Electricity meter is still recording units even after I've turned the electricity off at the mains

Chrysalis

I can report here of a similar situation myself, in the end I got a large credit applied to my account, however be warned it was not a full reimbursement.

Bear in mind I might not be remembering things with full accuracy.

So my situation was that I had let estimated readings carry on for around 1 year, which obviously complicated the problem, I then after being prompted by a meter reader at the door, got the key to the meter cupboard from my LL, and supplied the reading to my supplier which was Octopus energy, a photo was taken as well for proof.

So to give you some numbers, I was been billed for an average usage of about 12 kWh a day on the estimated billing.  So that is what I was paying for on the previous 12 months or so.  My account was also around £1000 in credit because the fixed DD was set higher than the bills by Octopus.

When I supplied the reading, this changed it to a much bigger usage (and a guy who works for Octopus who was fighting for me calculated it at close to 30 kWh a day which I agreed with him was nonsensical), so the new bill was obviously based on that reading.

I then had to do something called a creep test which passed, what you have described in this thread is akin to a creep test and it looks like you have failed, in my case I turned the power off on the fuse box, so everything was off in that fuse box.  This stopped the meter from registering usage.

However when I turned power back on, I noticed highly variable usage whilst having a fairly consistent lifestyle in the home.  Some days it would be as low as about 9 kWh, others it exceeded 20.  So I then started measuring all my sockets in use with portable power meters, and eventually did an experiment with only my fridge turned on.  During the fridge experiment, the meter was registering over double the power consumption that the portable meter registered.

At this point I had asked Octopus to arrange a meter validation test to make sure it is working, they tried to scare me off with a fee that I would pay if the meter passed the tests, I agreed to pay this fee if that happened.  However they never actually booked a test, despite multiple requests from myself, they just wouldnt do it.

So like yourself I booked a smart meter swap, I figured at the very least that will get the rid of the old meter I was convinced was faulty.

The day the smart meter installer guy arrived, I explained to him what was going on, he confirmed he only was booked to install the smart meters and nothing else, he advised me that I should compare the new and old readings, and if the smart meter is significantly and consistently lower, that can be evidence for my case, in my opinion this was good advice.

It didnt take long to see that there was a considerable difference, I was getting readings as low as 4 kWh, and the highest I would see would be somewhere between 7-8 kWh, the average was typically around 5-6 kWh.  This was without me changing my lifestyle, for the first couple of months I deliberately didnt change any habits, so I could just have data to compare to the old readings.

So despite this evidence it was still a fight, Octopus meter team were arguing its simply a case of estimated predicting a too low usage, they wouldnt even consider the idea that these huge readings were not sane for a residential flat with 1 resident.  So I did a complaint, and I also requested a dead lock, Octopus refused to provide a dead lock which meant I had to wait for a full period of time for the complaint to time out (If I remember right this was 2 months).  this is a requirement to raise it with the Ombudsman.

After I raised it with the Ombudsman, and they had carried out some internal checks they need to do, within a few days very quickly someone contacted me from Octopus, and she had told me she had already refunded me an amount close to my suggested resolution.  I then agreed to tell the Ombudsman it was resolved with £150 compensation (way less than what they gave me), and then they would credit me a further £150.

Now despite them crediting me nearly 2 grand, I still lost out on slightly less than half of the bill, as the bill immediately chewed up my £1000 credit, and I had started making manual top up payments as I didnt want this to affect my credit file, Octopus never asked me to make these payments and seemed happy to let the balance sit there, but I dont like things like that against my name, so made the payments under duress.  By the time they refunded me, about 40% or so of the balance was cleared by me, and they gave me enough credit to wipe the rest from my balance, plus the £150 on top.

The reason I proposed going halves with Octopus on the bill with the Ombudsman, ultimately the meter was never tested as failed, so my evidence was never conclusive.  I did however raise the point in my claim that Octopus had not taken up my offer to fund a meter test, so ultimately they should bare some responsibility for the bill which is what happened in the end.

I dont know why the suppliers are refusing to do these tests, if you search the forum there is other cases, also reported cases on facebook and reddit.

Interestingly there was a post some time later on MSE about a faulty batch of meters, so I looked at one of the photos I took of my old meter, and it was the same model, and it was outside of its certified operating life, although it wasnt in the confirmed faulty batch.

I hope this post helps and provides motivation.  In the end it turns out the estimated readings were actually too high.  The smart meter program has one really nice benefit in that its a easy way to clear out an old meter you dont trust.  Also for reference that portable meter I used for the fridge test measures slightly higher than what my smart meter reports, so in my opinion was accurate enough.

MeteredOut

Although perhaps regarded as an ok result, I think the post above confirms why I'd still recommend the OP does not accept a simple meter swap. Octopus are (or perhaps were, since their service has reportedly suffered over the past year or so) better than most suppliers with regards to their customer service.

Contrary to what was suggested in that post, I'd say they did not have evidence that old meter was faulty, but thankfully had a supplier willing to work with them. Other suppliers might have refused and then it'd be down to the Energy Ombudsman.

MattMattMattUK

MeteredOut said:

Although perhaps regarded as an ok result, I think the post above confirms why I'd still recommend the OP does not accept a simple meter swap. Octopus are (or perhaps were, since their service has reportedly suffered over the past year or so) a better than most suppliers with regards to their customer service.

Contrary to what was suggested in that post, I'd say they did not have evidence that old meter was faulty, but thankfully had a supplier willing to work with them. Other suppliers might have refused and then it'd be down to the Energy Ombudsman.

From what we have seen on here the Ombudsman would side with evidence, so if they did not have an independent report on the meter they would almost certainly say the energy had to be paid for. 

EssexHebridean

Another vote for not risking the supplier taking at face value the lower use once the meter has been changed.  As Gerry says, they could well decide that it’s simply a good example of how a smart meter can encourage people to cut down! 

@dunstonh also malicious reporting remember - we’ve had various issues with that in the past, although it does seem that the forum team are perhaps a little better at recognising that these days. 

The_Green_Hornet

dunstonh said:

tim_p said:

Gerry1 said:

Sadly, BarelySentientAI has also been banned... 😨

What do you have to do / say to get banned?  Presumably it wasn’t for something said here?

Often, you have to do very little.     The most common reason for banning long term members is that someone targets them to wind them up and eventually they snap with a response and the board bans the long term member for their response whilst the one that did the winding up gets away with it

From what I have observed a member initially gets a temporary ban for a few weeks then they are allowed back and only if they transgress again do they receive a permanent ban.

If some members are easily "wound up" on a social media platform then probably it isn't the best place for them to be. After all, the primary purpose of this forum is to help / share advice and not be argumentative or opinionated.

Spoonie_Turtle

The_Green_Hornet said:

dunstonh said:

tim_p said:

Gerry1 said:

Sadly, BarelySentientAI has also been banned... 😨

What do you have to do / say to get banned?  Presumably it wasn’t for something said here?

Often, you have to do very little.     The most common reason for banning long term members is that someone targets them to wind them up and eventually they snap with a response and the board bans the long term member for their response whilst the one that did the winding up gets away with it

From what I have observed a member initially gets a temporary ban for a few weeks then they are allowed back and only if they transgress again do they receive a permanent ban.

At risk of straying off topic, the times I've seen that happen have been to the actual problem ones who continually troll under the guise of faux innocence, not the knowledgeable long term members.  The latter tend to be there one day as usual, then unexpectedly gone the next.

(Also you may have missed the 'eventually' in the post to which you were responding.  Everyone has their breaking point, even the most mild-mannered.)

MeteredOut

The_Green_Hornet said:

dunstonh said:

tim_p said:

Gerry1 said:

Sadly, BarelySentientAI has also been banned... 😨

What do you have to do / say to get banned?  Presumably it wasn’t for something said here?

Often, you have to do very little.     The most common reason for banning long term members is that someone targets them to wind them up and eventually they snap with a response and the board bans the long term member for their response whilst the one that did the winding up gets away with it

From what I have observed a member initially gets a temporary ban for a few weeks then they are allowed back and only if they transgress again do they receive a permanent ban.

If some members are easily "wound up" on a social media platform then probably it isn't the best place for them to be. After all, the primary purpose of this forum is to help / share advice and not be argumentative or opinionated.

No its not!!!!

Chrysalis

MeteredOut said:

Although perhaps regarded as an ok result, I think the post above confirms why I'd still recommend the OP does not accept a simple meter swap. Octopus are (or perhaps were, since their service has reportedly suffered over the past year or so) better than most suppliers with regards to their customer service.

Contrary to what was suggested in that post, I'd say they did not have evidence that old meter was faulty, but thankfully had a supplier willing to work with them. Other suppliers might have refused and then it'd be down to the Energy Ombudsman.

It is evidence, just not evidence that the industry utilises in their own investigations.  Evidence is evidence, but because the supplier doesnt witness it directly in the form of collecting the evidence themselves it doesnt make it not evidence.

But if a supplier is refusing to do a test what options does the consumer have?  Is there e.g. a independent test company that will do these tests when a consumer orders it and then the supplier accepts the result of that test?  If there is such an option open then this is the way to go.  Otherwise one would keep paying inflated bills until the supplier feels like ordering a meter test.

There is always two sides and you cant just look at it from the industry side.

I would have definitely taken it to court if I had to, and then it would be for the judge to decide what is evidence not the suppliers.

What would help is if you think what I did was wrong, what should have I done? As I had already multiple times asked for the meter to be checked.  If I didnt swap my meter, I could still be here now year's later paying the inflated bills.

FreeBear

MeteredOut said:

The_Green_Hornet said:

dunstonh said:

tim_p said:

Gerry1 said:

Sadly, BarelySentientAI has also been banned... 😨

What do you have to do / say to get banned?  Presumably it wasn’t for something said here?

Often, you have to do very little.     The most common reason for banning long term members is that someone targets them to wind them up and eventually they snap with a response and the board bans the long term member for their response whilst the one that did the winding up gets away with it

From what I have observed a member initially gets a temporary ban for a few weeks then they are allowed back and only if they transgress again do they receive a permanent ban.

If some members are easily "wound up" on a social media platform then probably it isn't the best place for them to be. After all, the primary purpose of this forum is to help / share advice and not be argumentative or opinionated.

No its not!!!!

Yes it is...
Help and advice (along with pictures of cute cats) is what keeps this forum alive.

cannugec5

Chrysalis said: 

MeteredOut said:

Although perhaps regarded as an ok result, I think the post above confirms why I'd still recommend the OP does not accept a simple meter swap. Octopus are (or perhaps were, since their service has reportedly suffered over the past year or so) better than most suppliers with regards to their customer service.

Contrary to what was suggested in that post, I'd say they did not have evidence that old meter was faulty, but thankfully had a supplier willing to work with them. Other suppliers might have refused and then it'd be down to the Energy Ombudsman.

It is evidence, just not evidence that the industry utilises in their own investigations.  Evidence is evidence, but because the supplier doesnt witness it directly in the form of collecting the evidence themselves it doesnt make it not evidence.

But if a supplier is refusing to do a test what options does the consumer have?  Is there e.g. a independent test company that will do these tests when a consumer orders it and then the supplier accepts the result of that test?  If there is such an option open then this is the way to go.  Otherwise one would keep paying inflated bills until the supplier feels like ordering a meter test.

There is always two sides and you cant just look at it from the industry side.

I would have definitely taken it to court if I had to, and then it would be for the judge to decide what is evidence not the suppliers.

What would help is if you think what I did was wrong, what should have I done? As I had already multiple times asked for the meter to be checked.  If I didnt swap my meter, I could still be here now year's later paying the inflated bills.

You have no ‘proof’ that you didn’t change your energy use behaviour after getting the smart meter. 

Just telling a judge that the new meter reduced the bills wouldn’t work in a court. They would want proof or evidence that  the new meter is reading differently to the old meter for the SAME energy usage. 

Only in meter testing conditions would this be proof. 

Even if you had cctv on in your home showing your behaviour- laundry, tv, ironing etc etc they could still not prove that you’d not reduced your usage by change of washing machine temperature etc. Just  saying you hadn’t changed anything is not evidence. 
What you could have done is go to the Ombudsman BEFORE getting a Smart meter and asking for the Ombudsman’s help to insist on the meter test. 

Yes, I accept from other people’s stories that it is a long drawn out process. You have to be persistent. But you will never know how much more of your inflated bills you could have been refunded.