Parkingeye PCN in residential flats car park

BigJobsworth

Received a PCN in August 2024 for a breach of terms (assumed) in a Parkingeye-managed car park for a bunch of flats.

Incident details:

• Alleged breach of terms: a parking charge is now payable because “By either not purchasing a valid pay and display ticket, by remaining at the car park longer than permitted, or by not entering your registration details via the terminal, in accordance with the terms and conditions set out in the signage…”

• No visible signage, payment machines, line markings, or poles indicating restrictions.

• PCN mentions a terminal at reception for registration (likely for visitor exemption), but the driver didn’t enter the building, just waited outside.

• The vehicle is used by multiple drivers, some with a blue badge, and the driver hasn't been identified.

Actions so far (as per the newbies thread):

• In an effort to resolve the issue, there was an attempt to contact the landowner, but only the estate agent managing the flats was reached. They, however, were unable to assist, as their involvement is limited to instances of machine failure where proof is provided. The matter remains under discussion.

• Estate agent seemed to suggest the only options are to enter registration at the terminal at reception or not park, there are no payment options - clarity is currently being sought to confirm this.

• Appealed to Parkingeye as per the forum's newbie guide.

• Parkingeye requested driver identification and put the appeal on hold for 28-29 days.

• Based on the examples in this forum, the PCN seems to be POFA compliant.

The 28-29 days are almost up. What would be the next steps?

Gr1pr

Stopping is not parking, so how long was the vehicle on that private property. ?  The PCN will tell you 

Lets see pictures of the signage 

Car1980

Appealing was probably not a good idea because their reasoning is confused and you'll probably just help them by making their case for them.
They can't just make a list of possible reasons for a contractual breach and say "take your pick." 

Just file away all your evidence and photos and ignore them. By all means use the estate agents as a way of collecting paperwork to demonstrate confusion.

Would be surprised if they eventually tried court after the usual barrage of debt collection letters (just ignore) because they can't state the reasons for the breach, and the original PCN would undermine whatever they put on the particulars. Was the ticket hand written or something?

Coupon-mad

Wait for the rejection letter then try POPLA with photo evidence that there is nothing a driver could have seen outside to inform them that they had to go inside the premises to key in their VRM.  Also take photos of how hidden that keypad indoors is because those will help you defend it later (if POPLA appeal fails).

Show us the pics you gather.  Mainly painting a picture of no visible notices, whole areas with no sign.

Take just one close up of the t&cs sign

And some distance photos of the keypad area proving no arrows or signs prominently pointing to it.

BigJobsworth

Gr1pr said:

Stopping is not parking, so how long was the vehicle on that private property. ?  The PCN will tell you 

Lets see pictures of the signage 

PCN alleges 29 mins. 

After a subsequent visit, pictures (links expire after 7 days) of the signage below. Pictures are sequenced to show an entrance, some parking bays without any obvious signage, and then exit:

• postimg.cc/k2RWmVT8
• postimg.cc/sG2Z01BM
• postimg.cc/t7RPgvr9
• postimg.cc/8syvfd3M
• postimg.cc/vccVrgFj
• postimg.cc/rK3tQVqp

Car1980 said:

Appealing was probably not a good idea because their reasoning is confused and you'll probably just help them by making their case for them.
They can't just make a list of possible reasons for a contractual breach and say "take your pick." 

Just file away all your evidence and photos and ignore them. By all means use the estate agents as a way of collecting paperwork to demonstrate confusion.

Would be surprised if they eventually tried court after the usual barrage of debt collection letters (just ignore) because they can't state the reasons for the breach, and the original PCN would undermine whatever they put on the particulars. Was the ticket hand written or something?

The appeal was made, given the templated response given in the newbies thread. Was this not correct?

Coupon-mad said:

Wait for the rejection letter then try POPLA with photo evidence that there is nothing a driver could have seen outside to inform them that they had to go inside the premises to key in their VRM.  Also take photos of how hidden that keypad indoors is because those will help you defend it later (if POPLA appeal fails).

Show us the pics you gather.  Mainly painting a picture of no visible notices, whole areas with no sign.

Take just one close up of the t&cs sign

And some distance photos of the keypad area proving no arrows or signs prominently pointing to it.

Good point about the terminal photos—those will be gathered. Pictures haven't been taken yet because it was only recently confirmed, through the estate agent/property management company, that a terminal for registering car details existed.

Photos of the entrance, various parking bays, and the exit route have been shared above. Signage was only noticed during the visit conducted to gather information. Some images were specifically taken to make the signage more visible than it would typically be when driving through for the first time. The signage is barely noticeable without a thorough review of the photos and would have been even harder to detect at the time of the alleged offence, due to its small font and the potential obstructions from exiting traffic, particularly around school hours. From a distance, the symbols used on the signs, such as the Highway Code parking symbol, seem to suggest a legitimate parking area with no obvious restrictions. Additionally, the signage is only posted on one side of the road when entering the complex, which could lead to the assumption that it only applies to that side, not the other.

As per all your guidance, the following steps will now be taken:

1. Gather additional evidence, including photos of the registration terminal.
2. Await the rejection letter.

Thank you all for your continued support. Any savings from avoiding payment to this predatory company will be donated to charity, ensuring no financial strain on the donor. Keep up the good fight.

Gr1pr

29 minutes is a long time to be "stopped", as opposed to "parking", so harder to explain 

Signage issues are probably the key points here, so follow the advice above 

BigJobsworth

Posting this here to keep this thread updated. Hopefully it is useful to someone in the future.

Recap:

• As per the first post in this thread: Appeal lodged early sept, around mid sept parking eye asked for driver details in 28 days.

Updates:

• Mid October, the estate agent managing the flats confirmed there are no options to pay for parking. A terminal/tablet is present apparently for visitors to enter their registration.
• Around 20th Oct Parking Eye emailed the response below. This was not seen until recently since it ended up in SPAM. Should they be sending a letter to the registered keeper too?

---

Dear Sir / Madam,

We are writing in relation to the Parking Charge incurred on XXXXXXXX at XX:XX, at

XXXX, XXXX car park.

Parkingeye have previously requested further evidence in response to the appeal that

was submitted and provided 28 days for this to be sent to us. The 28-day period has now

passed, and we are not in receipt of any further correspondence or evidence to confirm

that the terms were not breached.

Parkingeye are a member of the British Parking Association and can confirm that there is

adequate signage outlining the terms and conditions at this site.

We are writing to advise you that your appeal has been unsuccessful and that you have

now reached the end of our internal appeals procedure.

If you wish to have your case independently assessed, please be advised, there is an

independent appeals service (POPLA) which is available to motorists who have had an

appeal rejected by a British Parking Association Approved Operator. Contact information

and further information can be found enclosed. See also www.popla.co.uk

By law we are also required to inform you that Ombudsman Services (www.ombudsman-

services.org/) provides an alternative dispute resolution service that would be competent

to deal with your appeal. However, we have not chosen to participate in their alternative

dispute resolution service. As such should you wish to appeal then you must do so to

POPLA, as explained above.

Please note, if the Parking Charge was issued in Scotland/Northern Ireland, only the

driver can appeal to POPLA (Parking on Private Land Appeals).

As a gesture of goodwill, we have extended the discount period for a further 14 days from

the date of this correspondence. If you appeal to POPLA, you will not be able to pay the

discounted amount in settlement of the Parking Charge, and the full value of the charge

will be outstanding. In addition, if your appeal to POPLA is unsuccessful, you will no

longer be able to pay the discounted amount and the full value of the charge will be due.

A payment can be made by telephoning 0330 555 4444, by visiting

www.parkingeye.co.uk/payments or alternatively by posting a cheque/postal order to

Parkingeye Ltd, PO Box 117, Blyth, NE24 9EJ. Please ensure you write your reference

number on the reverse of any cheque/postal order so the payment can be allocated.

If you have received this correspondence via email, please allow 24 hours for our

systems to reflect the discounted value before making a payment via our automated

payment line or website.

Yours faithfully,

Parkingeye Team
---

My next steps are now as per the guidance provided previously:

Coupon-mad said:

Wait for the rejection letter then try POPLA with photo evidence that there is nothing a driver could have seen outside to inform them that they had to go inside the premises to key in their VRM.  Also take photos of how hidden that keypad indoors is because those will help you defend it later (if POPLA appeal fails).

Show us the pics you gather.  Mainly painting a picture of no visible notices, whole areas with no sign.

Take just one close up of the t&cs sign

And some distance photos of the keypad area proving no arrows or signs prominently pointing to it.

Coupon-mad

• Should they be sending a letter to the registered keeper too?

No.

BigJobsworth

A POPLA appeal, based on the advice in the forum, was drafted and submitted. Not sure the draft composed was very good (This is a comment on the author of the draft's ability NOT a slight on the advice given in this forum). The copy is provided below with bits redacted for privacy:

• shareallfiles.net/6eGmAi

POPLA response from operator:

• shareallfiles.net/x0m1s9

Notes:

1. Sorry you'll need to copy and paste the links above into your browser as I don't have the ability to post links yet
2. Files will be deleted in 30 days.

What would be the next step?

Coupon-mad

Can't see the links.  If it's just that they are at POPLA Comments stage then that is covered in the NEWBIES thread third post.

No need to overthink it as most cases are lost at POPLA. You won't be paying.

BigJobsworth

@Coupon-mad, the POPLA appeal was unsuccessful.

The next step, in line with the guidance from the NEWBIES thread (third post), is as follows:

• Debt collection letters should be handled according to the instructions in the fourth post of the NEWBIES thread.
• If ParkingEye initiates court proceedings, the process outlined in the second post of the NEWBIES thread should be followed.