Office of the Public Guardian

Nearlyold

Is there any point in others experience in contacting the OPG and/or the Police when a donor has passed away and the Executors find the person that held Power of Attorney has burnt through circa £360,000+ of the Donors money by cashing in investments and spending most of the money on themselves or their family as evidenced from the bank statements. Any general advice too would be welcome.

mybestattempt

I've no experience of that situation but for the amount involved and provided there is evidence I would feel duty bound to report the matter.

RAS

Based on other threads here, the OPG take the view that once the donor dies, they have no power. Had they been contacted prior to the donor's death, they would have acted to limit further loss and perhaps tackle the misuse of funds.

I can think of at least 4 cases nationally in recent years where people stealing from donors have been convicted after their donor's death, a couple quite recent. I think though these were police cases so it may depend on the local force?

elsien

In my limited experience of similar cases with the OPG it’s hard enough to get them to act when the person is still alive, let alone after they’ve passed. 

I’m not sure they’d have any powers to redress the situation now. Police might be a marginally better bet, but again from previous threads on here any action is a hope rather than a reality. I wouldn’t say don’t report it, but maybe don’t expect too much. 

Keep_pedalling

This appears to be a case of theft, the OPG cannot act on this so it is a case for the police. 

tls123

Agree the OPG can take steps to remove the attorney on suspected fraud but once the donor has deceased the POA no longer applies so would be the police. 

Browntoa

It's fraud 

It's a police matter

But sadly,  in most of these cases , even with a successful conviction the people don't have the assets to repay the money

Sea_Shell

Nearlyold said:

Is there any point in others experience in contacting the OPG and/or the Police when a donor has passed away and the Executors find the person that held Power of Attorney has burnt through circa £360,000+ of the Donors money by cashing in investments and spending most of the money on themselves or their family as evidenced from the bank statements. Any general advice too would be welcome.

If they have the evidence*, and the person who had PoA appears to [still] have assets, then they have nothing to lose** by pushing to make this a police matter.  They'll probably try to fob them off initialy by saying "it's a civil matter".   
It is theft/fraud and should be dealt with by them.   After all "crime is crime" 

They might have to push hard mind, and keep on at it, if they are to get very far.    

Are the executor and the attorney beneficiaries?     



* Along with evidence of the withdrawals, do they then also have evidence of how/where the money was spent, or not spent?  

**  They may lose their hair, their patience and their sanity. 



ETA - on a wider point, does an executor have any LEGAL duty to pursue the matter to enable the estate to be wound up and distributed, or is it purely a case of what money was in the estate at the date of death, from that POV?   Curious. 

Keep_pedalling

Sea_Shell said:

Nearlyold said:

Is there any point in others experience in contacting the OPG and/or the Police when a donor has passed away and the Executors find the person that held Power of Attorney has burnt through circa £360,000+ of the Donors money by cashing in investments and spending most of the money on themselves or their family as evidenced from the bank statements. Any general advice too would be welcome.

If they have the evidence*, and the person who had PoA appears to [still] have assets, then they have nothing to lose** by pushing to make this a police matter.  They'll probably try to fob them off initialy by saying "it's a civil matter".   
It is theft/fraud and should be dealt with by them.   After all "crime is crime" 

They might have to push hard mind, and keep on at it, if they are to get very far.    

Are the executor and the attorney beneficiaries?     



* Along with evidence of the withdrawals, do they then also have evidence of how/where the money was spent, or not spent?  

**  They may lose their hair, their patience and their sanity. 



ETA - on a wider point, does an executor have any LEGAL duty to pursue the matter to enable the estate to be wound up and distributed, or is it purely a case of what money was in the estate at the date of death, from that POV?   Curious. 

Yes the executor has a duty to try to recover money stolen from the testator. It might not only be the beneficiaries who are losing out, with a large amount having gone missing there is also the possibility than IHT could come into the picture. 

Gers

One example in the Daily Mail today.

SkyyeBlue

I would imagine the PoA will say the donor gifted the money. Have you evidence the donor did not have capacity to make those decisions? You will need to be able to prove this as they can't ask the donor themselves.