Beware of supermarket fresh produce scales not applying promotional price advertised

Snooper1

TripleH said:

I suspect, if its right on ine scale but not the other, then human error / laziness is to blame.

If its wrong on both, then you might need to ponder.

If you report the problem and a week later it still exists then I think you have cause for complaint.

If you do see these errors, it's always worth reporting because things do get missed and people can be very much 'leave it for someone else to sort'.

Your enthusiasm is commendable but maybe next time report the issue and give them time to correct before you escalate.

I think that response sums up why supermarkets are apparently not sufficiently incentivised to have better checks and balances to ensure when a discount is advertised it is in fact offered and offered to all customers to whom it is advertised. Applying your logic if I buy a discounted airline ticket from a call handler and get charged full price I complain to the call handler and check back next week to see if I am still charged the non-discounted price when I try to buy the same ticket again which might have sold out? Only then I escalate the issue to management meanwhile.potentialy thousands of customers have been.overcharged when they bought their airline ticket and a good proportion of those never realised they were overcharged? No one would get anything done as we'd all be too busy working for free helping businesses charge the advertised price not a higher one.

Snooper1

sheramber said:

By not advising the store and waiting for however long until trading standards get round to investigating, if the do, many more people could be overcharged.

By alerting staff in store they could have put the scales out of use until the matter was delt with. 

I agree. They could have done that if someone thought that closing that scale would be the most.effecrive way of stopping the problem. But what if that person didn't do anything further and next shift comes along and just puts it back into service? By escalating it at least management get to take control of it if they wish but because of the overview of all stores they might be expected to have they will know if similar complaints are coming in at other stores and with other lines and assess how big rhe problem is and design an appropriate fix.

Snooper1

Okell said:

Snooper1 said:

Okell said:

Snooper1 said:

powerful_Rogue said:

Snooper1 said:

At a large national supermarket chain which i will not currently name as I have approached Trading Standards, the scale i used near the fresh produce area used an incorrect price for the item. The item was showing as discounted but the discount was not programmed into the scale I used so it issued a sticky label at the standard price: 20% higher. More concerningly, a differnent scale located in another part of rhe store did use the correct pricing information meaning the two scales I was using were not accessing the same central pricing information. If just 20 of this root vegetable were purchased every day in every store nationally the rip off is more than £8,000 per day or nearly a quarter of a million if the price promotion runs for a month. A nice earner for the supermarket indeed. Imagine if it is happening across multiple fresh produce lines? Check the scale you use issues a pricing sticker which has the promotional price £/kg. 

What did the store say when you highlighted the issue?

I emailed non - executive director Zuber Issa at ceo@asda.co.uk on 8 November. I've not yet had a response. I since learned Mr Issa stepped down from his role on 5 November but I do expect a response to the email in any event as it is the executive team which responded to a previous complaint I sent to that email address.

Didn't you point it out to staff instore?

I noticed yesterday in my local Waitrose that they had a product recall notice up against the wrong product.  Yes it was a similar product but it wasn't the one being recalled.

I pointed the error out to staff instore.  I wouldn't think of emailing the ceo

Maybe you would have thought of emailing the CEO if the recall was because of the presence of an undeclared allergen and due to similariy of the products the error those Waitrose staff in your local store made could likely be made by staff in hundreds of other stores potentially leaving the dangerous product on the shelves and consumed by those for whom it might be fatal.

If that were the case I would have insisted on speaking to the store manager on the spot - not just alerting a member of staff to the problem.

If you think the store manager can't be trusted, what makes you think you can trust the ceo?

If it's just the tip of some company wide criminal conspiracy I doubt they'll let your email stop them.  Hope you didn't give them your address...

I didn't say the store manager cannot be trusted. It's about whether that person has the competencies or the time in a busy store to find a way to alert all.other store managers in the UK to the potential risk of.recalling the wrong product. Whenever I am getting the run around with a business I email the CEO. You might be surprised how effective it is..Try it out. Regarding my home address... that ship sailed when they started delivering my groceries years ago. I read an article about the Issa brothers once and it was a classic rags to riches tale. It was inspiring.

voluted

Snooper1 said:

voluted said:

Snooper1 said:

Ergates said:

Snooper1 said:
If it was a simple pricing error both scales I used would have used the same wrong price. If you think about the staffed conveyer checkouts, would you expect the same item to scan at different checkouts at different prices? No. You'd expect if the pricing error was simple each checkout would scan at the same wrong price. In that case, a simple rectification could be made in the system to correct it at all checkouts quickly and simultaneously. Different prices in different scales suggests "manual processes" are involved which are prone to error and therefore this sort of error is unlikely to be confined to one scale in one store, one item and one promotion. Had it been rectified on the day who is to say that a busy staff member would have taken the time to convey to a higher up that they needed to identify how many customers (possibly hundreds or thousands) had been overcharged and refund them? 34p for each customer is nothing (for most but a canned meal for some) but having it rectified on the day misses the bigger issue that the supermarket would likely just say "sorry" and keep the money they overcharged prior customers which could be a substantial amount. When banks are found to have overcharged they are eventually forced to refund customers. Why should supermarkets be any different?

You literally describe how it is probably a simple pricing error, right after suggesting it's not one.

Really? There is a lot of daylight between identifying one scale which has the wrong price, particularly if it is online like the others, and where in the system the error occurred to make it solely have the wrong price. Until the point of failure is identified it may not be able to be corrected without a workaround being applied. Doesn't sound that simple to me.

By "simple pricing error" they mean it's just an error with the price rather than a grand conspiracy to pocket £3m a year by overcharging 20% on one specific root vegetable on one specific scale per store.

OK. I'm not suggesting it's a grand conspiracy, but it's hard to accept it would be happening with just one scale and one fresh produce item in one store out of 1,200 and involve just one promo discount. This is my first or second post on this forum.and I am quite surprised how much benefit of the doubt/latitude those who have responded have given to this massive business which should take absolutely seriously any report of any pricing anomaly negatively impacting customers, particularly a hard to detect one where the final.item.price differs based on weight and is meant to be a.promo bit isn't at all.

OK, there's no suggestion they haven't taken it seriously. They may not have responded when you emailed the CEO (why?) but that doesn't mean it wasn't looked into.

There may be other price anomalies, yes, although it's hard to believe they would always go against the customer so in the grand scheme of things it probably evens itself out.

I think you've made a far bigger deal of this than it warrants. A word with a manager in the store would have sufficed. I'm sure they have procedures in place for reporting issues with their systems.

Snooper1

born_again said:

Okell said:

If you think the store manager can't be trusted, what makes you think you can trust the ceo?

Especially one of the brothers who brought the ASDA group using a loan secured against the group...

Lol fair point. I have shopped there for 20 years. I never had any problem when Walmart owned it. Let's hope it's Lord Rose to the rescue. Having said that I read about the Issa brothers' humble start and entrepreneurial  spirit. I found it inspiring. What would you have done to ensure rhe issue is fixed, ppl are refunded where possible.and steps are taken to try and prevent it happening again and from happening in other stores if identifued in other stores? 

oldernonethewiser

Snooper1 said:

oldernonethewiser said:

Snooper1 said:

voluted said:

Snooper1 said:

Ergates said:

Snooper1 said:
If it was a simple pricing error both scales I used would have used the same wrong price. If you think about the staffed conveyer checkouts, would you expect the same item to scan at different checkouts at different prices? No. You'd expect if the pricing error was simple each checkout would scan at the same wrong price. In that case, a simple rectification could be made in the system to correct it at all checkouts quickly and simultaneously. Different prices in different scales suggests "manual processes" are involved which are prone to error and therefore this sort of error is unlikely to be confined to one scale in one store, one item and one promotion. Had it been rectified on the day who is to say that a busy staff member would have taken the time to convey to a higher up that they needed to identify how many customers (possibly hundreds or thousands) had been overcharged and refund them? 34p for each customer is nothing (for most but a canned meal for some) but having it rectified on the day misses the bigger issue that the supermarket would likely just say "sorry" and keep the money they overcharged prior customers which could be a substantial amount. When banks are found to have overcharged they are eventually forced to refund customers. Why should supermarkets be any different?

You literally describe how it is probably a simple pricing error, right after suggesting it's not one.

Really? There is a lot of daylight between identifying one scale which has the wrong price, particularly if it is online like the others, and where in the system the error occurred to make it solely have the wrong price. Until the point of failure is identified it may not be able to be corrected without a workaround being applied. Doesn't sound that simple to me.

By "simple pricing error" they mean it's just an error with the price rather than a grand conspiracy to pocket £3m a year by overcharging 20% on one specific root vegetable on one specific scale per store.

OK. I'm not suggesting it's a grand conspiracy, but it's hard to accept it would be happening with just one scale and one fresh produce item in one store out of 1,200 and involve just one promo discount. This is my first or second post on this forum.and I am quite surprised how much benefit of the doubt/latitude those who have responded have given to this massive business which should take absolutely seriously any report of any pricing anomaly negatively impacting customers, particularly a hard to detect one where the final.item.price differs based on weight and is meant to be a.promo bit isn't at all.

Not that hard.

To confirm you emailed Asda CEO, or attempted to, but didn't point out the error to anyone in the store at the time?

Is so you are complicit in allowing this massive fraud to go unchecked.  How many more must suffer?

Won't anything think of the children?

Based on that logic, had I pointed.it out to a staff member who then took that scale out of service, if that person did not notify management that this problem might be found in other stores (given statistical.probability) I would be complicit for what's potentially going on in other stores by not contacting ASDA executive management.

Your logic is flawed

You discover a problem in one store.

You report it there and then the scales get fixed or taken out of service.

The staff member then informs their superior who passes a communication to Head Office to let them know so they can check if this is an issue with any other stores and if so get it rectified.

By informing staff at the store you were in, you have dealt with your problem and everything after that is wild speculation on your part.

Sledghammer to crack a nut.

Snooper1

oldernonethewiser said:

Snooper1 said:

oldernonethewiser said:

Snooper1 said:

voluted said:

Snooper1 said:

Ergates said:

Snooper1 said:
If it was a simple pricing error both scales I used would have used the same wrong price. If you think about the staffed conveyer checkouts, would you expect the same item to scan at different checkouts at different prices? No. You'd expect if the pricing error was simple each checkout would scan at the same wrong price. In that case, a simple rectification could be made in the system to correct it at all checkouts quickly and simultaneously. Different prices in different scales suggests "manual processes" are involved which are prone to error and therefore this sort of error is unlikely to be confined to one scale in one store, one item and one promotion. Had it been rectified on the day who is to say that a busy staff member would have taken the time to convey to a higher up that they needed to identify how many customers (possibly hundreds or thousands) had been overcharged and refund them? 34p for each customer is nothing (for most but a canned meal for some) but having it rectified on the day misses the bigger issue that the supermarket would likely just say "sorry" and keep the money they overcharged prior customers which could be a substantial amount. When banks are found to have overcharged they are eventually forced to refund customers. Why should supermarkets be any different?

You literally describe how it is probably a simple pricing error, right after suggesting it's not one.

Really? There is a lot of daylight between identifying one scale which has the wrong price, particularly if it is online like the others, and where in the system the error occurred to make it solely have the wrong price. Until the point of failure is identified it may not be able to be corrected without a workaround being applied. Doesn't sound that simple to me.

By "simple pricing error" they mean it's just an error with the price rather than a grand conspiracy to pocket £3m a year by overcharging 20% on one specific root vegetable on one specific scale per store.

OK. I'm not suggesting it's a grand conspiracy, but it's hard to accept it would be happening with just one scale and one fresh produce item in one store out of 1,200 and involve just one promo discount. This is my first or second post on this forum.and I am quite surprised how much benefit of the doubt/latitude those who have responded have given to this massive business which should take absolutely seriously any report of any pricing anomaly negatively impacting customers, particularly a hard to detect one where the final.item.price differs based on weight and is meant to be a.promo bit isn't at all.

Not that hard.

To confirm you emailed Asda CEO, or attempted to, but didn't point out the error to anyone in the store at the time?

Is so you are complicit in allowing this massive fraud to go unchecked.  How many more must suffer?

Won't anything think of the children?

Based on that logic, had I pointed.it out to a staff member who then took that scale out of service, if that person did not notify management that this problem might be found in other stores (given statistical.probability) I would be complicit for what's potentially going on in other stores by not contacting ASDA executive management.

Your logic is flawed

You discover a problem in one store.

You report it there and then the scales get fixed or taken out of service.

The staff member then informs their superior who passes a communication to Head Office to let them know so they can check if this is an issue with any other stores and if so get it rectified.

By informing staff at the store you were in, you have dealt with your problem and everything after that is wild speculation on your part.

Sledghammer to crack a nut.

"The staff member then informs their superior who passes a communication to Head Office to let them know so they can check if this is an issue with any other stores and if so get it rectified."

This requires strict adherence to a chain of responsibility/escalation process where any breakdown in it would mean the desired outcome is thwarted. If there was an obligation on me, no one informed me ahead of time of my obligation to raise this issue in store first with a staff member. What if I didn't have the time then?  I chose to take a sledgehammer to what in effect is the executive support team. So be it. I was obviously well intentioned and I can't see how a fine analysis of how I might have done it differently is helping the customer from experiencing this problem again.

Okell

Snooper1 said:

Okell said:

Snooper1 said:

Okell said:

Snooper1 said:

powerful_Rogue said:

Snooper1 said:

At a large national supermarket chain which i will not currently name as I have approached Trading Standards, the scale i used near the fresh produce area used an incorrect price for the item. The item was showing as discounted but the discount was not programmed into the scale I used so it issued a sticky label at the standard price: 20% higher. More concerningly, a differnent scale located in another part of rhe store did use the correct pricing information meaning the two scales I was using were not accessing the same central pricing information. If just 20 of this root vegetable were purchased every day in every store nationally the rip off is more than £8,000 per day or nearly a quarter of a million if the price promotion runs for a month. A nice earner for the supermarket indeed. Imagine if it is happening across multiple fresh produce lines? Check the scale you use issues a pricing sticker which has the promotional price £/kg. 

What did the store say when you highlighted the issue?

I emailed non - executive director Zuber Issa at ceo@asda.co.uk on 8 November. I've not yet had a response. I since learned Mr Issa stepped down from his role on 5 November but I do expect a response to the email in any event as it is the executive team which responded to a previous complaint I sent to that email address.

Didn't you point it out to staff instore?

I noticed yesterday in my local Waitrose that they had a product recall notice up against the wrong product.  Yes it was a similar product but it wasn't the one being recalled.

I pointed the error out to staff instore.  I wouldn't think of emailing the ceo

Maybe you would have thought of emailing the CEO if the recall was because of the presence of an undeclared allergen and due to similariy of the products the error those Waitrose staff in your local store made could likely be made by staff in hundreds of other stores potentially leaving the dangerous product on the shelves and consumed by those for whom it might be fatal.

If that were the case I would have insisted on speaking to the store manager on the spot - not just alerting a member of staff to the problem.

If you think the store manager can't be trusted, what makes you think you can trust the ceo?

If it's just the tip of some company wide criminal conspiracy I doubt they'll let your email stop them.  Hope you didn't give them your address...

I didn't say the store manager cannot be trusted. It's about whether that person has the competencies or the time in a busy store to find a way to alert all.other store managers in the UK to the potential risk of.recalling the wrong product. Whenever I am getting the run around with a business I email the CEO. You might be surprised how effective it is..Try it out. Regarding my home address... that ship sailed when they started delivering my groceries years ago. I read an article about the Issa brothers once and it was a classic rags to riches tale. It was inspiring.

Seems to me that you've gone about this in the worst way you could.

Pointing the error out to staff instore and emailing the executive team are not mutually exclusive.

You could easily have raised it instore and got the defective scales put out of use.  That would immediately have prevented more customers overpaying.

You could also have asked the store manager to make sure that ASDA head office was made aware of the problem.  As other posters have said I have no doubt that Asda have a process for local stores to feed information back to head office to be acted upon.

You could also have emailed the executive team if you were concerned that the local manager would do nothing.  But what do you expect the executive team to do?  They might alert other stores to what might be a potential problem, or they might not.  Even if they tell you they've put steps in place to prevent this, why would you believe them?

More likely they'll just come back to you and say that it was a one-off pricing error and nothing to worry about

And do you really expect ASDA head office to track down people who have overpaid and refund them?  It won't happen.

You've also pointlessly delayed getting the inaccurate scales decommissioned by thinking Trading Standards would be interested and would want to carry out some covert testing rather than you reporting it instore immediately.

Ergates

Snooper1 said:
OK. I'm not suggesting it's a grand conspiracy, but it's hard to accept it would be happening with just one scale and one fresh produce item in one store out of 1,200 and involve just one promo discount.

So... you kind of are suggesting it's some kind of conspiracy then.

Why is it hard to accept that someone somewhere made a minor error when carrying out their duties at work?  Have you never made a mistake?

Snooper1 said:
I am quite surprised how much benefit of the doubt/latitude those who have responded have given to this massive business which should take absolutely seriously any report of any pricing anomaly negatively impacting customers, particularly a hard to detect one where the final.item.price differs based on weight and is meant to be a.promo bit isn't at all.

People are reacting to your *absurd* overreaction to what is, by any reasonable measure, a very minor issue.

You were overcharged, by a small amount, for some vegetables due to an error on one of their scales.  That's it.  If you'd raised it to a member of staff at the time, they would have rectified the issue, and that would have been the end of it.

Instead, you reported it to the CEO and a former director (why?), and to trading standards who you, for some reason, expected to conduct some kind of covert mission to investigate the store.

Snooper1

Okell said:

Snooper1 said:

Okell said:

Snooper1 said:

Okell said:

Snooper1 said:

powerful_Rogue said:

Snooper1 said:

At a large national supermarket chain which i will not currently name as I have approached Trading Standards, the scale i used near the fresh produce area used an incorrect price for the item. The item was showing as discounted but the discount was not programmed into the scale I used so it issued a sticky label at the standard price: 20% higher. More concerningly, a differnent scale located in another part of rhe store did use the correct pricing information meaning the two scales I was using were not accessing the same central pricing information. If just 20 of this root vegetable were purchased every day in every store nationally the rip off is more than £8,000 per day or nearly a quarter of a million if the price promotion runs for a month. A nice earner for the supermarket indeed. Imagine if it is happening across multiple fresh produce lines? Check the scale you use issues a pricing sticker which has the promotional price £/kg. 

What did the store say when you highlighted the issue?

I emailed non - executive director Zuber Issa at ceo@asda.co.uk on 8 November. I've not yet had a response. I since learned Mr Issa stepped down from his role on 5 November but I do expect a response to the email in any event as it is the executive team which responded to a previous complaint I sent to that email address.

Didn't you point it out to staff instore?

I noticed yesterday in my local Waitrose that they had a product recall notice up against the wrong product.  Yes it was a similar product but it wasn't the one being recalled.

I pointed the error out to staff instore.  I wouldn't think of emailing the ceo

Maybe you would have thought of emailing the CEO if the recall was because of the presence of an undeclared allergen and due to similariy of the products the error those Waitrose staff in your local store made could likely be made by staff in hundreds of other stores potentially leaving the dangerous product on the shelves and consumed by those for whom it might be fatal.

If that were the case I would have insisted on speaking to the store manager on the spot - not just alerting a member of staff to the problem.

If you think the store manager can't be trusted, what makes you think you can trust the ceo?

If it's just the tip of some company wide criminal conspiracy I doubt they'll let your email stop them.  Hope you didn't give them your address...

I didn't say the store manager cannot be trusted. It's about whether that person has the competencies or the time in a busy store to find a way to alert all.other store managers in the UK to the potential risk of.recalling the wrong product. Whenever I am getting the run around with a business I email the CEO. You might be surprised how effective it is..Try it out. Regarding my home address... that ship sailed when they started delivering my groceries years ago. I read an article about the Issa brothers once and it was a classic rags to riches tale. It was inspiring.

Seems to me that you've gone about this in the worst way you could.

Pointing the error out to staff instore and emailing the executive team are not mutually exclusive.

You could easily have raised it instore and got the defective scales put out of use.  That would immediately have prevented more customers overpaying.

You could also have asked the store manager to make sure that ASDA head office was made aware of the problem.  As other posters have said I have no doubt that Asda have a process for local stores to feed information back to head office to be acted upon.

You could also have emailed the executive team if you were concerned that the local manager would do nothing.  But what do you expect the executive team to do?  They might alert other stores to what might be a potential problem, or they might not.  Even if they tell you they've put steps in place to prevent this, why would you believe them?

More likely they'll just come back to you and say that it was a one-off pricing error and nothing to worry about

And do you really expect ASDA head office to track down people who have overpaid and refund them?  It won't happen.

You've also pointlessly delayed getting the inaccurate scales decommissioned by thinking Trading Standards would be interested and would want to carry out some covert testing rather than you reporting it instore immediately.

As I wrote in response to another post what if I didn't have time in store like many busy people wouldn't? What if I didn't know the practical limits of any potential Trading Standards intervention ahead of time (which it turns out I didn't). With the benefit of hindsight (and having worked for TS in the past!) and having read other posts you are standing in judgment of me and subjecting my behaviour to a fine analysis and applying what you apparently perceive as a perfect template for how to behave in response to coming across this issue only you never have yourself. The purpose of my original post was simply to make customers aware of an issue with discount prices possibly not being loaded in all scales in the store -.in any store which might allow customers to self weigh. Rather than wild speculation about what might be happening in the 1,200 other stores I was merely trying to.emphaise my point about the mis-pricing and that if it was replicated UK wide the overcharging would be substantial. I have been very discouraged by this interaction and no one (well one to be fair) has acknowledged that I was well meaning. I wasn't out to.destroy my.go to store of 20 years. I feel as though at least some of the responders may be acting on behalf of a supermarket. But that would definitely be wild speculation.