State Pension - Wife was refused her pension because older than husband by 5 months.

Emmia

My mum didn't opt out, and so has a full pension in her own right.

A trade off was made by your mum, more money in the pocket today, but less in retirement now... My mum opted for less money in the pocket, but more money now she's retired. 

A similar choice is being made today by people with their non state pensions, they're opting out of contributing to have more money to rent/buy a house/spend on day-to-day living...

At some point that decision will catch up with them, meaning they need to work for longer, have a reduced retirement income, or spend years piling money into the pension later to make up for those lost years 

Silvertabby

Pollycat said:

Silvertabby said:

Your mum's age is irrelevant - it's the day that your dad reached 65 that counted.

To be fair, my late aunt (State pension in her own right less than £1 per week) always regretted signing up for the married woman's stamp, but the reduction in NI was enough to make the difference between paying their mortgage or not.  But she said it couldn't have been clearer what she was signing up for - the declaration on the back of the application form spelled out that she would never accrue any further State pension in her own right, and that she would have to wait until her husband was 65 before she could make a claim from his NI contributions. 

I started work 53 years ago aged 17.
I was astonished how many young women around my age opted to pay the reduced women's NI stamp.

Note to OP:
the key word is 'opted'.
Your Mum had a choice.

I know.  In the job I had before joining the WRAF two of my colleagues were married, and had opted to pay the married woman's stamp.  When we received our wages they made a great song and dance about how much more money they had than us singlies, and how they were going to enjoy spending their 'money from the government'.  When a friend got married, they urged her to get herself down to HR and claim back all that cash that she now didn't have to pay.  Then they laughed at her for her 'stupidity' in opting to keep paying the full stamp because she wanted to accrue a State pension in her own right. 

Then they laughed at me because I was taking a drop in pay to join the WRAF....... 22 years and a Sgt's pension later.....

Mind you, my mum was the same.  Live for today and don't give the government a penny more than you have to.  When  I got married in the early 1990s our mother/daughter talk was on 'be sure to claim your tax back'.  She meant NI, and she wasn't impressed when I said that the option to pay the married woman's stamp had ended years back.  She wouldn't have understood why, had I been given the choice, I would have paid the full whack.  And she certainly wouldn't have understood my decision to pay the government £3K to top up my State pension to the full nSP rate! 

LHW99

Pollycat said:

Silvertabby said:

Your mum's age is irrelevant - it's the day that your dad reached 65 that counted.

To be fair, my late aunt (State pension in her own right less than £1 per week) always regretted signing up for the married woman's stamp, but the reduction in NI was enough to make the difference between paying their mortgage or not.  But she said it couldn't have been clearer what she was signing up for - the declaration on the back of the application form spelled out that she would never accrue any further State pension in her own right, and that she would have to wait until her husband was 65 before she could make a claim from his NI contributions. 

I started work 53 years ago aged 17.
I was astonished how many young women around my age opted to pay the reduced women's NI stamp.

Note to OP:
the key word is 'opted'.
Your Mum had a choice.

That is true, although the OP's mother would have (probably) started work in the 1950's. That was a different world, and mysogeny was rife, and to be honest regarded as usual by both sexes.

There was often a good deal of condescending attitudes by (mostly male) managers that "the little woman" couldn't, and wouldn't want to, understand money. It was generally "you're married, your husband will provide, do this dear" - and being brought up as generally trusting of those in authority, most women would do as they were bid.

And that's apart from needing every penny to keep the roof over their head and bring up a (probably relatively large compared to nowadays) family. Many people do have things tough in this century, but it wasn't all roses in the first half of the 20th for everyone either.

DRS1

but it wasn't all roses in the first half of the 20th for everyone either.

Considering there were two world wars during the first half of the 20th century, you can say that again.  

marycanary

My Mum paid married women's stamp which she always referred to as small stamp. It worked out well for her because Dad was about 5 years older than her, they retired together and were comfortably off. The money she saved was very useful when they had a young family to support.

molerat

marycanary said:

My Mum paid married women's stamp which she always referred to as small stamp. It worked out well for her because Dad was about 5 years older than her, they retired together and were comfortably off. The money she saved was very useful when they had a young family to support.

If she had no other provision of her own they would have been "comfortably off" on his pension as she would likely only have got, at today's rate, £101 a week.

Pollycat

LHW99 said:

Pollycat said:

Silvertabby said:

Your mum's age is irrelevant - it's the day that your dad reached 65 that counted.

To be fair, my late aunt (State pension in her own right less than £1 per week) always regretted signing up for the married woman's stamp, but the reduction in NI was enough to make the difference between paying their mortgage or not.  But she said it couldn't have been clearer what she was signing up for - the declaration on the back of the application form spelled out that she would never accrue any further State pension in her own right, and that she would have to wait until her husband was 65 before she could make a claim from his NI contributions. 

I started work 53 years ago aged 17.
I was astonished how many young women around my age opted to pay the reduced women's NI stamp.

Note to OP:
the key word is 'opted'.
Your Mum had a choice.

That is true, although the OP's mother would have (probably) started work in the 1950's. That was a different world, and mysogeny was rife, and to be honest regarded as usual by both sexes.

There was often a good deal of condescending attitudes by (mostly male) managers that "the little woman" couldn't, and wouldn't want to, understand money. It was generally "you're married, your husband will provide, do this dear" - and being brought up as generally trusting of those in authority, most women would do as they were bid.

And that's apart from needing every penny to keep the roof over their head and bring up a (probably relatively large compared to nowadays) family. Many people do have things tough in this century, but it wasn't all roses in the first half of the 20th for everyone either.

But as for the OP's Mum - she did have a choice.
Whether that choice was made by her or on her behalf by her husband, it was a choice.
She was not refused her pension by the Government.
And has no claim for the missing (not) 5 years of pension.
Regardless of her sister's circumstances who happened to marry a man 6 years older than she did.

LHW99

Pollycat said:

LHW99 said:

Pollycat said:

Silvertabby said:

Your mum's age is irrelevant - it's the day that your dad reached 65 that counted.

To be fair, my late aunt (State pension in her own right less than £1 per week) always regretted signing up for the married woman's stamp, but the reduction in NI was enough to make the difference between paying their mortgage or not.  But she said it couldn't have been clearer what she was signing up for - the declaration on the back of the application form spelled out that she would never accrue any further State pension in her own right, and that she would have to wait until her husband was 65 before she could make a claim from his NI contributions. 

I started work 53 years ago aged 17.
I was astonished how many young women around my age opted to pay the reduced women's NI stamp.

Note to OP:
the key word is 'opted'.
Your Mum had a choice.

That is true, although the OP's mother would have (probably) started work in the 1950's. That was a different world, and mysogeny was rife, and to be honest regarded as usual by both sexes.

There was often a good deal of condescending attitudes by (mostly male) managers that "the little woman" couldn't, and wouldn't want to, understand money. It was generally "you're married, your husband will provide, do this dear" - and being brought up as generally trusting of those in authority, most women would do as they were bid.

And that's apart from needing every penny to keep the roof over their head and bring up a (probably relatively large compared to nowadays) family. Many people do have things tough in this century, but it wasn't all roses in the first half of the 20th for everyone either.

But as for the OP's Mum - she did have a choice.
Whether that choice was made by her or on her behalf by her husband, it was a choice.
She was not refused her pension by the Government.
And has no claim for the missing (not) 5 years of pension.
Regardless of her sister's circumstances who happened to marry a man 6 years older than she did.

Of course she did. However, there were, in some cases, considerable pressures on women in the 50's (and earlier) to conform to male expectations - I can remember school friends having their after-school lives / jobs prescribed for them by their parents (father) even in the 1960's, which they accepted without argument. It's difficult today to realise just how much social pressure could be put onto a woman back then.

Pollycat

LHW99 said:

Pollycat said:

LHW99 said:

Pollycat said:

Silvertabby said:

Your mum's age is irrelevant - it's the day that your dad reached 65 that counted.

To be fair, my late aunt (State pension in her own right less than £1 per week) always regretted signing up for the married woman's stamp, but the reduction in NI was enough to make the difference between paying their mortgage or not.  But she said it couldn't have been clearer what she was signing up for - the declaration on the back of the application form spelled out that she would never accrue any further State pension in her own right, and that she would have to wait until her husband was 65 before she could make a claim from his NI contributions. 

I started work 53 years ago aged 17.
I was astonished how many young women around my age opted to pay the reduced women's NI stamp.

Note to OP:
the key word is 'opted'.
Your Mum had a choice.

That is true, although the OP's mother would have (probably) started work in the 1950's. That was a different world, and mysogeny was rife, and to be honest regarded as usual by both sexes.

There was often a good deal of condescending attitudes by (mostly male) managers that "the little woman" couldn't, and wouldn't want to, understand money. It was generally "you're married, your husband will provide, do this dear" - and being brought up as generally trusting of those in authority, most women would do as they were bid.

And that's apart from needing every penny to keep the roof over their head and bring up a (probably relatively large compared to nowadays) family. Many people do have things tough in this century, but it wasn't all roses in the first half of the 20th for everyone either.

But as for the OP's Mum - she did have a choice.
Whether that choice was made by her or on her behalf by her husband, it was a choice.
She was not refused her pension by the Government.
And has no claim for the missing (not) 5 years of pension.
Regardless of her sister's circumstances who happened to marry a man 6 years older than she did.

Of course she did. However, there were, in some cases, considerable pressures on women in the 50's (and earlier) to conform to male expectations - I can remember school friends having their after-school lives / jobs prescribed for them by their parents (father) even in the 1960's, which they accepted without argument. It's difficult today to realise just how much social pressure could be put onto a woman back then.

Regardless of social history, the OP's Mum wasn't refused her pension. 
She simply didn't accrue one.

Silvertabby

LHW99 said:

Pollycat said:

LHW99 said:

Pollycat said:

Silvertabby said:

Your mum's age is irrelevant - it's the day that your dad reached 65 that counted.

To be fair, my late aunt (State pension in her own right less than £1 per week) always regretted signing up for the married woman's stamp, but the reduction in NI was enough to make the difference between paying their mortgage or not.  But she said it couldn't have been clearer what she was signing up for - the declaration on the back of the application form spelled out that she would never accrue any further State pension in her own right, and that she would have to wait until her husband was 65 before she could make a claim from his NI contributions. 

I started work 53 years ago aged 17.
I was astonished how many young women around my age opted to pay the reduced women's NI stamp.

Note to OP:
the key word is 'opted'.
Your Mum had a choice.

That is true, although the OP's mother would have (probably) started work in the 1950's. That was a different world, and mysogeny was rife, and to be honest regarded as usual by both sexes.

There was often a good deal of condescending attitudes by (mostly male) managers that "the little woman" couldn't, and wouldn't want to, understand money. It was generally "you're married, your husband will provide, do this dear" - and being brought up as generally trusting of those in authority, most women would do as they were bid.

And that's apart from needing every penny to keep the roof over their head and bring up a (probably relatively large compared to nowadays) family. Many people do have things tough in this century, but it wasn't all roses in the first half of the 20th for everyone either.

But as for the OP's Mum - she did have a choice.
Whether that choice was made by her or on her behalf by her husband, it was a choice.
She was not refused her pension by the Government.
And has no claim for the missing (not) 5 years of pension.
Regardless of her sister's circumstances who happened to marry a man 6 years older than she did.

Of course she did. However, there were, in some cases, considerable pressures on women in the 50's (and earlier) to conform to male expectations - I can remember school friends having their after-school lives / jobs prescribed for them by their parents (father) even in the 1960's, which they accepted without argument. It's difficult today to realise just how much social pressure could be put onto a woman back then.

But they could have still said 'sod that'.  I left school at 15.  Not by choice - I really wanted to stay on and do my 'O' Levels - but by parental decree.  They refused to accept my request to 'swan around in school' when I could be 'out earning, and bringing money into house'.  Nothing I could do about that - and I couldn't even throw the interview (to work in a supermarket) because there wasn't one.  My mum just told her boss (the supermarket manager) that I wanted a job and it was a done deal.
As soon as I was old enough (16) I signed up for English and History 'O' Levels at night school.  Much to their disgust, as they saw it as a complete waste of time and money.  When I passed both with grade As they told me to keep quiet about it, as 'nice boys didn't like smart alec girls'.
Such were my prospects in a small town in the North West.  Leave school, get a job, get married, have children, settle down in the same street, or just around the corner from, family.  Rinse, repeat.
Many of my school friends did go down that route, which is fine if it made them happy.  Me?  I joined the WRAF.