Can I ignore Dcbl final notice in Scotland?

Psych_1990

I've received around 4 or so letters now from DCBL, I've ignored every one so far because I've been informed this isn't legally binding in Scotland. I've now received a letter today saying that they will recommend their client to begin legal action against me. Do I continue to ignore and hope they are calling my bluff? 

Gr1pr

Read the thread below 

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6545143/latest-rules-in-scotland#latest

Then read post 4 in the newbies sticky thread in announcements by coupon mad 

They always threaten legal action, threatening is not the same as doing

Fruitcake

A driver in Scotland, indeed, a driver anywhere in the UK can be liable for a charge from an unregulated private parking company. However, in Scotland, a keeper cannot currently be held liable. Note that this will change in the future thanks to your former Dear Leader who decided to import a law from south of the border despite banging on about wanting independence.

All of this is explained in the sticky Announcement for NEWBIES that has specific advice for motorists in Scotland.

Debt collectors are powerless and can safely be ignored anywhere in the UK.

Psych_1990

Thanks guys, I'm going to continue to ignore. Is there a specific letter that I should NOT ignore? If they decide to take it further.. 

Fruitcake

Psych_1990 said:

Thanks guys, I'm going to continue to ignore. Is there a specific letter that I should NOT ignore? If they decide to take it further.. 

Do not ignore a court claim. This should be a claim from the Scottish Sheriff's Court using the Simple Procedure/Act of Sederunt. 
It may come from the English business centre in Northampton, but it shouldn't. If it comes from England then you need to point out to said business centre and the claimant that the defendant lives in Scotland and is therefore outside the jurisdiction of the courts of England and Wales.

Note that it is extremely unlikely that a PPC will try a claim for a single PCN in Scotland because they can't claim expenses for less than £300 and is therefore unviable. 

DullGreyGuy

Fruitcake said:

Psych_1990 said:

Thanks guys, I'm going to continue to ignore. Is there a specific letter that I should NOT ignore? If they decide to take it further.. 

Do not ignore a court claim. This should be a claim from the Scottish Sheriff's Court using the Simple Procedure/Act of Sederunt. 
It may come from the English business centre in Northampton, but it shouldn't. If it comes from England then you need to point out to said business centre and the claimant that the defendant lives in Scotland and is therefore outside the jurisdiction of the courts of England and Wales.

Surely it would depend on where the alleged event took place? If they were down in England when they decided to not buy a parking ticket then surely English law applies and so would be for an English court to judge?

Fruitcake

DullGreyGuy said:

Fruitcake said:

Psych_1990 said:

Thanks guys, I'm going to continue to ignore. Is there a specific letter that I should NOT ignore? If they decide to take it further.. 

Do not ignore a court claim. This should be a claim from the Scottish Sheriff's Court using the Simple Procedure/Act of Sederunt. 
It may come from the English business centre in Northampton, but it shouldn't. If it comes from England then you need to point out to said business centre and the claimant that the defendant lives in Scotland and is therefore outside the jurisdiction of the courts of England and Wales.

Surely it would depend on where the alleged event took place? If they were down in England when they decided to not buy a parking ticket then surely English law applies and so would be for an English court to judge?

The OP mentioned Scotland. They did not mention anything about the driver bilking, nor the alleged event taking place in any other nation outside the one mentioned.
Even if it did occur in England, the keeper lives outside the jurisdiction of the courts of England and Wales. The court system of England and Wales "should" throw out any attempt to instigate a claim outside jurisdiction, but sometimes they do slip through. It is no different to the alleged event occurring in England or Wales but the motorist living outside the UK. They cannot be held liable by the courts of England and Wales for a civil matter.

Psych_1990

It happened in Scotland, where did I say it happened in England, Dull Grey Guy? 

DullGreyGuy

Psych_1990 said:

It happened in Scotland, where did I say it happened in England, Dull Grey Guy? 

Didnt say you did, you didnt say where it had happened and so was covering off another plausible scenario rather than just a blanket if you live in Scotland then you are safe from all other jurisdictions. 

Fruitcake said:

DullGreyGuy said:

Fruitcake said:

Psych_1990 said:

Thanks guys, I'm going to continue to ignore. Is there a specific letter that I should NOT ignore? If they decide to take it further.. 

Do not ignore a court claim. This should be a claim from the Scottish Sheriff's Court using the Simple Procedure/Act of Sederunt. 
It may come from the English business centre in Northampton, but it shouldn't. If it comes from England then you need to point out to said business centre and the claimant that the defendant lives in Scotland and is therefore outside the jurisdiction of the courts of England and Wales.

Surely it would depend on where the alleged event took place? If they were down in England when they decided to not buy a parking ticket then surely English law applies and so would be for an English court to judge?

The OP mentioned Scotland. They did not mention anything about the driver bilking, nor the alleged event taking place in any other nation outside the one mentioned.
Even if it did occur in England, the keeper lives outside the jurisdiction of the courts of England and Wales. The court system of England and Wales "should" throw out any attempt to instigate a claim outside jurisdiction, but sometimes they do slip through. It is no different to the alleged event occurring in England or Wales but the motorist living outside the UK. They cannot be held liable by the courts of England and Wales for a civil matter.

Thankfully this is absolute nonsense - the CPR has a whole section on issuing with out of jurisdiction parties. In my world of liability claims the loss and action that caused the loss must have occurred with the jurisdiction but the party doesn't have to be in the jurisdiction. Were that not the case one of the biggest parts of the MIB could be closed down as foreign drivers would never be liable for their actions. 

Scotland is even listed in the table of notice required which would be an odd thing to do if your theory was correct

Coupon-mad

The theory is correct as far as parking firms are concerned because (unless there is big money at stake - e.g. VCS v Carly Mackie, heard in a Scottish court by the way) they are lazy generalists.

Whilst it is correct to say that the CPR has a whole section on issuing with out of jurisdiction parties, the roboclaim thugs aren't set up to think outside of their litigation conveyor belt box. They seek default CCJs and easy money including costs which they can't claim under the Simple Procedure for claims under £300.

The OP won't get a court claim but does need to be aware of the new statutory Code of Practice coming in soon.  I'm not talking about the self-serving dross version dreamed up by the BPA and IPC.

Fruitcake

DullGreyGuy said:

Psych_1990 said:

It happened in Scotland, where did I say it happened in England, Dull Grey Guy? 

Didnt say you did, you didnt say where it had happened and so was covering off another plausible scenario rather than just a blanket if you live in Scotland then you are safe from all other jurisdictions. 

Fruitcake said:

DullGreyGuy said:

Fruitcake said:

Psych_1990 said:

Thanks guys, I'm going to continue to ignore. Is there a specific letter that I should NOT ignore? If they decide to take it further.. 

Do not ignore a court claim. This should be a claim from the Scottish Sheriff's Court using the Simple Procedure/Act of Sederunt. 
It may come from the English business centre in Northampton, but it shouldn't. If it comes from England then you need to point out to said business centre and the claimant that the defendant lives in Scotland and is therefore outside the jurisdiction of the courts of England and Wales.

Surely it would depend on where the alleged event took place? If they were down in England when they decided to not buy a parking ticket then surely English law applies and so would be for an English court to judge?

The OP mentioned Scotland. They did not mention anything about the driver bilking, nor the alleged event taking place in any other nation outside the one mentioned.
Even if it did occur in England, the keeper lives outside the jurisdiction of the courts of England and Wales. The court system of England and Wales "should" throw out any attempt to instigate a claim outside jurisdiction, but sometimes they do slip through. It is no different to the alleged event occurring in England or Wales but the motorist living outside the UK. They cannot be held liable by the courts of England and Wales for a civil matter.

Thankfully this is absolute nonsense - the CPR has a whole section on issuing with out of jurisdiction parties. In my world of liability claims the loss and action that caused the loss must have occurred with the jurisdiction but the party doesn't have to be in the jurisdiction. Were that not the case one of the biggest parts of the MIB could be closed down as foreign drivers would never be liable for their actions. 

Scotland is even listed in the table of notice required which would be an odd thing to do if your theory was correct

@DullGreyGuy I stand corrected. Are you able to explain in lay terms what process an unregulated private parking company claimant would/should take if, say, a motorist (whether driver or keeper) lived in Scotland but the alleged event took place in another UK nation, including the situation where the motorist moved to Scotland after the alleged event please?
I ask this to ensure I give correct advice in the future.