last night. Phoned bank, got card stopped and new one on the way so all good.

However what intrigued me is how it happened. The bank confirmed all payments were online which i suspected, but i havent used my credit card online for months. The transactions on my credit card are for a taxi and a pizza so not alot was taken (about £35). You would think if someone went to the effort of somehow obtaining your card details and committing fraud they would spend a bit more than just a taxi and a pizza.

The bank did say they have an address of the taxi company it was used for, so have something to go on to investigate. Do banks investigate low level fraud?

Zanderman

Had a similar thing with one of my credit cards in November - a single order made at screwfix, not by me. The bank had no explanation, and I rather doubt they were going to investigate - as I doubt yours will either.  Don't worry about it and move on!

As for how, some fraudulent card transactions, possibly many of them, seem to be achieved by computer-driven 'guesswork' - generation of card numbers until one is found that works.  That can happen to a card that never leaves the house and is rarely used.  

As for only buying some relatively cheap stuff, who can say what is a priority for a criminal?  But small purchases are less likely to flag up fraud I would guess, so would be a good way to check whether they are being noticed before buying something better.

MattMattMattUK

bobblebob said:

Found out this morning my credit card was used fraudulently last night. Phoned bank, got card stopped and new one on the way so all good.

However what intrigued me is how it happened. The bank confirmed all payments were online which i suspected, but i havent used my credit card online for months. The transactions on my credit card are for a taxi and a pizza so not alot was taken (about £35). You would think if someone went to the effort of somehow obtaining your card details and committing fraud they would spend a bit more than just a taxi and a pizza.

We can make guesses, everything from random guesses at card details to insiders handing over information (which has happened in the past). It could have been cloned somewhere you used it, sometimes there are well planned operations to obtain and use card details, identity fraud etc. The taxi and a pizza may have been a trial run before a larger usage, eg. if that works and the card still works a few days later they may go and try some expensive and easily sellable goods from a retailer. I have also heard rumour of cloned cards being sold that can be used "Up to £100" and someone sells them for £10-20, whether that is real or just media speculation is hard to tell though. The reality is you will almost certainly never know.

bobblebob said:

The bank did say they have an address of the taxi company it was used for, so have something to go on to investigate. Do banks investigate low level fraud?

What constitutes an investigation is subjective, they will ask the third party's card provider for details, reverse the transactions and that is about it, it has to be well into the thousands for them to seem to bother at any real level. In general the loss is not theirs (the transaction gets reversed) so they have little incentive to expend time and money on doing anything.

Rob5342

I don't how they work, maybe they are testing the card details for a bigger purchase or maybe it's less risky for them to care out lots of small transactions that might not be noticed or investigated. I had a fraudulent transaction on one of my cards a few years ago, it was a card I rarely used and the charge was about £17 from some salvage place in the USA. 

pseudodox

Happened to me recently & no-one keeps cards more secure than I do.  My bank spotted two unusual transactions - one for £0.01 & then £300-ish, so the 1p was a test.  First 8 digits of the card number are not personal so a computer only has to compute the last 8 to get a number that works.  Bank would not reveal what drew their attention as the purchase was from somewhere I have bought from several times, but over 5 years ago.

I had recently forgotten my PIN when paying at the dentist, so they did a manual payment & whilst I have been going there for decades they do have regular staff turnover in the office so did wonder if someone had managed to steal my details . . . But of course if the bank wanted to send a 4 digit passcode to verify the £300 spend I wonder if the thief tried to get it sent to a number that is not one of my registered ones & that was the red flag.

Was very impressed with the speed my bank contacted me, did loads of checks to verify it was fraud & cancelled my card.  Replacement was with me within the week.

bobblebob

pseudodox said:

Happened to me recently & no-one keeps cards more secure than I do.  My bank spotted two unusual transactions - one for £0.01 & then £300-ish, so the 1p was a test.  First 8 digits of the card number are not personal so a computer only has to compute the last 8 to get a number that works.  Bank would not reveal what drew their attention as the purchase was from somewhere I have bought from several times, but over 5 years ago.

I had recently forgotten my PIN when paying at the dentist, so they did a manual payment & whilst I have been going there for decades they do have regular staff turnover in the office so did wonder if someone had managed to steal my details . . . But of course if the bank wanted to send a 4 digit passcode to verify the £300 spend I wonder if the thief tried to get it sent to a number that is not one of my registered ones & that was the red flag.

Was very impressed with the speed my bank contacted me, did loads of checks to verify it was fraud & cancelled my card.  Replacement was with me within the week.

Did your account disappear off online banking too? My credit card has vanished which i presume because they have cancelled the card

pseudodox

Yes - it disappeared when the card was cancelled but the advisor on the phone had warned me about this and said all the genuine current transactions on my card from the previous month or so would transfer over to the new card, which they did.  He even went through them with me (only 5 or 6) to ask me to confirm each one was a genuine spend by me.  Plus he went back over previous payments which I had made & checked that 2 or 3 online sites where I have my card details set up for speedy use (eg Amazon) were correct.  I think the new card number account appeared on my onine account within 2 days and the new card arrived in the post 2 or 3 days later.  I was very pleased with the way it was all dealt with.

It has made me wary of retaining card details on such as Amazon - I now prefer the more slightly long-winded practice of entering my details everytime I shop.

bobblebob

pseudodox said:

Yes - it disappeared when the card was cancelled but the advisor on the phone had warned me about this and said all the genuine current transactions on my card from the previous month or so would transfer over to the new card, which they did.  He even went through them with me (only 5 or 6) to ask me to confirm each one was a genuine spend by me.  Plus he went back over previous payments which I had made & checked that 2 or 3 online sites where I have my card details set up for speedy use (eg Amazon) were correct.  I think the new card number account appeared on my onine account within 2 days and the new card arrived in the post 2 or 3 days later.  I was very pleased with the way it was all dealt with.

It has made me wary of retaining card details on such as Amazon - I now prefer the more slightly long-winded practice of entering my details everytime I shop.

Ah thats good to know, thanks.

Yea i have 10 hotels on booking.com linked to my credit card (you need to have a card associated with a booking) so now that needs updating.

Google Wallet though updated instantly. Got a push notification saying your new bank card has been linked to Google Wallet. Thats impressive

Ergates

The two most common routes are data breaches (an online store that retains card details gets hacked), and some form of skimming (i.e. a crooked employee copies your card details when it's used with their company).

bobblebob

Ergates said:

The two most common routes are data breaches (an online store that retains card details gets hacked), and some form of skimming (i.e. a crooked employee copies your card details when it's used with their company).

Yea it wont be skimming, I've literally never used this card physically, always use online/Google Wallet (which i believe uses virtual card details anyway).

eskbanker

Ergates said:

The two most common routes are data breaches (an online store that retains card details gets hacked), and some form of skimming (i.e. a crooked employee copies your card details when it's used with their company).

Where are you sourcing that from?