Hire Van PCN, one year ago, correspondence set to wrong address

Milomix

I would be grateful for some advice. I know that the Newbies thread says no circumstances are unique, so I’m sure the answer is in there but I’m struggling to piece together the various bits of advice. 

One year ago (31 July 23) I moved house and hired a van to do so. At the end of the day, I parked the van outside a restaurant in a retail park to get dinner. Parking in the retail is free but it transpires that there are a handful of places that belong to a hotel, which are not, despite being directly outside the restaurant.

Of course, this was not clearly signposted or I wouldn’t have parked there (as there is lots of free parking in the car park). I went back to check the signage last night and there are now huge signs outside the restaurant directing customers to free parking (in green) and warning of paid parking (in red). I checked google maps and they are new, so called the restaurant who said they had been installed in the last 6-9 months.

All fairly standard so far, I think, but the kicker is I had no idea about any of this until a few days ago, when I visited the block of flats I used to live in to see a friend and found mail addressed to me in the communal hallway (it’s a small private block).

There were two identical letters from BPA registered company, Civil Enforcement Limited titled ‘Letter Before Action’ in relation to a £170 parking charge. The letters claimed that the company had written to me on several occasions previously.

I don’t know how the letters ended up at this address. I moved out a year ago, I’m on the electoral roll elsewhere and same for council tax. The van hire wasn’t for that address either but my previous address, as that was on my driving license.

So, I have never received the PCN or any previous correspondence.

I asked the new tenants if they had received any other mail and they said they didn’t think so, but could have potentially and thought it was circulars. I also asked the hire company when they passed my details on, but they haven’t been able to tell me.

So, Civil Enforcement may have been writing for months or this could be the first time.

The whole thing seems grossly unfair, given the circumstances of the parking incident, and the delay, but I am also grateful that I found out before any legal action was taken (I understand Civil Enforcement are litigious), although the 30 days to respond ends tomorrow.

I’m not sure how to challenge, would be grateful if someone might point to the closest similar case on the forum to refer to.

Letter below. Thanks in advance.

Gr1pr

Write a data rectification notice with your current name and address on it, adding 2 recent redacted utility bills as proof, quoting the references and VRM, email it to the DPO at CEL and copy in the legal team, because you don't want the court claim going to the wrong address and ending up with you getting a CCJ 

Coupon-mad

...yep, and address data rectification is already within the recommended LBC reply. See the 2nd post of the NEWBIES thread.

No link needed. See my signature if you are unused to navigating forums because they are easy to hop around and you should always read the pinned Announcement 'sticky' threads first.  All is covered in the NEWBIES FAQS thread.

Milomix

Thank you @Gr1pr, I've found the those email addresses and will do that now. I dont have untility bills as all in my house mate's name, but will give it a go.

Thanks @Coupon-mad too. I read the newbies thread before posting but I clearly not properly. Lookings at that now, I think an email along the following lines to CEL, their DOP and legal ream would be appropriate:

Your Ref. ############
Proposed Legal Proceedings
Claimant: Civil Enforcement Ltd

I refer to your letter of claim dated 12 July 2024, to which I am replying with the 30 days limited stipulated.

I confirm that my address for service for the time being - assuming you don't faff about and delay any claim - is as follows, and any older address must be erased from your records:

[my actual address here]

The alleged debt is disputed and any court proceedings will be vigorously defended.

I am sourcing and seeking independent debt advice and as such, I formally request that this matter be put on hold for an additional 30 days, in accordance with the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims 2017 ('the PAP').

You should be aware that [old address] is not my address and I have been living at [new address] since 1 August 2023. This can be proved by council tax records. As such, I never received the original PCN nor any subsequent correspondence, despite your letter claiming that you have written to me on several occasions.

I have a number of questions and under the PAP I am entitled to specific answers:

1. Am I to understand that the additional £170 represents the PCN sum and what you might describe as a 'Debt Recovery' fee? If so, please:

·       Confirm the component elements of the £170 total

·       Whether this is this net or inclusive of VAT

·       If the latter, please provide an explanation for why I am being asked to pay the operator’s VAT?

2. With regard to the principal alleged PCN sum: Is this damages, or will it be pleaded as consideration for parking?

I also request by return a copy of the PCN and all correspondence you have previously sent to me, regardless of the address to which it was sent.

To reiterate, I have not received any correspondence or other contact from Civil Enforcement Ltd prior to being made aware of the letter dated 12 June 2024.

I note that the amount being claimed a hugely exaggerated amount which the Government called "extorting money from motorists".

Yours faithfully

Gr1pr

You must have some official letters with your current address on them, just redact two and attach them, government, banking, I R , DWP , must be something of yours to back up your DRN reply 

Milomix

@Gr1pr thanks again. I will do but won't be able to grab them till tonight (have been travelling with work). The 30 day deadline ends today, which I guess gives me till midnight. 

Really apreciate your help. 

Gr1pr

I wouldn't be worrying about a 30 day deadline on a Friday evening, just do it this weekend 

Coupon-mad

Yep it's not set in stone.

Milomix

I found the letter confirming I had been added to the electoral register a few weeks after date of the PCN. All sent now. Thanks again for your help, will update here when I hear back. 

Milomix

Milomix said:

Thank you @Gr1pr, I've found the those email addresses and will do that now. I dont have untility bills as all in my house mate's name, but will give it a go.

Thanks @Coupon-mad too. I read the newbies thread before posting but I clearly not properly. Lookings at that now, I think an email along the following lines to CEL, their DOP and legal ream would be appropriate:

Your Ref. ############
Proposed Legal Proceedings
Claimant: Civil Enforcement Ltd

I refer to your letter of claim dated 12 July 2024, to which I am replying with the 30 days limited stipulated.

I confirm that my address for service for the time being - assuming you don't faff about and delay any claim - is as follows, and any older address must be erased from your records:

[my actual address here]

The alleged debt is disputed and any court proceedings will be vigorously defended.

I am sourcing and seeking independent debt advice and as such, I formally request that this matter be put on hold for an additional 30 days, in accordance with the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims 2017 ('the PAP').

You should be aware that [old address] is not my address and I have been living at [new address] since 1 August 2023. This can be proved by council tax records. As such, I never received the original PCN nor any subsequent correspondence, despite your letter claiming that you have written to me on several occasions.

I have a number of questions and under the PAP I am entitled to specific answers:

1. Am I to understand that the additional £170 represents the PCN sum and what you might describe as a 'Debt Recovery' fee? If so, please:

·       Confirm the component elements of the £170 total

·       Whether this is this net or inclusive of VAT

·       If the latter, please provide an explanation for why I am being asked to pay the operator’s VAT?

2. With regard to the principal alleged PCN sum: Is this damages, or will it be pleaded as consideration for parking?

I also request by return a copy of the PCN and all correspondence you have previously sent to me, regardless of the address to which it was sent.

To reiterate, I have not received any correspondence or other contact from Civil Enforcement Ltd prior to being made aware of the letter dated 12 June 2024.

I note that the amount being claimed a hugely exaggerated amount which the Government called "extorting money from motorists".

Yours faithfully

Just following up on the above. I wrote these at [Legal3@ce-service.co.uk; dataprotectionofficer@ce-service.co.uk; and office@ce-service.co.uk] as per the above and never heard back from them.

I sent two follow up emails asking them to confirm receipt, but nothing.

Am I safe to consider the matter closed or should I pursue? 

Milomix

Just giving this gentle bump - very grateful for any advice.