Help please on letters to creditors before DRO

stu12345_2

the banks didn't have to put in thousands of hours of labour to allow the banks to have millions in their cash, the governments gave them it from fresh air, they simply gave them millions for free

which they lend out and make big profits

get him to visit relatives, stay in hotels, train fares, or have a holiday.

my family are in Scotland and will cost wife and I £2000 easy for train plane hotels spending money we visit them for a fortnight, they are 700 miles away, I'm in the south coast.

tell him to book himself a holiday, go away now
 or weekends away 
he can also buy a new computer , watch or TV, push bike or electric  push bike or mobile phone for cash not contract , it's very easy to spend money on things you are allowed to buy and things aren't cheap  and ebike is about £700 min, which would be a great thing to buy

new pair of specs or spare pair if he wears any, you get my drift, he can spend if he likes on fair outgoings 
 that any normal person is expected to do in a reasonable quality of life

he is not expected to never have a holiday and live on beans on toast, no creditor would say that is normal or acceptable nor would the IP say that too

can you understand the frustration myself and fat belly feel in our posts, it would be ridiculous to give creditors £2000 when the debt is going to be written off anyway in the DRO

the creditors aren't going to write a letter saying cheers pal , ta for the £2000, would you like more credit

in a side note, he can include holiday, vapes if he vapes, takeaways, stamps, newspapers in his dro application, has he accounted for that, then he could get his monthly excess down and allow more flexibility in his monthly budget if he does overtime or gets wage rise in next 12 months 

stu12345_2

if  I was in his shoes, I'd put off my dro application for a few weeks, I'd buy an ebike on Saturday, a new laptop on Sunday, then next weekend id go away on holiday, even a nice city break in the UK, Edinburgh or suchlike  in. hotel via train or plane 


all of these are acceptable 
and even if where he rents has no garage, I'd bring the bike in to the  hallway , not the stairwell if it's a fiat, but actually inside the flat

a good quality ebike would be a great idea since he no longer owns a car

under no circumstances would I give £2000 to creditors
, especially since the creditors dont need it as the debt is being written off in the DRO.

the creditors are not your friend, never have been, you are a number on a screen to them.

if he's being stubborn, you get the cash from him, he goes to hole in the wall  machine and you go and buy these things for him

oldnfat

all good ideas, especially the ebike thankyou.  I'll have another go out him and see how far I can get.

If he were to spend that £2000 on holiday etc. instead of his debts would that not been seen as "form of deprivation of assets in order to get himself into a worse financial position so he fits into a dro"?

Most things are in his budget but think we might add a couple that weren't - he's just found out this morning, he will probably be getting some kind of bonus thing for being on call once in a while (not sure of any other details yet)

oldnfat

Oh and yes I can defo understand your frustration, I'm feeling a lot of that myself!

stu12345_2

deprecation of assets is more about claiming dole money and you have blown  your redundancy pay on a  world cruise.

regarding insolvency, deprivation is where you give away a car for free, etc.

a dro is a baby form of insolvency, all the IP wants to see is what you earn and what bills you pay out regularly.
and what assets you have and have you sold anything undervalued or given anything of value  away for free in last 2 years.

a holiday a new ebike or laptop is not giving things away for free and is satisfying a reasonable standard of living. holidays are allowed, second hand car up to £4000 is allowed. etc

if anyone did go crazy with money to  give it away for free or sell assets undervalued then it effects bankruptcy more than dro.

the restrictions especially in bankruptcy is you can't become a governor or director etc even after your bankruptcy ends, it's similar in a dro, but not as severe.

your friend isn't depriving himself of anything any normal person is expected to experience or own, a bike, a laptop a holiday a used car.

he is not making a £2000 gift to save the whales charity lol.
he is experiencing what any normal person is expected to own and experience 

stu12345_2

when did he last go in a fortnights holiday at a hotel, in the UK or abroad ,when did he last buy a  good TV, how old is his computer, how is he planning get about now he has no form of transport.

does he have friends or family scattered over the UK he would like to visit and stay over in their town 

oldnfat

I think £2000 to save the whales is a very worthy cause and should be allowable imho lol

Thank you again for all your advice. I will run it all by him when I see him tomorrow and update when I can 

stu12345_2

some reading for you, I have read all if it, both links

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/how-to-get-a-debt-relief-order-dro#contents

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/debt-relief-orders-guidance-for-debt-advisers

the first link is simple it explains the IP will look into 2 yr history to see if your friend paid one creditor over another and what assets they gave away for free or undersold in last 2 years 

the second link is fun, and  read it all and you deserve to be employed by the insolvency service.

it's every question you always wanted to know about DRO but where too scared to ask lol

tbh from reading the most severe thing is obtaining credit shortly before you apply for a DRO when you know you can never pay it back, the IP may not grant you a DRO then

sourcrates

Stick the cash in a box under the bed, no point giving it away to debts that are going to be written off.

No one will ever know 

Your friend doesn't have to tell his creditors anything, the debt collection process can go on for months on end, even years sometimes, nothing is going to happen quickly.

Best advise to give him is don`t overthink things, get all his ducks in a row, make sure he qualifies on paper, then get the application started, ignore the creditors they are out of the picture once you opt for insolvency.

oldnfat

Well, I finally managed to pin him down last night and adopted my most persuasive attitude all to no avail.  I even tried to say that if he wouldn't do something for himself then he could think of me and all I've put into this and take me on holiday as a thankyou.  But no, he's adamant that sacrificing £2000 is nothing compared to what he's racked up and he wants to pay it!  You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink springs to mind!  I can't do any more and tbh I'm at the end of my tether with it all.  It's put me off wanting to offer to help anyone ever again

Thankyou so much to all that tried to help and for wasting your time

PS @stu12345_2 I've already read those links you provide (and more!) but thanks anyway