CPM parking charge at cystal palace park

cochetqueen1985

Hi everyone,
I'm new to this but just wanted some advise really, Crystal Palace park has started charging for parking. the only notice for this is on the top car park at crystal palace park road entrance. I was using an old abandoned car park to teach my son how to drive? there is absolutely NO signage anywhere in the park or on the way to the old car park stating that you need to pay on any of the other smaller car parks? the only sign in this particular car park is to tell you when  the park is due to close? the fine is £60.00 pounds i have raised an appeal with them which i know i will not win!! but dont see how they can charge if there are NO signs at all anywhere along the park especially around the other car parks?
any advise welcome thank you 

LDast

Which entrance/car park? This is the notice of the "material change":





For what it's worth, this is a suggested appeal for a PCN from the same location:

Formal Appeal Against Parking Charge Notice (PCN No. [Insert PCN Number])

This is an appeal by the Registered Keeper for the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) issued to vehicle [Vehicle Registration Number]. The PCN has been issued unfairly because of the following reasons:

1. Inadequate Signage and Breach of the Single Code of Practice (SCoP)

The signage at the site is inadequate and fails to comply with the Single Code of Practice (October 2024) section 3.4. The only sign is attached to a gate, positioned below windscreen height, parallel to the direction of travel, and features text in a tiny font, making it impossible for drivers to see or read the terms upon entering the car park.

The relevant section of the SCoP (October 2024) states:

"3.4. Material changes – notices

Where there is any material change to any pre-existing terms and conditions that would not be immediately apparent to a driver entering controlled land that is or has been open for public parking, the parking operator must place additional (temporary) notices at the site entrance for a period of not less than 4 months from the date of the change making it clear that new terms and conditions/charges apply, such that regular visitors who might be familiar with the old terms do not inadvertently incur parking charges.

NOTE: Examples of material changes can include introduction of parking enforcement where none has previously applied, introduction of time-limited free parking, or reductions in the time limit within which free parking is available. Given the need to avoid confusion and clutter at entrances the test is whether the fact that a change has been made is clearly signalled to drivers on entering the land and the nature of the change is clearly displayed thereafter – it may also be necessary to install repeater notices depending on the scale of the premises."

The signage at the site fails to meet these requirements, as no clear entrance sign was present to alert the driver of the changes, and there were no repeater signs displaying the new terms within the premises. As a result, no contract was formed between the driver and UK-CPM.

2. Non-Compliance with the Protection of Freedoms Act (PoFA) 2012

The Notice to Keeper fails to meet the requirements of Paragraph 9(2)(e)(i) of Schedule 4 of PoFA 2012, as it does not invite the registered keeper to pay the parking charge. Without full compliance with PoFA, the registered keeper cannot be held liable for this charge.

3. Lack of Proof of Driver Identity

As the registered keeper, I am under no obligation to identify the driver to an unregulated private parking company. It is the operator's responsibility to provide sufficient evidence that the keeper and the driver are the same individual. No such evidence has been provided, and therefore, as no inference or assumptions can be made, liability cannot be transferred to the keeper.

In light of these significant failings, I request that this Parking Charge Notice be cancelled immediately.

cochetqueen1985

Hi thanks for this yes this is the entrance but not the carpark i was using the car park i was teaching my son to drive is on the Terrace straight & paxton it's the car park you can see when you walk by the sports centre before you get to the monument before the steps on the left No signage at all

cochetqueen1985

But i will do as you have very kindly suggested i have already lodged an appeal do you think i would be able to submit another?

LDast

You can't appeal again to CPM and as they are in the IPC, it's not worth even wasting our time to try and appeal to the IPC. What did you admit to in your initial appeal?

cochetqueen1985

i just stated that there was no signage at all only 1 at the top of the car park on the crystal palace park road entrance.
and none on the road leading to the car park i was using nor in the actual car park?

cochetqueen1985

or anywhere at all along the road nor as you pull in along the main road to alert you of parking charges

LDast

As the new Single Code of Practice has just come out, you could try an appeal to the IAS, just in case they are trying to make changes, especially as the 4 months minimum period to notify users of the car park is still in effect. However, don't hold your breath for a positive outcome of that.

The most likely outcome is going to be after they issue a claim and it is defended and then, eventually discontinued.

Coupon-mad

There must be UKCPM signs. If not, go and take photos of the car park and entrance as proof because without contractual signs, this would be winnable (if the IAS joke 'adjudicator' isn't on the vino).

cochetqueen1985

Hi Both thank you very much for this i asked my partner to take a photo this morning while walking the dog but will defiantly take more so that this can be sorted!! ( i hope)

LDast

Coupon-mad said:

There must be UKCPM signs. If not, go and take photos of the car park and entrance as proof because without contractual signs, this would be winnable (if the IAS joke 'adjudicator' isn't on the vino).

I'm dealing with an identical issue for the location and there are no signs apart from the one on the gate, which is in tiny font and parallel to the direction of travel below the drivers eye height. All the other signs are as below with no mention of new terms and conditions apply: