Rewire just the lighting?

tudorfan39

I live in a 1960’s bungalow, and the lighting is from that time. I haven’t got any problems with my lighting, all work fine but it’s just on my mind that I probably should get them rewired. I think the electrics for the plug sockets have been updated but I’m basing that purely on seeing that the plug sockets are new. So it’s just the lighting I’d like to update. 

My question is, can I just get the lights (plus 2 wall lights) rewired? how much would this roughly cost for a 2 bed bungalow. Also I’d like to know the level of redecorating I’d need to do, would the electrician need to channel out to the light switches in the wall? My loft is clear and we only have 5 rooms that need new lights. I just didn’t want to redecorate my walls for them to need channeling out. 

Many thanks in advance

Albermarle

The fact the plug sockets are new does not tell you anything about the wiring. You need to unscrew one ( with the electric switched off of course) and have a look.
If the wiring is from the 60's, it will most likely be 'modern' PVC coated type. Probably red- black and maybe a bare earth wire( or green) .
If it is and you have no problems, and you have a more recently fitted consumer unit ( rather than an old fuse box) it is unlikely to be dangerous. So a rewire would be ideal, but not urgently necessary.

FreeBear

tudorfan39 said: My question is, can I just get the lights (plus 2 wall lights) rewired? how much would this roughly cost for a 2 bed bungalow. Also I’d like to know the level of redecorating I’d need to do, would the electrician need to channel out to the light switches in the wall? My loft is clear and we only have 5 rooms that need new lights. I just didn’t want to redecorate my walls for them to need channeling out.

Rewiring the lighting ring isn't overly disruptive as much of the cabling will (should) be clipped to joists in the loft. As long as the cables to the wall lights & switches have been run in conduit, the walls shouldn't need chasing. But if you have surface mounted switches and want to go for flush mounted, this will require some redecoration afterwards. Problems will arise if the original cables have been clipped to the wall, covered with a capping, and then plastered over - In this situation, the walls will need chasing, and it will get messy. A word of warning. Electricians are not plasterers, so if they "make good" the plaster, it might not be an acceptable finish. Having patched a couple of walls myself after chasing in conduit, blending in new plaster to old is not that easy.

tudorfan39

Great, thanks for your answer, really helpful. One electrician was very unwilling to just do the lights but I suspect he was trying to get me to do the whole house. But I will try again with another electrician and he should be able to let me know a bit more about the state of the cables.
thanks again

Green_hopeful

Ok I know nothing about this but I believe you can get light switches that are smart so there is no physical cable between the switch and the light. That would reduce any damage and disruption. 

Ectophile

Whether or not it needs doing may depend on which end of the 1960's it was wired.

Early 60's could be vulcanised rubber insulated, with no earth.  Beware that the insulation may crumble if you pull off a light switch to look behind it.  Rubber insulated cables are best replaced.

Mid 60's onwards could be PVC insulated.  There's still plenty of PVC cable that old that's still in fine condition.  It seems to last forever unless something damages it.  But mid 60's still may have no earth wires, which is a problem if you want to use metal switches or many metal light fittings.  Earth wires in lighting circuits became standard at the end of the 60's.

Albermarle

Ectophile said:

Whether or not it needs doing may depend on which end of the 1960's it was wired.

Early 60's could be vulcanised rubber insulated, with no earth.  Beware that the insulation may crumble if you pull off a light switch to look behind it.  Rubber insulated cables are best replaced.

Mid 60's onwards could be PVC insulated.  There's still plenty of PVC cable that old that's still in fine condition.  It seems to last forever unless something damages it.  But mid 60's still may have no earth wires, which is a problem if you want to use metal switches or many metal light fittings.  Earth wires in lighting circuits became standard at the end of the 60's.

Is it possible that a house wired at that time, could have earth wires to the sockets, but not to the lighting ?

FreeBear

Green_hopeful said:

Ok I know nothing about this but I believe you can get light switches that are smart so there is no physical cable between the switch and the light. That would reduce any damage and disruption. 

Quinetic is one brand. At some £25 for a switch plate, and another £25 for the receiver, it gets very expensive real quick.

Whilst on the subject of smart switches, it is worth specifying 25mm or even 35mm deep back boxes for the switches and having a neutral run to each one (safely terminated of course). This would allow someone to fit "conventional" smart switches if they wanted to with the minimum of effort.

Yes, you can get smart switches that do not require a neutral, but they can cause lights to flicker and don't always work with LED bulbs.

tudorfan39

Ectophile said:

Whether or not it needs doing may depend on which end of the 1960's it was wired.

Early 60's could be vulcanised rubber insulated, with no earth.  Beware that the insulation may crumble if you pull off a light switch to look behind it.  Rubber insulated cables are best replaced.

Mid 60's onwards could be PVC insulated.  There's still plenty of PVC cable that old that's still in fine condition.  It seems to last forever unless something damages it.  But mid 60's still may have no earth wires, which is a problem if you want to use metal switches or many metal light fittings.  Earth wires in lighting circuits became standard at the end of the 60's.

I’ve seen the wires and I’m pretty sure they’re pvc coated, not vulcanised. The pics of vulcanised rubber look very different to what I see on my wiring. Though there is no earth in the lights, so it’s old but not anything to worry about in the mean time. 

It’s more that my light switches have been wallpapered around and that’s a pain to redo, plus I didn’t know if this would be something an electrician would take on. I know in an ideal world I’d get the whole lot updated, but there’s nothing wrong with the electrics, bar wanting a few more sockets (2 sockets per room was the norm it seems in the 1960’s!)

Risteard

tudorfan39 said:

but there’s nothing wrong with the electrics, bar wanting a few more sockets (2 sockets per room was the norm it seems in the 1960’s!)

How can you possibly know that? Your first step should probably be periodic inspection and testing of the electrical installation, upon which an Electrical Installation Condition Report will be issued. It may be the case that far more than the lighting is problematic.

ThisIsWeird

Hi Tudor fan.
I'd suggest the first step is to figure out if this work is actually required! 
If you are ok with unscrewing a switch plate, pulling it gently out, and taking some clear photos of the cabling, that would be a good start. But only do this if you are happy to.
Ditto with the sockets - unscrew, prise away making sure the wallpaper ain't stuck to it, and some clear photos.
POWER OFF ON EACH CIRCUIT FIRST.
Report back 
And/or, take photos of what you see in the loft - the cables, and junction boxes, etc. Also, follow a light switch cable until it disappears down into a room, and see if there's visible conduit.
Or, get a couple more quotes, but make sure you ask the relevant Q's this time;
1) are my light switch wires run in conduit? (Easy for them to check)
2) what type of cable is used? PVC? Single-core or multi-strand?
3) are there earth wires to the light switches?
4) are there earth wires to the light fittings?
5) anything else anyone can think of...
Tudorfan, are you aware of the 'Smart' light switches folk have been referring to? There are different types, but in essence it means that the actual light switches do not need to be 'wired', so can be stuck anywhere on your wall (following regs for accessibility and stuff, of course). A bit like your TV remote control, they have receivers fitted near the light fittings and communicate without wires. A new lighting circuit rewire would then be the simplest of 'rings' supplying just the fittings.
Yes, more costly than normal switches, but big savings to be had on channeling and redecorating. Also some can be App-Smart, if that's your thing; "Alexa, turn off sitting room ceiling light, and turn on the wall lights... " sort of stuff. Or just select them on your phone.
But, first thing, do you need a rewire? Or, if your CU is also original, would a better move be to upgrade that to RCBO type for better protection to individual circuits? Almost certainly cheaper too. 
(If you consider that option, then future-proof for things like ASHPs and car chargers.)