private "ticket" from North West Parking Ltd, pursued by DCBL. Won court case.

skuther

Hi all. I wish I had discovered this forum sooner - might have done the initial steps differently.

On evening of 28th December we went to try restaurant in Hartlepool Marina. (only had to because nothing to eat as £120 ASDA delivery didn't turn up which they claimed did and spent 3months complaining, but this is a different story).

It was pitch black. We came to the resturant - parking spaces off the road next to it.

Doesn't look like a pay car park.

Arrived in 2 cars.

Car 1 - My disabled mother in law has a mobility car and blue badge. She parked directly outside of restaurant in disabled space - and nobody saw any signs with small print. She believed she got free parking with her blue badge. Instead she got through the post usual £100 "fine" reduced to £60 if paid immediate. Usual story. She rang and challenged it but they ignored her. She paid £60. She can't afford this she is on PIP. The small print sign with the terms on conditions on would have required her to walk in the opposite direction from restaurant and double back. She has rheumatoid arthritis. I was passenger in her car.

Car 2 - my wife and our other guests. We parked opposite restaurant. normal bay. No ticket machines - they operate remote cashless system only. My wife couldn't download the app. Once in the restaurant I downloaded the app (yourparkingspace) and registered an account (took maybe 10mins to do that?). I then paid for 2 hours - we intended to be about 1hr and had young kids and already late for their bed. Nice food but slow service - so got out a bit late.

Entered car park 18:34:17 - left 20:59:27 (according the photos from parking company - which as was completely black only just show the glowing number plates + ?headlights).

According to parking app receipt -I paid for 2hours (£1/hour - total £2) for Thursday December 28th 2023, 06:43pm to 08:43.

so a marginal unintential overstay.

North West Parking sent out letter to my wife the Keeper (and driver) of the vehicle.

I can't recall if we have already admitted she was the driver also.

I responded with the following email:

"Dear NorthWest Parking Management LTD,

I am writing in response to formally appeal your letter dated 04/01/2024.

·        Parking Charge Notice  - [Removed by Forum Team]

·        Vehicle Registration Number – [Removed by Forum Team]

·        Date of parking Charge: 28/12/2023

I visited Hartlepool Marina to eat at restaurant on the evening of 28/12/2023. We don’t live in Hartlepool and it is somewhere we don’t tend to go. It was the middle of winter, it was dark. The signs were not particularly clear. We don’t recall seeing a machine to be able to pay at. However, after some difficulty we managed to find the details for the Yourparking space app and paid £2 for 2hours. We intended to have a short meal for about an hour or so – but got 2hours to allow for surprises.

Unknowingly I stayed past 2hrs – according to your letter by 18mins. I did not know this at time and was unintended due to the disappointingly slow service in the restaurant.

Had we known at the time we would of course got 3hours for a total of £3.

Your letter has requested £100 for this 18mins – which would equate to £333 an hour. This is grossly disproportionate and unfair. To quote the consumer group Which (of which I am a member) - “The charge isn’t proportionate to the normal advertised costs of parking or the losses caused to the company or landowner”.

Now I don’t you want you to be out of pocket for my unintended 18min overstay – so I have paid by bank transfer (as per your letter - sortcode 82-11-07, Acc 90143257, [Removed by Forum Team]) the £1 for the parking and an additional £10 to cover your administrative costs (total £11) which is more than generous.

If you think this is unreasonable then I would be happy to take formal legal advice and argue my case in the small claims court as appropriate against your unjust request.

Yours sincerely"

Now I believe in fair pay for services rendered  - so I did pay the £1 difference and £10 admin fee more than covered any costs - still leaving them in credit. So they not had any loss of earning/income due to my actions. So anything they are asking for is to me just a punitive money making scam.

Of course they bombarded us with multiple harrassing letters which we ignored.

Then multiple letters from DCBL "debt recovery" which we ignored - which then brought the total "debt" to £159.

The finally a letter of claim from DCB Legal - which I presume would be foolish to ignore.

I sent them the following email:

"

To whom it may concern.

re. reference  xxx

Firstly we acknowledge dated 25th July 2024 "letter of claim" sent to "xxx" regarding the alleged debt owed to NorthWest Parking Management LTD.

She no longer has the car in question and goes by xxx now.

I am writing on her behalf/request as her husband.

We made it clear from the outset that we dispute any further money was owed (particularly after the second payment made) as per the initial email/webresponse sent to them back in January 2024 - and made it quite clear that was would want to take this to court. I presume that if you have done your due dillergence you will already read this, so I won't repeat myself.

The subsequent multitude of harrassing, threatening and bullying letters from your client (directly and via third party "debt recovery") were pointless/unecessary, unhelpful and caused my wife alot of distress. She has had a miscarriage. She is now pregnant again, with instructions from her consultant to avoid stressful sitations - hence why I am writing on her behalf.

I don't feel it is appropriate to share any more information with you without getting legal advice first - which I am currently investigating, both in defense of your potential claim, and also in respect to two potential claims again your client one for harassment and a second potential disabilty discrimation claim related to separate parking "ticket" given to my disabled mother in law on the same occasion.

Yours sincerely,"

It was only AFTER I sent this email I discovered this forum.

They have responded saying:

"We write further to your recent correspondence.

 We have reviewed your dispute and respond accordingly as follows.

 We would like to firstly inform you that pursuing a legally owed debt is not harassment. You may wish to seek independent legal advice in this regard. Our client pursuing this matter through the Small Claims Court is the correct course of action.  

 We also inform you that when parking on private land, the contractual terms of the site are set out on the signs. You are entering a contract and agreeing to the terms by parking and staying on the site. Parking in breach of the terms as stipulated on the signage means that you are then breaking the terms of the contract. Please see attached the photos of the signage around the car park which show the terms and conditions.

 We acknowledge that you have previously made a payment of £11.00 on 16-01-2024 however the Client advised in your initial correspondence that the discounted payment was £60.00 and this had to be received by 20-01-2024. As such, you were provided with multiple opportunities to pay a reduced fee, or the original parking charge notice (PCN) amount prior to further fees and costs being incurred. This has now elapsed.

 You now have 30 days from the date of this email to pay the outstanding balance of £159.00. Failure to do so will result in a claim being issued against you without further notice and further fees and costs being incurred. 

Payment can be made via bank transfer to our designated client account

Account Name: DCB Legal Ltd Client Account"

So obvious I am filled with a sense of injustice and indignation.

1. I was unaware of the £100 "fine" at the onset, let alone would say I entered into a contract to pay it if I breeched their conditions.

They have a very clear prominent sign with parking charges on (see photo) and subsequently I found out only later a more distant small sign with terms and conditions - but I couldn't tell you to this day what they say.

2. I have read in the other areas of the form that the add on losts are scam attempt to inflate costs rather than legitimate.

3. Incidentally the local council parking fines are less than this. They are tiered depending on offense - with an overstay charged at £50, reduced to £25 for quick payment.

4. Also my wife and I have been very stressed about this. I have had many stress filled sleepless nights and have had to restart antidepressents. She had a miscarriage during this time (obviously can't prove causation). She is pregnant again (12weeks today) and I can't risk exposing her to this stress.

Even if nobody responds to this just typing it out has lightened my heart and made me feel a bit more in control

thank you.

skuther

See attached original (I think) letter.

skuther

Photo of entrance to "car park". restaurant on left. Car1 (mother in law) parked on left in disabled bay. Car2 (wife) parked on right opposite. Road runs down the middle.

skuther

sorry I should say all photos taken from google maps  and in middle of the day.

Actual trip was pitch black on 28th December evening.

This is google maps overview of road/parking.

skuther

This is the sign that we all saw (Again remember middle of the night).

skuther

Again from google street view photo (in real life with pitch black). Seen in distance off to the left or main sign - this is apparently the sign with terms and conditions. Nobody from either car could tell you then or now what is on it.

skuther

restaurant with disabled bays outside - nice restaurant (who do NOT own the parking spaces). shame about the parking company

skuther

skuther said:

Again from google street view photo (in real life with pitch black). Seen in distance off to the left or main sign - this is apparently the sign with terms and conditions. Nobody from either car could tell you then or now what is on it.

Sorry forgot to attach the (google street view) photo

LDast

What a pity you didn't find this forum before you shot yourself in both feet. Your MiL should not have paid £60. She would have not had to pay a penny had she appealed properly as it sounds as though there were no terms signs readable from the disabled parking bay being used.

As for the NtK you've shown us, there is a serious flaw that renders it non-compliant with PoFA to hold the keeper liable. If the driver had not been identified, it would easily have been appealed at POPLA.

This is the flaw in the NtK PoFA requirements:


As it is a claim issued by DCB Legal, you have to hope that if you follow the rest of the advice as per the second post in the Newbies/FAQ thread, they will eventually discontinue and you will see your username in lights in this thread:

DCB LEGAL RECORD OF PRIVATE PARKING COURT CLAIM DISCONTINUATIONS

skuther

recent DCBlegal claim letter

LDast

Second post in the Newbies/FAQ thread tearless you exactly how to respond to the LoC.