C1 Confirmation form - advice before we submit our form

wisecashcard

Like many other posting on this forum, I have found the advice given to be invaluable! Have been reading through posts on and off for a week to tackle this. My sister is the executor and brought together the figures but we've been working on the form completion together.

Our father passed away in Sep 2024 and left a will with one executor, my sister. The Will states £1000 gift to be made to each of 5 nominated charities. The remainder is divided into 5 parts; 1 part each to his 4 children, 5th part split between 3 grandchildren. His house title deeds in joint names with my late mother who passed away in April 2022, titles includes the survivorship clause.

We have managed to complete most of the form based on the examples in this forum, inventory but just have a few queries before submitting:

1) PAGE 1 - guidance notes show address format to use, with county of "FIFE" in capitals. I am a bit confused with the use of counties, one of the addresses is in Falkirk which historically was part of Stirlingshire, but I'm not sure if that is used any longer. The other county is North Lanarkshire; should I include them both or just use street, town and postcode?

2) PAGE 1 - My father passed away at the main hospital in Larbert which is in of the town of Falkirk. For "place of death" should I use just "Falkirk" or the full address of the hospital?

3) Q21 - I have ticked YES, would that be right as estate is under £325k?

4) Q22 - I have ticked YES, would that be right due to my mothers IHT nil rate band being passed to my father?

5) Do these look correct?

Box 23 - I have used the Gross value, same as Box 11 

Box 24 - I have deducted the funeral expenses, so same Net Value as Box 15

Box 25 - I have deducted the £5000 charity gifts to be made, from Box 24

I'd be so grateful if someone could look over my redacted form and see if I've made any glaring errors before I submit this. (not sure why the i and L letters look weird, looks fine on the printout!)

Thanks again to everyone for all the advice in this forum so far, such a help dealing with this minefield!

buddy9

1. I don’t think that the old county areas are used now for addresses. Seems to be council areas that are used in addresses, if needed. But Falkirk FALKIRK looks odd as would Stirling, STIRLING. For a Falkirk town address I would only put - street, town postcode.

2.Town locations seem to be accepted, so one option is ‘Larbert, Falkirk’

3. Yes

4. This is an excepted estate because the value is less than the excepted estates limit. The transferable NRB is not required (unless the estate value increases above the thresholds).

5 Yes

Some estate agents might be fickle when valuing property. Be mindful of capital gains potential and the ability to assess the house value higher if you think it might have been undervalued.

Introducing spaces between items in the inventory would make it easier to read

On the redacted form, I assume full names have been used.

wisecashcard

buddy9 said:

1. I don’t think that the old county areas are used now for addresses. Seems to be council areas that are used in addresses, if needed. But Falkirk FALKIRK looks odd as would Stirling, STIRLING. For a Falkirk town address I would only put - street, town postcode.

2.Town locations seem to be accepted, so one option is ‘Larbert, Falkirk’

3. Yes

4. This is an excepted estate because the value is less than the excepted estates limit. The transferable NRB is not required (unless the estate value increases above the thresholds).

5 Yes

Some estate agents might be fickle when valuing property. Be mindful of capital gains potential and the ability to assess the house value higher if you think it might have been undervalued.

Introducing spaces between items in the inventory would make it easier to read

On the redacted form, I assume full names have been used.

Thanks for your feedback @buddy9, most appreciated.

Just to confirm, for Q22 is it acceptable to leave it at YES, on the chance that the estate goes over the £325k? Don’t think it will but don’t want to tick the wrong box. 

I do see your point about the estate agent valuation being lower, we do feel it may sell for a bit higher based on other properties in the street, so probably safer for us to adjust the valuation now and add “Value Estimated by Executor” instead of using the estate agents valuation.

I’ll definitely space out the inventory a bit better, had to use a second page anyway so have plenty of space for that. 

Yes full names have been used including Mr or Mrs

Hopefully get this submitted later this week so again, thank for your advice!

Jenna_

@wisecashcard @buddy9 does 22 need filled in if this is an excepted estate? If so what would I put. 

buddy9

Transferable nil rate band is available where there was a predeceased spouse or civil partner and the IHT nil rate band of the first to die was not wholly used up and some is available to transfer. TNRB is normally claimable within 24 months of the month of the second death.

For a simple estate where the gross value of the estate, or the NQV, is below £325,000 TNRB is not needed and no can be ticked on box 22.

Where TNRB is necessary for the estate to be classed as an excepted estate, then the box is ticked yes.

The question from @wisecashcard caused me to think whether ticking yes might be a good option even when TNRB is not needed. I do not know the answer to that.

wisecashcard

buddy9 said:

Transferable nil rate band is available where there was a predeceased spouse or civil partner and the IHT nil rate band of the first to die was not wholly used up and some is available to transfer. TNRB is normally claimable within 24 months of the month of the second death.

For a simple estate where the gross value of the estate, or the NQV, is below £325,000 TNRB is not needed and no can be ticked on box 22.

Where TNRB is necessary for the estate to be classed as an excepted estate, then the box is ticked yes.

The question from @wisecashcard caused me to think whether ticking yes might be a good option even when TNRB is not needed. I do not know the answer to that.

Thought I’d post an update after your help last week - left Q22 as No.

We went to submit at the court today, they checked the form and said we’re close. They pointed out a couple of points about the inventory which need amended, said to put DWP and HMRC refunds under England & Wales, and to combine entries for bank accounts as there was 2 Nationwide which I’d done separately (same for the DWP entries)

They also said the declaration was missing something, couldn’t tell me what though, hoping you can you point me in the right direction for what to use! 

Here’s the wording we had used:

That I am

“the daughter and Executor Nominate of the said deceased conform to his will dated 27/07/2023 which is exhibited herewith, signed and docquetted as relative hereto.”

Also we took in a certified copy of the will but didn’t know we need the original will so will try again next week and hopefully get approved 🤞

buddy9

If there is something missing from para 2 then likely there is a name difference or an address difference from what is stated in the will.

wisecashcard

buddy9 said:

If there is something missing from para 2 then likely there is a name difference or an address difference from what is stated in the will.

As far as I can see all names and addresses on this page are correct as per the will, none have changed since the will was made.

The officer we spoke to at the court was very helpful and marked the parts that needed amended with question marks and gave us some limited guidance about the inventory layout. 

In this declaration page, he put a mark in box 2. and said something was left out but couldn’t say what. I’ve seen some examples that actually name the deceased so will amend to this version:

That I am

“the Executor Nominate of the said deceased John Smith, conform to his will dated the 27th May 2023 herewith exhibited and docquetted and signed by me as relative hereto and that I am the daughter of the said deceased.”

I’m assuming box 3. can be left empty as there is only one executor? 

Fingers crossed we can get it passed on the second visit!

buddy9

The lack of a name is not the issue - unless the clerk has gone rogue. A distinct possibility! Here is an example declaration from an SCTS document (albeit written before there was a need to declare relationship): I am the executor nominate of said deceased conform to will dated ................... which is produced herewith, signed and docquetted as relative hereto.

The second box in para 3 is correctly left empty, as in your C1 above.

Lself

So glad I found this chat.
lost both my dad and my mother in law the same weekend in September 24. I already have probate for my mother in law in England which we did ourselves but am struggling with confirmation for my father.
So the question is they have asked for an 'opinion from an English solicitor re validity of the English will'. They have intimated that it has to be worded in a specific way but will not give guidance. Has anyone else had to do this and would be grateful for any templates 

buddy9

Template here

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4965475/grant-of-confirmation/p59