Advice required regards employment situation rights - location of work

Wonka_2

Mistermeaner said:

I’d likewise be interested in a legal opinion on the contract terms 

true the statements regards working anywhere and working additional hours are present but likewise there’s a clause regards my place of work and one regards hours not exceeding the daily total…..

also I would say the verbal discussion I had with my boss on taking this role regards 2or3 days every other week would have relevance as well 

surely as well an extra hours clause is unenforceable - like where does that stop … can they just keep giving me more and more work to do then fire me if I don’t complete it all because I refuse to do 18hr days 7 days a week? 

You seem to be misinterpreting what the bold part is saying - your current ‘normal’ hours are 8-4 - they can change them to 10-6 but they couldn’t change them to 9-5.30 (an increase)

Given the seniority of your role there seems to be some naivety from you - you’ve already agreed that you’re contactable for emergencies with no limits and that you’ll work extra hours to meet the needs of the business. This is no different from the vast majority of ‘management’ positions so I wouldn’t be holding out hope of settlement on the basis you don’t like the conditions any more - especially given the US nature of the company. 

I’d expect the initial part of the conversation to say we’ll gladly accept your resignation should you choose to give it - unless there’s some other real legal stuff that they’ve breached 

400ixl

Mistermeaner said:

true the statements regards working anywhere and working additional hours are present but likewise there’s a clause regards my place of work and one regards hours not exceeding the daily total…..

Commute time is not part of the working hours though so you would still only be working the stated hours.

Mistermeaner said:

also I would say the verbal discussion I had with my boss on taking this role regards 2or3 days every other week would have relevance as well 

Relevant to the time you had that conversation, if they can show business needs have changed.

Mistermeaner said:

surely as well an extra hours clause is unenforceable - like where does that stop … can they just keep giving me more and more work to do then fire me if I don’t complete it all because I refuse to do 18hr days 7 days a week? 

There is the EU working hours directive so as long as they are not breaching that (45 hours average over so many weeks) and you have not signed a waiver.

Grumpy_chap

Mistermeaner said:

I’d likewise be interested in a legal opinion on the contract terms 

That will require you to seek professional (paid for) advice and the individual providing you the advice will need to see and consider the contract terms as a whole.  If you are a member of a Union, they may be able to provide some more complete comment than is practical in an internet forum such as this.

The extracts of the employment contract that you have shared in this forum seem to be "cherry-picked" to support your narrative that the requests being made are unfair / unreasonable.  I'd also suggest that some of your interpretations of the extracts that have shared are unusually favourable to yourself.  Professional advice may be able to review this in far better completeness.

In some regards, the contract is of limited value.  You do not want to work far away from home and be in the office for long hours.  The employer requires more attendance at the office and longer hours.  The two are not compatible so it would seem that all that really needs to be resolved is the mechanism by which you cease working for this employer and start a new job with a new employer.  The contract may influence whether any compensation is due to you in that change journey.  Pragmatism might suggest you bend initially and manage the change journey on your own terms.

Mistermeaner

Hi all thanks again for the comments this is exactly why I come here as hearing different folks opinions is so important for shaping thinking 

a detail I omitted but should probably have mentioned is that there is a company office local to me (about 20mins away) and I have a desk there and that is my official place of work - mentioned in numerous places / systems etc - I am not part of the budget of location ZZZZ. On the weeks I don’t go to the site 3 hrs away that is where I go (unless working at home that the company allows 2 days per week) so it’s not as simple as me just living miles from work. 

In the local office there is me and approx 20 other people who survived the closure of the local main site. I am the only one who travels to the far site on any sort of regular basis. 

I also believe I have a strong case that what has been custom and practice for now several years is working - surely the company would have to demonstrate some business need has changed to justify requiring me there more than just mr xyz says so ?

400ixl

Yes, they would need to show a business need.

Grumpy_chap

Mistermeaner said:

a detail I omitted but should probably have mentioned is that there is a company office local to me (about 20mins away) and I have a desk there and that is my official place of work 

In the local office there is me and approx 20 other people who survived the closure of the local main site. I am the only one who travels to the far site on any sort of regular basis. 

That could be a very significant factor.
It also allows you to speculate about all sorts of things.  Speculating won't get you anything good; it will just drive you mad.

The fact you are adding in more details that could substantially change the whole narrative is perhaps more confirmation of the value of professional advice with the full facts reviewed rather than "cherry picked" elements shared in this thread.

QrizB

If you're a Union member, they will be able to help.

If you aren't a member, now would be a good time to join (before anything has moved beyond the discussion stage).

Savvy_Sue

QrizB said:

If you're a Union member, they will be able to help.

If you aren't a member, now would be a good time to join (before anything has moved beyond the discussion stage).

This. If unsure which union, Google union finder and it will make suggestions. Don't delay!

As well as that, as this chap is not your manager, I'd be speaking to your manager. "I'm coming under some pressure from Fred, since he started at the zzzz location. As you know, I've been able to do what's needed by being there on 2 days a fortnight, but he's asking me to undertake F2F meetings with far more colleagues than is possible in that time frame. Is there any concern about how I've been performing, and are you happy if I continue to work my usual pattern?"

If you're lucky, your manager will ask Fred's manager to tell him to back off. Failing that, you may at least get the option of telling Fred "I've spoken to my manager and he is happy with my current work pattern, so I shall continue with it."

I agree though that travel time wouldn't usually be within your working hours: your position is moot because it's not your normal place of work, but I wouldn't draw attention to the fact that you're not at that location for 2 full working days.

Mistermeaner

Thanks again everyone for input, going to see if I can broker a compromise through all this to keep mr xyz happy without creating a stink but ultimately my family life and time at home is too important to me to concede to doing more than 2 nights away every fortnight. I will also not be getting up stupid early to travel 3 hours in my own time before 9am or likewise driving home at 9pm at night

if this position is ultimately not acceptable to the company I think there’s enough noise around this and ambiguity in my contract to make firing me expensive which I’ll take. I’ll also very quickly go off sick with stress and highlight the impact this has on my heart condition. I’m quite happy to play that game 

if anything interesting happens I’ll come back and update in case anyone is interested

thanks 

LightFlare

Mistermeaner said:

Thanks again everyone for input, going to see if I can broker a compromise through all this to keep mr xyz happy without creating a stink but ultimately my family life and time at home is too important to me to concede to doing more than 2 nights away every fortnight. I will also not be getting up stupid early to travel 3 hours in my own time before 9am or likewise driving home at 9pm at night

if this position is ultimately not acceptable to the company I think there’s enough noise around this and ambiguity in my contract to make firing me expensive which I’ll take. I’ll also very quickly go off sick with stress and highlight the impact this has on my heart condition. I’m quite happy to play that game 

if anything interesting happens I’ll come back and update in case anyone is interested

thanks 

could be a "dangerous" game to play imo