Council Tax

DIZZYBELL

i am a 1st time buyer can the council in wales class it a second home & charge me double council tax because i am living in my parents home which they own while it is being renovated

youth_leader

Have you checked your eligibility here? Council Tax discounts and reduction | GOV.WALES

p00hsticks

Not that familiar with the Welsh rules, but I imagine if you move out of where you are now into a home of your own, leaving the current one empty, then your new property will be your main and only residence and where you are now will be treated as a second home of your parents as owners - so their problem /bill rather than yours. 

theartfullodger

Sounds like it.  When you read the Welsh legislation carefully, twice, what did that tell you.

Jude57

DIZZYBELL said:

i am a 1st time buyer can the council in wales class it a second home & charge me double council tax because i am living in my parents home which they own while it is being renovated

If I'm understanding you correctly, you've bought a home in Wales in your own name, which is being renovated. In the meantime, you are living with your parents in the home they own which I presume is in their names. If that's correct, the house you've bought is not a second home and is unoccupied only while the work is being done and once that's completed, you'll move in and it will be your sole or main residence (for Council Tax purposes).

First, as a former Council Tax recovery officer for over a decade, I can tell you that there's no need to read the legislation, let alone read it twice. That's a ridiculous thing to recommend to a layman because the extensive legislation, supported by numerous Statutory Instruments and legal precedents is complex and labyrinthine. Interpreting it correctly takes more than simply reading it. If I'm understanding your situation correctly, it's not an unusual case and doesn't need to be over-complicated.

As I see it, what you might fall foul of is the additional charge for the property being unoccupied because Councils can and do charge multiples of two, three or more times the standard Council Tax after a period of zero occupancy. Each Council decides what period of zero occupancy will qualify for an exemption from Council Tax but in all cases, the clock for that begins immediately the property becomes vacant. We often see here posts from people who have bought a 'fixer upper' that's been vacant for a while and they're shocked to learn that the empty property exemption has already expired and they now have to pay the multiple rate of Council Tax even though the property is basically a shell. It's intended to prevent properties standing empty and unused for years.

The local Council will have information about exemptions on their website and the website will, like all official local and central government websites, have the suffix .gov.uk so that you know it's a genuine site. If you can't figure out from that whether you qualify for an exemption or discount, give the Council Tax team a call or, if they offer it, live chat with them. They're the only ones who can definitively answer your question about your specific case. If you find that you're likely to be charged a multiple, I'd advise that you say you've moved in and, if appropriate, apply for the Single Occupant Discount of 25% which is likely to be very much cheaper than the unoccupied rate. It's extremely unlikely that the Council will visit to check that you've actually moved in, as long as the property looks, from the outside, to be reasonably habitable. For all anyone knows, you could be unrolling a sleeping bag on the floor every night and packing it away every morning, many people do rough it while construction works are going on. Frankly, as long as a Council Tax account is being paid, whether you're physically resident there is not a priority for them.

Good luck in your new home.

Alderbank

Jude57 said:

DIZZYBELL said:

i am a 1st time buyer can the council in wales class it a second home & charge me double council tax because i am living in my parents home which they own while it is being renovated

...you've bought a home in Wales...

The local Council will have information about exemptions on their website and the website will, like all official local and central government websites, have the suffix .gov.uk so that you know it's a genuine site.

Not in Wales!

The council will have the suffix .llyw.cymru. On Ynys Môn for example the Council's pages about Council Tax (Treth Gyngor) are at https://www.ynysmon.llyw.cymru/cy/Trigolion/Treth-cyngor/Eich-Treth-Gyngor.aspx.

Even the English translation has the suffix .gov.wales, not .gov.uk

(excellent and really useful post otherwise, thanks)

lincroft1710

Alderbank said:

Jude57 said:

DIZZYBELL said:

i am a 1st time buyer can the council in wales class it a second home & charge me double council tax because i am living in my parents home which they own while it is being renovated

...you've bought a home in Wales...

The local Council will have information about exemptions on their website and the website will, like all official local and central government websites, have the suffix .gov.uk so that you know it's a genuine site.

Not in Wales!

The council will have the suffix .llyw.cymru. On Ynys Môn for example the Council's pages about Council Tax (Treth Gyngor) are at https://www.ynysmon.llyw.cymru/cy/Trigolion/Treth-cyngor/Eich-Treth-Gyngor.aspx.

Even the English translation has the suffix .gov.wales, not .gov.uk

(excellent and really useful post otherwise, thanks)

That's the great thing about this Forum, you learn something every day! (even if you can't pronounce it!) 

Jude57

Alderbank said:

Jude57 said:

DIZZYBELL said:

i am a 1st time buyer can the council in wales class it a second home & charge me double council tax because i am living in my parents home which they own while it is being renovated

...you've bought a home in Wales...

The local Council will have information about exemptions on their website and the website will, like all official local and central government websites, have the suffix .gov.uk so that you know it's a genuine site.

Not in Wales!

The council will have the suffix .llyw.cymru. On Ynys Môn for example the Council's pages about Council Tax (Treth Gyngor) are at https://www.ynysmon.llyw.cymru/cy/Trigolion/Treth-cyngor/Eich-Treth-Gyngor.aspx.

Even the English translation has the suffix .gov.wales, not .gov.uk

(excellent and really useful post otherwise, thanks)

And thank you for that useful information. Wales is, of course, a nation of itself and quite rightly has its own suffix. I'll try to remember that in future!

DIZZYBELL

thank you for your comments jude57, yes you did have it correctly & yes it is a penalty but i still think it wrong them stating it's a second home .If i could afford 2 homes i wouldn't have brought it to renovate haha

theartfullodger

DIZZYBELL said:

thank you for your comments jude57, yes you did have it correctly & yes it is a penalty ...

You'll be aware that council tax debt is one of the few debts you can go to prison for.  Therefore I suggest you pay "under protest", in writing, calm & polite, outlining your case then pursue later, keep copies.  I'd ask them, in writing, which other property they think is your 1st home.

So dxo you assert that you do not own nor occupy (even on a shared basis) any other property in the UK?? 

I've done up a few places whilst living in or owning another property and always paid & expected to pay council tax for both. 

Jude57

DIZZYBELL said:

thank you for your comments jude57, yes you did have it correctly & yes it is a penalty but i still think it wrong them stating it's a second home .If i could afford 2 homes i wouldn't have brought it to renovate haha

I wonder why they think you are currently the liable party (in Council Tax terms, not necessarily the owner but, say, the tenant) of another property? By any chance, do you and your father have the same name? I could see how that could cause some confusion if, say, John Bloggs and John Bloggs Junior live at the same address and John Bloggs Junior registers for Council Tax at a different address without, perhaps using the 'Junior' to differentiate between him and his father because, at the new address, he'll be the only John Bloggs. Or, if your parents claim Council Tax Reduction and have you named as a non-dependent and somehow your name has been added to the Council Tax account, giving the impression you're a liable party along with your parents. Mistakes do, unfortunately, happen and until something like you buying a property occurs, no-one needs to do anything to rectify it. It's also possible that the house WAS in fact a second home for the previous owner and that the designation has been carried over to your ownership. Those are just a couple of rough guesses as to how this has happened.

Only the Council Tax department can tell you for certain why they've decided your new property is a second home and the only way to resolve the situation is by confirming to them that it is NOT a second home, you're not the liable party at your parents' address or any other address and that as soon as the renovation works are completed, you'll be living there as your only residence. It should be pretty straightforward to resolve this but if it's not, then my advice would be to involve your local Councillor, the one who represents the Ward your new house is in. You can find out who your Councillor is on the Council website, which will also have contact information for them. They can act as a go-between to get to the bottom of the issue and, after all, it's what they are elected to do so if you can't resolve it yourself, do contact them.