Seller forcing me to complete in less than 2 weeks

Lorian

Be careful what you think a boiler service will tell you. We recently bought a house (eyes wide open) with a very old boiler. We did not ask for a boiler service as we factored in replacing it in week 1 in the offer price. Our solicitor asked for it though and it I have the sheet from the local reputable company who gave it the 'service' recently and a nice piece of paper even though the fan is louder than Concorde the expansion vessel is blocked and the boiler constantly short cycles. I presume they did the 26.9s.

GDB2222

dander said:

GDB2222 said:

Let me give a counter example. I own a house built in 1972, with original wiring that is not causing any problems, but it must be reaching the end of its life. We have the original fuse box, and I do mean fuse box, and I am thinking of replacing it with a modern consumer unit.

If I were selling the house, I could honestly say that we’ve had no problems at all. Once the new consumer unit is installed, buyers may assume that the electrics are all up to date. But, of course, an EICR will tell them the correct position, ie that a full rewire will be needed pretty soon, if not immediately. 

This exactly illustrates my point. Anyone who has already had a regular survey will already have the information about the age of that fuse box and the age of the electrics. If the consumer unit was replaced that would not be completed and signed off if the rest of the house electrics were not in safe condition - and someone selling the house would have to tick the box saying electrical work had been done in the property pack and supply the appropriate paperwork. Adding an EICR will not magically tell you "these wires date to 1972" and those wires dating to 1972 does not in itself make the system dangerous or in need of rewiring. It won't even look at the detail of the wiring (it's not going to rip out the walls to see them), it will test the compliance of the system against current regs. 

This is a perfect illustration of why my post said "WHY?". If you don't know what you want out of a test, or expect to get information that a test won't give you, what reason is there to insist on it to the extent of jeopardising a property purchase?

I accept that our wiring is probably currently safe. So, I wwouldn't expect any problems getting a new consumer unit fitted.  

But, the wiring is well over 50 years old.  An electrician carrying out an EICR would certainly identify this. PVC cables can last 70 years, but a more normal lifespan is under 50 years. Whatever the results of the testing, it would be prudent to get the cables renewed at the same time as any other messy work being carried out.

BikingBud

dander said:

Can't understand why everyone on this thread seems to think these checks are a/ standard process and b/ any guarantee against future breakdown. You can tell if the boiler and the electrics work by turning them on and seeing if they work. What are you going to find out about the electrics through an EICR? Chances of finding out that a normal house that people are living perfectly happily in without exploding is some kind of crazy electrical/gas deathtrap? 
 Low. Chances of finding out about minor non-compliances with current electrical guidance? High. Those things are going to be basic things that are easy to fix. Maybe you'll have the wrong sort of light fitting in a bathroom and it will cost £50 to replace with the right one. Your regular survey will have pictures of the consumer unit, would have noted if there was obviously ancient wiring. You survey will also have a standard disclaimer that they aren't electrical professionals and you should get a check done by someone else if you really want an electrical check. That's what surveys are full of - surveyors washing their hands of legal liability for everything. "Got a roof? It might leak at some unspecified time in the future. Don't come back and blame me when it does."

Similarly, what do you expect to find out about a normal boiler if it was fitted by a Gas Safe professional and is currently in working order? Even letting regulations don't ask for a "gas check", just regular servicing. Services are inexpensive and if they give you peace of mind then you can have one as soon as you move in. 

Are you really expecting to find anything in these checks that would be a dealbreaker. The reason a seller is going to say no is that a person that demands checks for non-problems is a person that will start trying to reduce the price simply on the basis of an old house being old. There will be loads of things in non-brand-new houses that are not compliant with the regs for building brand new houses. If you're going to struggle with that concept, you need to buy new build only.

DId I miss where it was advised the boiler had been installed by a gas safe engineer?

Did I miss where it was advised that the electrical installation has not been bodged around by the current owner?

They are assumptions that might turn out to be true but what if they aren't?

Where is the OP then? in a dangerous property where the seller wasn't happy getting people in to do work because they made a mess and therefore worked on a self help basis?

The generic survey will advise to get specialist assessment of electrical and gas installation.

The OP wants to do their own due diligence the fact that some people are risk cavalier is no reason to deride the OP's cautious approach.

If issues are found the best the seller might get is that the prospective buyer seeks to renegotiate the price. The worst, for the seller, is the buyer runs away rapidly.

Either way trying to achieve a level of assurance and meet the seller's aspiration to exchange and complete on an arbitrary and rapidly approaching deadline is to my mind extremely premature and somewhat foolhardy.

kinger101

GDB2222 said:

dander said:

GDB2222 said:

Let me give a counter example. I own a house built in 1972, with original wiring that is not causing any problems, but it must be reaching the end of its life. We have the original fuse box, and I do mean fuse box, and I am thinking of replacing it with a modern consumer unit.

If I were selling the house, I could honestly say that we’ve had no problems at all. Once the new consumer unit is installed, buyers may assume that the electrics are all up to date. But, of course, an EICR will tell them the correct position, ie that a full rewire will be needed pretty soon, if not immediately. 

This exactly illustrates my point. Anyone who has already had a regular survey will already have the information about the age of that fuse box and the age of the electrics. If the consumer unit was replaced that would not be completed and signed off if the rest of the house electrics were not in safe condition - and someone selling the house would have to tick the box saying electrical work had been done in the property pack and supply the appropriate paperwork. Adding an EICR will not magically tell you "these wires date to 1972" and those wires dating to 1972 does not in itself make the system dangerous or in need of rewiring. It won't even look at the detail of the wiring (it's not going to rip out the walls to see them), it will test the compliance of the system against current regs. 

This is a perfect illustration of why my post said "WHY?". If you don't know what you want out of a test, or expect to get information that a test won't give you, what reason is there to insist on it to the extent of jeopardising a property purchase?

I accept that our wiring is probably currently safe. So, I wwouldn't expect any problems getting a new consumer unit fitted.  

But, the wiring is well over 50 years old.  An electrician carrying out an EICR would certainly identify this. PVC cables can last 70 years, but a more normal lifespan is under 50 years. Whatever the results of the testing, it would be prudent to get the cables renewed at the same time as any other messy work being carried out.

As I buyer, I'd probably just want to know that's the case though I always take a look at the distribution box to get and idea.

If all the electrics in the house looked the same age, I'd probably just think it's a cost I'd need to cover I  the next one or two years.

The alarm bells start ringing when I see things like external trunking of various ages that looks amateurish.  Professionals would find it very hard to achieve the finish I've seen in some properties.

If it looks like someone's dad did it on a Sunday afternoon between the pub and Sunday dinner.....

Or for that matter, something I might have done....