Why do some people think *gratuities* should always be paid?

Mark_d

A number of years ago the Advertising Standards Agency gave advice that non-optional charges should be included in the total cost, or at least made explicit (if memory serves me correctly).  Lots of places, from restaurants to cruise ships, expect people to pay tips - sometimes a significant proportion of the total cost.  I feel this is completely unjustified and downright greedy.

If I choose to pay £25 for a meal, or £2000 for a cruise, that's the amount I've committed to paying because that's what suits my budget.  Why do people think I should offer more if the staff provides service with a smile?

Some people say that the workers get low pay and rely on tips.  That's not my fault.  If/when I want to support people in need - there are plenty of people more in need of money than the workers on cruise ships or in restaurants.

If someone comes to me as a consultant, they pay my agreed fee and that's the end of the matter.  I don't ask for extra pay if people are delighted with the advice I give them.  I give good service and hope people come back to me.  And  likewise I reward good service by offering repeat business.

How do others  feel?

Emmia

I just see the gratuity as a line on the bill, much like a glass of wine or the dessert. I don't tip on top of that.

Grumpy_chap

There are a couple of long running threads on this topic:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5517336/do-you-tip-in-restaurants/p1

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/79151176

IvanOpinion

On most cruise lines they are clear about the expectation of tips with that being how their staff earn money. Some more progressive cruise lines have done away with this.

UK restaurants are different though. Many years ago wait staff were asked if they would prefer a higher wage or tips and they chose the wage. There is therefore no legal or moral requirement to pay tips in a UK restaurant (except were explicitly stated e.g. large tables). Other countries though expect tips - I would suggest it is a backward tradition for control freaks.

I personally do not tip in UK restaurants  - they set their prices and that is what I pay. If I am in a hurry I may round up a few pence to the nearest pound.

itsthelittlethings

I would be ashamed not to tip. You presumably earn a decent wage as a consultant,  why shouldn't a waiter earn a decent wage. Although having said that even including tips, wages vary wildly from restaurant to restaurant. 

Pollycat

Mark_d said:

A number of years ago the Advertising Standards Agency gave advice that non-optional charges should be included in the total cost, or at least made explicit (if memory serves me correctly).  Lots of places, from restaurants to cruise ships, expect people to pay tips - sometimes a significant proportion of the total cost.  I feel this is completely unjustified and downright greedy.

If I choose to pay £25 for a meal, or £2000 for a cruise, that's the amount I've committed to paying because that's what suits my budget.  Why do people think I should offer more if the staff provides service with a smile?

Some people say that the workers get low pay and rely on tips.  That's not my fault.  If/when I want to support people in need - there are plenty of people more in need of money than the workers on cruise ships or in restaurants.

If someone comes to me as a consultant, they pay my agreed fee and that's the end of the matter.  I don't ask for extra pay if people are delighted with the advice I give them.  I give good service and hope people come back to me.  And  likewise I reward good service by offering repeat business.

How do others  feel?

I don't think that.

It's your money, you spend it how you like.
You sound annoyed - why does it matter what other people do?

Mark_d

itsthelittlethings said:

I would be ashamed not to tip. You presumably earn a decent wage as a consultant,  why shouldn't a waiter earn a decent wage. Although having said that even including tips, wages vary wildly from restaurant to restaurant. 

This is not about me versus a waiter.  It's about the principle.

Some jobs are trivially simple whilst others require years of training, knowledge and experience (plus the financial investment in the education, and the personal sacrifices that need to be made).

Some people are suffering low wages or different kinds of hardship.  There are any number of charities looking to help those most in need - So why have this stealth tax added on to people's bills?

Mark_d

Pollycat said:

Mark_d said:

A number of years ago the Advertising Standards Agency gave advice that non-optional charges should be included in the total cost, or at least made explicit (if memory serves me correctly).  Lots of places, from restaurants to cruise ships, expect people to pay tips - sometimes a significant proportion of the total cost.  I feel this is completely unjustified and downright greedy.

If I choose to pay £25 for a meal, or £2000 for a cruise, that's the amount I've committed to paying because that's what suits my budget.  Why do people think I should offer more if the staff provides service with a smile?

Some people say that the workers get low pay and rely on tips.  That's not my fault.  If/when I want to support people in need - there are plenty of people more in need of money than the workers on cruise ships or in restaurants.

If someone comes to me as a consultant, they pay my agreed fee and that's the end of the matter.  I don't ask for extra pay if people are delighted with the advice I give them.  I give good service and hope people come back to me.  And  likewise I reward good service by offering repeat business.

How do others  feel?

I don't think that.

It's your money, you spend it how you like.
You sound annoyed - why does it matter what other people do?

Thank you @Pollycat

I know that I do my bit for the benefit of society.  I just don't like feeling judged by people who think they know better how my money should be spent.

MacMickster

Mark_d said:

Pollycat said:

Mark_d said:

A number of years ago the Advertising Standards Agency gave advice that non-optional charges should be included in the total cost, or at least made explicit (if memory serves me correctly).  Lots of places, from restaurants to cruise ships, expect people to pay tips - sometimes a significant proportion of the total cost.  I feel this is completely unjustified and downright greedy.

If I choose to pay £25 for a meal, or £2000 for a cruise, that's the amount I've committed to paying because that's what suits my budget.  Why do people think I should offer more if the staff provides service with a smile?

Some people say that the workers get low pay and rely on tips.  That's not my fault.  If/when I want to support people in need - there are plenty of people more in need of money than the workers on cruise ships or in restaurants.

If someone comes to me as a consultant, they pay my agreed fee and that's the end of the matter.  I don't ask for extra pay if people are delighted with the advice I give them.  I give good service and hope people come back to me.  And  likewise I reward good service by offering repeat business.

How do others  feel?

I don't think that.

It's your money, you spend it how you like.
You sound annoyed - why does it matter what other people do?

Thank you @Pollycat

I know that I do my bit for the benefit of society.  I just don't like feeling judged by people who think they know better how my money should be spent.

So don't tip. It' isn't compulsory.

I always tip for good service. In restaurants that I use regularly I find that in return I am well looked after.Going out for a meal isn't simply about the food. It is about the whole experience. As a known tipper I don't ever have any trouble catching the waiter's eye. My wine glass will be topped up for me and I tend to get a decent table.

By tipping I help out the generally low paid staff. I also get a bit of an upgraded experience. Win, win!

itsthelittlethings

Mark_d said:

itsthelittlethings said:

I would be ashamed not to tip. You presumably earn a decent wage as a consultant,  why shouldn't a waiter earn a decent wage. Although having said that even including tips, wages vary wildly from restaurant to restaurant. 

This is not about me versus a waiter.  It's about the principle.

Some jobs are trivially simple whilst others require years of training, knowledge and experience (plus the financial investment in the education, and the personal sacrifices that need to be made).

Some people are suffering low wages or different kinds of hardship.  There are any number of charities looking to help those most in need - So why have this stealth tax added on to people's bills?

Trivially simple - you've clearly never waited tables. Don't tip, if that's how you feel. But the fact that you're asking about it means you know exactly what staff will think of you. I'd have some sympathy if you said you just couldn't afford it.

prowla

I mostly tip 10%, unless I'm not happy about something.