Unable to carry out visa check so missed flight (in chaos on Friday)

nadsat

Posting for my son and wife - they booked a 3 day trip to Rome flying on Ryanair on Friday. Wife has a spouse visa that has to be checked at the airport before a boarding pass is issued but of course in the queue and chaos on Friday morning at Stansted this was hopeless and the flight left without them. My son had a boarding pass as he is a UK citizen. 

Ryanair has, needless to say, told him where to go when he asked for a refund. 

Is there any point in trying anything else with Ryanair as this wasn't a flight cancellation or delay. 

He's looking at his travel insurance and also at Amex, which he used to book the flights and hotel. 

Voyager2002

Ryanair T and Cs are written in terms of arrival at the departure gate, so their "get lost" response is technically correct. However, they failed to perform the visa check, something that was an essential part of the service for which you had paid. A chargeback would probably succeed, but then you would be blacklisted by Ryanair.

Be clear whether the visa check should have been performed by Ryanair or by the airport, and the precise reason why it was "hopeless".

nadsat

Voyager2002 said:

Ryanair T and Cs are written in terms of arrival at the departure gate, so their "get lost" response is technically correct. However, they failed to perform the visa check, something that was an essential part of the service for which you had paid. A chargeback would probably succeed, but then you would be blacklisted by Ryanair.

Be clear whether the visa check should have been performed by Ryanair or by the airport, and the precise reason why it was "hopeless".

It's Ryanair that carries out the check and they are supposed to have a dedicated desk for this but didn't. They did get to a check-in desk eventually but were told to clear off in favour of other flight passengers and nothing could be done nor could they get on the two later flights. They arrived well ahead of the 2 hours Ryanair asks for the visa check. 

Voyager2002

nadsat said:

Voyager2002 said:

Ryanair T and Cs are written in terms of arrival at the departure gate, so their "get lost" response is technically correct. However, they failed to perform the visa check, something that was an essential part of the service for which you had paid. A chargeback would probably succeed, but then you would be blacklisted by Ryanair.

Be clear whether the visa check should have been performed by Ryanair or by the airport, and the precise reason why it was "hopeless".

It's Ryanair that carries out the check and they are supposed to have a dedicated desk for this but didn't. They did get to a check-in desk eventually but were told to clear off in favour of other flight passengers and nothing could be done nor could they get on the two later flights. They arrived well ahead of the 2 hours Ryanair asks for the visa check. 

So Ryanair failed to provide the service for which they had paid. When you (they) contacted Ryanair, what exactly was the excuse for this?

TELLIT01

Voyager2002 said:

nadsat said:

Voyager2002 said:

Ryanair T and Cs are written in terms of arrival at the departure gate, so their "get lost" response is technically correct. However, they failed to perform the visa check, something that was an essential part of the service for which you had paid. A chargeback would probably succeed, but then you would be blacklisted by Ryanair.

Be clear whether the visa check should have been performed by Ryanair or by the airport, and the precise reason why it was "hopeless".

It's Ryanair that carries out the check and they are supposed to have a dedicated desk for this but didn't. They did get to a check-in desk eventually but were told to clear off in favour of other flight passengers and nothing could be done nor could they get on the two later flights. They arrived well ahead of the 2 hours Ryanair asks for the visa check. 

So Ryanair failed to provide the service for which they had paid. When you (they) contacted Ryanair, what exactly was the excuse for this?

It may have escaped your notice but there was a massive world wide IT systems problem on Friday.  Anybody who did join a check in queue had to be processed manually.  That delay is beyond the control of the airlines.  Ryanair may or may not be able to hide behind that.  I'm sure there will be details somewhere of what has to be refunded and what doesn't. 

 I would suspect Ryanair's take on it will be that the passenger didn't allow enough time for the visa checks to be carried out, therefore no entitlement.  (I'm just playing Devil's Advocate).  The fact that many IT systems weren't available and Ryanair may not have been able to check anyway may be a counter argument to that.

nadsat

TELLIT01 said:

Voyager2002 said:

nadsat said:

Voyager2002 said:

Ryanair T and Cs are written in terms of arrival at the departure gate, so their "get lost" response is technically correct. However, they failed to perform the visa check, something that was an essential part of the service for which you had paid. A chargeback would probably succeed, but then you would be blacklisted by Ryanair.

Be clear whether the visa check should have been performed by Ryanair or by the airport, and the precise reason why it was "hopeless".

It's Ryanair that carries out the check and they are supposed to have a dedicated desk for this but didn't. They did get to a check-in desk eventually but were told to clear off in favour of other flight passengers and nothing could be done nor could they get on the two later flights. They arrived well ahead of the 2 hours Ryanair asks for the visa check. 

So Ryanair failed to provide the service for which they had paid. When you (they) contacted Ryanair, what exactly was the excuse for this?

It may have escaped your notice but there was a massive world wide IT systems problem on Friday.  Anybody who did join a check in queue had to be processed manually.  That delay is beyond the control of the airlines.  Ryanair may or may not be able to hide behind that.  I'm sure there will be details somewhere of what has to be refunded and what doesn't. 

 I would suspect Ryanair's take on it will be that the passenger didn't allow enough time for the visa checks to be carried out, therefore no entitlement.  (I'm just playing Devil's Advocate).  The fact that many IT systems weren't available and Ryanair may not have been able to check anyway may be a counter argument to that.

Ryanair has just sent boilerplate saying because they didn't present at the gate no refund, ignoring the visa/boarding pass issue. 

They were in plenty of time for a visa check as usual. 

I would have thought the customer is in no way to blame for the unavailability of a supplier's systems and they should refund. 

Hoenir

nadsat said:

TELLIT01 said:

Voyager2002 said:

nadsat said:

Voyager2002 said:

Ryanair T and Cs are written in terms of arrival at the departure gate, so their "get lost" response is technically correct. However, they failed to perform the visa check, something that was an essential part of the service for which you had paid. A chargeback would probably succeed, but then you would be blacklisted by Ryanair.

Be clear whether the visa check should have been performed by Ryanair or by the airport, and the precise reason why it was "hopeless".

It's Ryanair that carries out the check and they are supposed to have a dedicated desk for this but didn't. They did get to a check-in desk eventually but were told to clear off in favour of other flight passengers and nothing could be done nor could they get on the two later flights. They arrived well ahead of the 2 hours Ryanair asks for the visa check. 

So Ryanair failed to provide the service for which they had paid. When you (they) contacted Ryanair, what exactly was the excuse for this?

It may have escaped your notice but there was a massive world wide IT systems problem on Friday.  Anybody who did join a check in queue had to be processed manually.  That delay is beyond the control of the airlines.  Ryanair may or may not be able to hide behind that.  I'm sure there will be details somewhere of what has to be refunded and what doesn't. 

 I would suspect Ryanair's take on it will be that the passenger didn't allow enough time for the visa checks to be carried out, therefore no entitlement.  (I'm just playing Devil's Advocate).  The fact that many IT systems weren't available and Ryanair may not have been able to check anyway may be a counter argument to that.

Ryanair has just sent boilerplate saying because they didn't present at the gate no refund, ignoring the visa/boarding pass issue. 

They were in plenty of time for a visa check as usual. 

I would have thought the customer is in no way to blame for the unavailability of a supplier's systems and they should refund. 

Possibly RyanAir use a ground service agent whose system was impacted. Are you suggesting that they should foot the bill? 

nadsat

Hoenir said:

Possibly RyanAir use a ground service agent whose system was impacted. Are you suggesting that they should foot the bill? 

Thing is, I'm pretty sure he bought the tickets from Ryanair. 

Voyager2002

Hoenir said:

nadsat said:

TELLIT01 said:

Voyager2002 said:

nadsat said:

Voyager2002 said:

Ryanair T and Cs are written in terms of arrival at the departure gate, so their "get lost" response is technically correct. However, they failed to perform the visa check, something that was an essential part of the service for which you had paid. A chargeback would probably succeed, but then you would be blacklisted by Ryanair.

Be clear whether the visa check should have been performed by Ryanair or by the airport, and the precise reason why it was "hopeless".

It's Ryanair that carries out the check and they are supposed to have a dedicated desk for this but didn't. They did get to a check-in desk eventually but were told to clear off in favour of other flight passengers and nothing could be done nor could they get on the two later flights. They arrived well ahead of the 2 hours Ryanair asks for the visa check. 

So Ryanair failed to provide the service for which they had paid. When you (they) contacted Ryanair, what exactly was the excuse for this?

It may have escaped your notice but there was a massive world wide IT systems problem on Friday.  Anybody who did join a check in queue had to be processed manually.  That delay is beyond the control of the airlines.  Ryanair may or may not be able to hide behind that.  I'm sure there will be details somewhere of what has to be refunded and what doesn't. 

 I would suspect Ryanair's take on it will be that the passenger didn't allow enough time for the visa checks to be carried out, therefore no entitlement.  (I'm just playing Devil's Advocate).  The fact that many IT systems weren't available and Ryanair may not have been able to check anyway may be a counter argument to that.

Ryanair has just sent boilerplate saying because they didn't present at the gate no refund, ignoring the visa/boarding pass issue. 

They were in plenty of time for a visa check as usual. 

I would have thought the customer is in no way to blame for the unavailability of a supplier's systems and they should refund. 

Possibly RyanAir use a ground service agent whose system was impacted. Are you suggesting that they should foot the bill? 

Leaving aside the issue of 'should', people who cannot reach the departure gate in time because of failures by the airport (who are presumably linked by contract with the airline) do not have a right to a refund.

nadsat

Voyager2002 said:

Hoenir said:

nadsat said:

TELLIT01 said:

Voyager2002 said:

nadsat said:

Voyager2002 said:

Ryanair T and Cs are written in terms of arrival at the departure gate, so their "get lost" response is technically correct. However, they failed to perform the visa check, something that was an essential part of the service for which you had paid. A chargeback would probably succeed, but then you would be blacklisted by Ryanair.

Be clear whether the visa check should have been performed by Ryanair or by the airport, and the precise reason why it was "hopeless".

It's Ryanair that carries out the check and they are supposed to have a dedicated desk for this but didn't. They did get to a check-in desk eventually but were told to clear off in favour of other flight passengers and nothing could be done nor could they get on the two later flights. They arrived well ahead of the 2 hours Ryanair asks for the visa check. 

So Ryanair failed to provide the service for which they had paid. When you (they) contacted Ryanair, what exactly was the excuse for this?

It may have escaped your notice but there was a massive world wide IT systems problem on Friday.  Anybody who did join a check in queue had to be processed manually.  That delay is beyond the control of the airlines.  Ryanair may or may not be able to hide behind that.  I'm sure there will be details somewhere of what has to be refunded and what doesn't. 

 I would suspect Ryanair's take on it will be that the passenger didn't allow enough time for the visa checks to be carried out, therefore no entitlement.  (I'm just playing Devil's Advocate).  The fact that many IT systems weren't available and Ryanair may not have been able to check anyway may be a counter argument to that.

Ryanair has just sent boilerplate saying because they didn't present at the gate no refund, ignoring the visa/boarding pass issue. 

They were in plenty of time for a visa check as usual. 

I would have thought the customer is in no way to blame for the unavailability of a supplier's systems and they should refund. 

Possibly RyanAir use a ground service agent whose system was impacted. Are you suggesting that they should foot the bill? 

Leaving aside the issue of 'should', people who cannot reach the departure gate in time because of failures by the airport (who are presumably linked by contract with the airline) do not have a right to a refund.

Just to be clear - this is a red herring. As I said, it is the airline that conducts the visa check, and as stated in this link. They have refused a refund for not conducting this check or at least they have not read or considered the complaint. 

https://www.migrate.london/blog/ryanair-visa-checks-what-you-need-to-know 

Voyager2002

nadsat said:

Voyager2002 said:

Hoenir said:

nadsat said:

TELLIT01 said:

Voyager2002 said:

nadsat said:

Voyager2002 said:

Ryanair T and Cs are written in terms of arrival at the departure gate, so their "get lost" response is technically correct. However, they failed to perform the visa check, something that was an essential part of the service for which you had paid. A chargeback would probably succeed, but then you would be blacklisted by Ryanair.

Be clear whether the visa check should have been performed by Ryanair or by the airport, and the precise reason why it was "hopeless".

It's Ryanair that carries out the check and they are supposed to have a dedicated desk for this but didn't. They did get to a check-in desk eventually but were told to clear off in favour of other flight passengers and nothing could be done nor could they get on the two later flights. They arrived well ahead of the 2 hours Ryanair asks for the visa check. 

So Ryanair failed to provide the service for which they had paid. When you (they) contacted Ryanair, what exactly was the excuse for this?

It may have escaped your notice but there was a massive world wide IT systems problem on Friday.  Anybody who did join a check in queue had to be processed manually.  That delay is beyond the control of the airlines.  Ryanair may or may not be able to hide behind that.  I'm sure there will be details somewhere of what has to be refunded and what doesn't. 

 I would suspect Ryanair's take on it will be that the passenger didn't allow enough time for the visa checks to be carried out, therefore no entitlement.  (I'm just playing Devil's Advocate).  The fact that many IT systems weren't available and Ryanair may not have been able to check anyway may be a counter argument to that.

Ryanair has just sent boilerplate saying because they didn't present at the gate no refund, ignoring the visa/boarding pass issue. 

They were in plenty of time for a visa check as usual. 

I would have thought the customer is in no way to blame for the unavailability of a supplier's systems and they should refund. 

Possibly RyanAir use a ground service agent whose system was impacted. Are you suggesting that they should foot the bill? 

Leaving aside the issue of 'should', people who cannot reach the departure gate in time because of failures by the airport (who are presumably linked by contract with the airline) do not have a right to a refund.

Just to be clear - this is a red herring. As I said, it is the airline that conducts the visa check, and as stated in this link. They have refused a refund for not conducting this check or at least they have not read or considered the complaint. 

https://www.migrate.london/blog/ryanair-visa-checks-what-you-need-to-know 

Agreed. However, actors like credit card companies might be unhelpful because of this, so you need to be very clear that the airline itself failed to provide an essential part of the boarding process. This is therefore different from an airport's failure to provide sufficient security staff, meaning that passengers cannot reach the departure gate in time, a situation in which no refund is due.