Downstairs toilet

LOU40

My downstairs toilet has always been freezing cold as there is no heating in there but since the council put new windows and front and back doors in  two years ago it is even colder. The last winter the walls and floor were always soaking wet and this week it has started again. The council just keep telling me to ventilate. I don't know what else to do

FreeBear

New doors & windows shouldn't be making rooms colder. If anything, new windows will perform better and help to keep the space warm. But attention to detail is everything. If they have been badly fitted and there are cold draughts around the frames, you'd have been better off with the old windows.

If you can get hold of a thermal imaging camera, it would quickly identify where the heat is disappearing to. In some parts of the country, councils & charities offer free hire of thermal cameras. Failing that, I'd be pestering the housing department to come out and do a thermal survey. Use local councilors if needs be to put pressure on the right people, and don't take "no" for an answer.

LOU40

Kitchen and downstairs toilet have always been freezing but the toilet is worse since having new windows, doors and roof. There should not be puddles of water on the floor and condensation on the toilet and walls. Me and some neighbours have had mould on bedroom ceilings since having new windows and roof. Never had a problem with mould before. All the council keep saying is ventilate more

FreeBear

LOU40 said: Me and some neighbours have had mould on bedroom ceilings since having new windows and roof. Never had a problem with mould before. All the council keep saying is ventilate more

The housing authority have a statutory duty to protect tenants from mould. For a brief overview, see https://england.shelter.org.uk/professional_resources/news_and_updates/awaabs_law_upcoming_changes_to_the_law_on_damp_and_mould

Whilst adequate ventilation helps to control mould, it doesn't help if the property is cold and difficult to heat properly. Bang a few heads by getting your local councilors involved, and if that doesn't work, complain to your MP - Make them work for your vote.

It might also help for you to club together with your neighbours and get some thermographic surveys done on a sample of properties. It will cost a few pounds, but at least you will have hard data to slap on someone's desk and perhaps get some effective resolution.

LOU40

I think that the problem is it's a cold house anyway. Had an Epc done in December and was given a D rating. It said cavity insulation was poor and the new windows were average. Can't even use an extraction fan in my kitchen, when your boiling water for pasta or veg and turn the fan on the whole room is covered in steam and you can't see and we have to wipe down all the walls after, if we open the windows instead of using fan it's better. Think something has gone very wrong with the houses since having work done

FreeBear

LOU40 said:

I think that the problem is it's a cold house anyway. Had an Epc done in December and was given a D rating. It said cavity insulation was poor and the new windows were average.

Building Regulations changed back in June 2022 and required better performance from replacement doors & windows. If yours were changed after this date, I would have expected them to have been rated excellent in an EPC. But these EPCs are based on assumptions & opinions so need to be taken with a large dose of salt.

That said, having a D rating gives you ammunition to pressure the HA to make improvements to the property.

ian1246

Buy a dehumidifier. They are fantastic for drying clothes indoors - far cheaper to run than tumble driers & don't ruin the clothes. I paid £180 for mine and it ll dry 2 airers if washing overnight (I'll set it to 40% humidity in the spare room & it ll smart-control itself).

You have to understand that condensation can only appear where there is high humidity in the air. No humidity = no condensation. The wet on your walls is condensation - where when the temperature drops, your walls become colder & the humidity therefore touches the cold surface and condenses into water, causing the wet patches.

The council are correct that it is a ventilation issue. If your old windows were poorly fitted it would have meant your property was well ventilated from drafts - the newer windows & doors if better fitted mean there is now less ventilation (less inflow of fresh air), hence the moisture build up throughout your house & subsequent condensation issues on walls/windows. Your whole house sounds like it is very humid.

In addition, air with high moisture content is far harder & takes much longer to heat, so even putting your heating on may mean the rooms subsequently feel cooler than before & will cost you far more ££ to heat.

Better ventilation is the solution - a dehumidifier will be fantastically useful for drying your clothes & can also be used to get the humidity levels down. Aim for at a bate minimum a 12-litre extraction rate, ideally 20 or 25 litre (I have a 12litre one & use it predominantly in one room at a time)

Your first step should be to buy a cheap humidity reader (couple of £) & take some readings throughout your house - a healthy humidity range is 40-60%. If its in excess of this, then that is why your experiencing condensation problems.

I suspect a dehumidifier will pay for itself with reduced heating bills!

FreeBear

ian1246 said: Your first step should be to buy a cheap humidity reader (couple of £) & take some readings throughout your house - a healthy humidity range is 40-60%. If its in excess of this, then that is why your experiencing condensation problems.

For something relatively cheap, I'd recommend these -> https://buy.mi.com/uk/item/3204500023 - Shop around and you should be able to find some for under £4 (buy 4 or more). Download the Xaomi app, and you can record the data. Handy if you need to prove a point.

FFHillbilly

LOU40 said:

Kitchen and downstairs toilet have always been freezing but the toilet is worse since having new windows, doors and roof. There should not be puddles of water on the floor and condensation on the toilet and walls. Me and some neighbours have had mould on bedroom ceilings since having new windows and roof. Never had a problem with mould before. All the council keep saying is ventilate more

Why not, the average family of four living in a 3 bedroom house can produce over 60 litres of moisture per week from just breathing, cooking, showering and boiling the kettle. if this isn't going anywhere and there are cold surfaces, condensation will occur

FreeBear said:

LOU40 said:

I think that the problem is it's a cold house anyway. Had an Epc done in December and was given a D rating. It said cavity insulation was poor and the new windows were average.

Building Regulations changed back in June 2022 and required better performance from replacement doors & windows. If yours were changed after this date, I would have expected them to have been rated excellent in an EPC. But these EPCs are based on assumptions & opinions so need to be taken with a large dose of salt.

That said, having a D rating gives you ammunition to pressure the HA to make improvements to the property.

minimum standard is E right now so I don't think it will bother them

ian1246 said:

Buy a dehumidifier. They are fantastic for drying clothes indoors - far cheaper to run than tumble driers & don't ruin the clothes. I paid £180 for mine and it ll dry 2 airers if washing overnight (I'll set it to 40% humidity in the spare room & it ll smart-control itself).

A heat pump tumble drier would be better, it's essentially a dehumidifier type tumble drier. I wouldn't recommend drying clothes indoors

two good suggestions from Freebear and Ian, get some thermal imaging done and use a humidity meter to find out whats going on

LOU40

I don't dry washing in the house. I have a dryer in the shed. Always open windows in the daytime. Already have a humidity reader, never goes below 60, even in the summer. Extraction fans don't work in my kitchen and bathroom, they make the room fill with condensation and had this problem in the kitchen and bathroom with old windows too. 

ian1246

LOU40 said:

I don't dry washing in the house. I have a dryer in the shed. Always open windows in the daytime. Already have a humidity reader, never goes below 60, even in the summer. Extraction fans don't work in my kitchen and bathroom, they make the room fill with condensation and had this problem in the kitchen and bathroom with old windows too. 

If it never goes below 60, your problem is high humidity then. You need a dehumidifier and you need working extraction fans.

Modern windows will only increase the problem of high humidity levels, since they will be more air-tight than older windows, meaning less air getting into your house. If none of the extraction fans are working, every time you cook food or have a bath or shower, you'll be flooding your house with more humidity- and when the temperature drops, that humidity will condense on the coldest items - your windows & any poorly insulated walls or walls in unheated rooms, such as your downstairs toilets.

The problem isn't the windows, it's the humidity level in your house - resolve that, you'll resolve the wet walls.

Remember - wet air = takes longer to heat and therefore it's no wonder your house feels colder.