'A Shade Greener' solar panels - does anyone have a contract they can share?

NorthernGuy

I will soon have to sell a relative's house (for care fees), in which they had 'free' solar panels fitted in 2015.  The Deeds were amended to Lease the roof space to 'A Shade Greener' for 25 years.  I am well aware this can really complicate selling, with many mortgage companies unwilling to lend, and have found many worrying stories on this forum about ASG.  Gulp.

Other than giving a little generic info, any enquiry specific to the particular property seems to attract a £180+VAT fee from ASG.  I expect to have to cough-up once a buyer is found and their solicitors gets involved, but for now I would like to know just how restrictive that contract might be.  I'd rather not pay £216 any more times than I have to.

Would anyone be able to share their contract, if of a similar era (2015) and for 'free' solar installs from ASG requiring a 25 year roof space Lease?  I'm trying to help a potential buyer negotiate the mortgage maze at enquiry stage, as their broker wants to see contractual info.  I also have no idea what happens at the end of the 25 years, any info the relative having ever received being now lost.

eddddy

The document you are looking for is the lease between your relative (the landlord/lessor) and ASG (the tenant/lessee)

That lease should be registered with Land Registry, so you should be able to get a copy by either...

• Sending form OC2 to land registry. See: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/official-copies-of-documents-registration-oc2, or..

• Asking a solicitor to download a copy using the Land Registry portal (which might be quicker, if you have a responsive solicitor)

Some mortgage lenders will accept roof leases, if the lease at least meets the "UK Finance/BSA guidance and minimum requirements regarding leases of roof space for fitting photovoltaic (solar) panels"

Here are those minimum requirements:  https://lendershandbook.ukfinance.org.uk/documents/cml-bsa-guidance-and-minimum-requirements-regarding-leases-of-ro/ukf-bsa-guidance-and-minimum-requirements-regarding-leases-of-roof-space-for-fitting-photovoltaic-solar-panels-version-4-5-july-2016-.pdf


To get an idea of which lenders will accept roof leases, take a look at how the lenders have answered 2 questions:

• https://lendershandbook.ukfinance.org.uk/lenders-handbook/englandandwales/question-list/2115/
• https://lendershandbook.ukfinance.org.uk/lenders-handbook/englandandwales/question-list/2114/

Maybe the key questions to ask ASG are:

• Does my relative's lease meet the minimum requirements of UK finance?

• If the lease doesn't comply with the minimum requirements for UK Finance, are you prepared to do a Deed of Variation to make the lease complaint? If so, what fees would you charge?

 

Myci85

We're about to exchange on a house with A Shade Greener solar panels that were installed in 2014. We were worried whether this would cause problems for our mortgage initially, but after doing research I think it is the older leases that seem problematic. Our lease has the clause in it that our lender needed to see, which is basically them agreeing that if the house were to be repossessed, A Shade Greener would remove the solar panels free of charge if leaving them in situ was preventing a sale. 
I know lots of people are iffy about buying houses with these leased solar panels, but as we see it we will gain something from the excess free energy in the daytime, even if we don't get the FIT payments you would get if you owned the panels. 

NorthernGuy

eddddy said:

The document you are looking for is the lease between your relative (the landlord/lessor) and ASG (the tenant/lessee)

That lease should be registered with Land Registry, so you should be able to get a copy by either...

• Sending form OC2 to land registry. See: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/official-copies-of-documents-registration-oc2, or..

• Asking a solicitor to download a copy using the Land Registry portal (which might be quicker, if you have a responsive solicitor)

Some mortgage lenders will accept roof leases, if the lease at least meets the "UK Finance/BSA guidance and minimum requirements regarding leases of roof space for fitting photovoltaic (solar) panels"

Here are those minimum requirements:  https://lendershandbook.ukfinance.org.uk/documents/cml-bsa-guidance-and-minimum-requirements-regarding-leases-of-ro/ukf-bsa-guidance-and-minimum-requirements-regarding-leases-of-roof-space-for-fitting-photovoltaic-solar-panels-version-4-5-july-2016-.pdf


To get an idea of which lenders will accept roof leases, take a look at how the lenders have answered 2 questions:

• https://lendershandbook.ukfinance.org.uk/lenders-handbook/englandandwales/question-list/2115/
• https://lendershandbook.ukfinance.org.uk/lenders-handbook/englandandwales/question-list/2114/

Maybe the key questions to ask ASG are:

• Does my relative's lease meet the minimum requirements of UK finance?

• If the lease doesn't comply with the minimum requirements for UK Finance, are you prepared to do a Deed of Variation to make the lease complaint? If so, what fees would you charge?

 

Hi eddddy - thank you so much for the info, very useful!  I will try the Land Registry as suggested for the Lease details.  I'll pass on the Lender list, very interesting how differently companies respond.  I think from other threads here that ASG will do a Deed of Variation, although the thought of the cost worries me.  In terms of your key questions to ASG, it appears (someone correct me if wrong) that they want £180+VAT to reply to specific questions.  Are they the only people who can answer that UK finance question?

NorthernGuy

Myci85 said:

We're about to exchange on a house with A Shade Greener solar panels that were installed in 2014. We were worried whether this would cause problems for our mortgage initially, but after doing research I think it is the older leases that seem problematic. Our lease has the clause in it that our lender needed to see, which is basically them agreeing that if the house were to be repossessed, A Shade Greener would remove the solar panels free of charge if leaving them in situ was preventing a sale. 
I know lots of people are iffy about buying houses with these leased solar panels, but as we see it we will gain something from the excess free energy in the daytime, even if we don't get the FIT payments you would get if you owned the panels. 

Hi Myci85, I am partly reassured by what you say.  At present I don't know what is in the contract, but I will follow the advice of eddddy and try the Land Registry, these details obviously matter a lot to lenders.  You are right that the free energy is good, with the rider that the system I have doesn't store energy nor pay the homeowner any FIT payments.  While the sun shines, you get free energy.  But that will only be in daytime hours, making sense for my retired relatives who signed up, but less so for a 9 to 5 working couple.  Who pays to temporarily remove the panels if the roof leaks or pigeons nest under the panels is rather important, especially if you are beholden to a company who want £216 just to give you a contract copy which they must have on file.

eddddy

NorthernGuy said:

In terms of your key questions to ASG, it appears (someone correct me if wrong) that they want £180+VAT to reply to specific questions. 

Maybe they'd want a fee for getting your relative's lease out from their filing system and reading it.

But I'd have thought they might answer generic questions like "Do you do lease variations where your leases don't meet UK Finance requirements?" and "How much do you charge for lease variations?" without charging a fee.

NorthernGuy said:

Are they the only people who can answer that UK finance question?

The buyer's solicitor will be representing the buyer's mortgage lender.

So, essentially, the buyer's solicitor will decide whether the lease meets UK Finance requirements - and advise the mortgage lender accordingly.

But it might take some weeks to get a lease variation done, so the benefit of asking ASG in advance is that you can get the process started straight away, rather than waiting until the buyer's solicitor raises the issue.

(In theory, any conveyancing solicitor should be able to read the lease, and give their opinion on whether it complies with UK Finance requirements, but I imagine they'd want a fee for doing that. Or you can have a go at reading the lease yourself.)


Of course there's a possibility of a difference of opinion... ASG's opinion might be that the lease meets UK Finance requirements, but the buyer's solicitor's opinion is that it doesn't.

Ultimately, it's the buyer's solicitor's opinion that counts.

And some lenders might have even tougher requirements that the standard UK Finance requirements.

NorthernGuy

eddddy - thanks again, I will ask those two generic questions and see if they are free of charge.  When you say Deed Variations, do you mean a changing of those lease terms, so that they are more favourable to the lender, e.g. no fees to remove panels after the lease expires, for example?  I'm just wondering if the fee charged depends just how much the lender wants ASG to give way on?

Howy99

Hi Eddddy i'm trying to see a copy of my asg lease. ive checked the gov title register and can see in the charges register that there are two entries relating to the solar panels one mentions parts of the land affected set out in the schedule of leases hereto. and the second one mentions th eregistration date and airspace above property as more particularly described in the lease. date of lease term and Lesssee's title followed by YYand a 5 digit number. There is no copy of the lease. so how would I complete the OC2 form which doesn't appear to mention the fee amount can this be done online like viewing the register?  Thanks

shaqattack7

My father in law had these fitted before he died around 2015. He Didn't see any benefit from them and questioned it with ASG just before he got ill. We had issues with the lease during probate.
Have you seen the Telegraph & Mail articles on ASG ? Also One show BBC apparently had an episode on them.
Apparently Ofgem are investigating and I am awaiting a reply from them. 
Just want them off the roof so as to avoid future issues and costs when selling the house.

Matapombos

I'm a few months in, on the purchase of a property that the estate agents said owned the panels. We just discovered they actually dont and they have a lease on the roof for 25 year finishing in 2039.

Anyone has a sort of contract to look into?

Should i be worried?

The rent-roof looks like an awful deal, i can use a bit of energy whilst they work and they get to own the airspace, and if i need to move them i might be incured costs.

this is currently my only concern with the property.

Any advice would be appreciated

Neil49

Matapombos said:

I'm a few months in, on the purchase of a property that the estate agents said owned the panels. We just discovered they actually dont and they have a lease on the roof for 25 year finishing in 2039.

Anyone has a sort of contract to look into?

Should i be worried?

The rent-roof looks like an awful deal, i can use a bit of energy whilst they work and they get to own the airspace, and if i need to move them i might be incured costs.

this is currently my only concern with the property.

Any advice would be appreciated

Basically you are taking over a contractual agreement made by an earlier owner with the owner of the panels. If you are unwilling to agree to this contract then I suggest that you do not buy the property.

Removal of the panels would be costly to the property owner (you) as not only would they have to pay for that to be done they would also be liable to pay the panel owning company for loss of earnings (the FIT payment agreed with a power company) possibly right up to the point at which the contract ends. Personally I think this would be the worst option. 

Your other option is to buy the property complete with the panels, make use of the free electricity and leave the panels where they are.