Ex refuses to sign so I can remortgage

DE_612183

Has the mortgage been on a standard rate for the last 21 years - there must have been fluctuations during that time?

How long before the order comes into effect that will force the sale?

Do you think at some point you will be in a position to pay him 30% of the equity of the property?

From the details you've given, there is no duty on him to agree to a remortgage - save for common sense - you may be better off biting the bullet now - sell up and with your 70% get a new mortgage for a property you can afford.

Helpplease2024

DE_612183 said:

Has the mortgage been on a standard rate for the last 21 years - there must have been fluctuations during that time?

How long before the order comes into effect that will force the sale?

Do you think at some point you will be in a position to pay him 30% of the equity of the property?

From the details you've given, there is no duty on him to agree to a remortgage - save for common sense - you may be better off biting the bullet now - sell up and with your 70% get a new mortgage for a property you can afford.

Hi. Yes its been on whatever the banks rate was and obviously increased alot over the years. Now paying 3 times more than a year or so ago. The order comes into effect in a few years. Just trying to keep a roof over my boys heads until then. Single mum 2 kids went University I want them to have a home until finished at least. I have a 2 bed flat not a house aswell. In a few years I can remortgage and pay him just cant just now as income currently not enough but that will be different give it a year or so. Ideally I would buy him out now if possible and be done with this uncertainty of our future. The order states he cant force a sale as I could transfer his equity to a new property anyway. If he spoke to his solicitor as I did he would know this. 😕

Helpplease2024

This is someone who also tried to open a bank account and get a loan to the property he hasn’t lived in for 21 years just a few years ago.  Trust me if I could buy him out now I would!  The bank also sent all reminders to me and him at his address and not to me at the mortgaged property address even though I told them so many times over the years we divorced 21 years ago and I live obviously in the mortgage address. They let him change the details repeatedly. 

Exodi

Helpplease2024 said:

The order [to repay him] comes into effect in a few years.

<snip>

In a few years I can remortgage and pay him just cant just now as income currently not enough but that will be different give it a year or so.

I expect he may find that extremely convenient. Surely you can understand his position?

It's clear from all of your responses that you only ever intend to buy him out at the latest point stipulated in the court order. He's clearly grown impatient, 21+ years is a very long time for anyone. I know you feel hard done by by the mesher order, but from the outside it looks like it has served you incredibly well - it's basically gone on for the absolute maximum theoretical time possible (having a zero year old at breakup, the child then attending extended education).

It's kind of unfortunate as if you'd settled this earlier, you wouldn't have to hand him all of the equity from 2 decades of house price growth.

ian1246

Helpplease2024 said:

ian1246 said:

So your ex has been prevented from Home Ownership himself due to being tied into your house's mortgage for the last 21 years, despite the court order requiring you to remortgage into your own name as soon as possible?

I can understand why he might be a tad difficult now. At least you have a home - sounds like he probably has lived a life time in rental due to no opportunity to take on his own mortgage.

In addition, that charge on the land registry is the only thing protecting his % of the property. If your asking him to remove it or put it secondary to a new mortgage, I would argue you yourself may be in breach of the order since it's clear your meant to indemnify him from the risk of you defaulting on the mortgage - it would mean if you default & the house is repossessed & then sold at a loss, your new mortgage company will get 100% of the proceeds - increasing his own liability/loss.

What indemnity Policy have you put inplace to protect him from the liabilities he still owes to the mortgage company?

What repayment vehicle have you put in place to pay off the lump-sum now due at the end of the interest mortgage? If you haven't done so, I'd argue you have breached the obligations the court order clearly places on you to minimise the risk towards your ex partner - since ultimately, a default on the mortgage will go in both your names & he will be jointly responsible for paying back the mortgage sum now due - including potentially potentially risking his own home with his wife(?) if the mortgage company decide he is the more juicy target for any outstanding debt after House repossession.

If you haven't put inplace a plan to repay the amount at the end of the interest only mortgage, you have massively increased the risk of your ex being in debt - arguably completely opposite to what is required in the court order.

I am trying to mortgage in my own name he is preventing me. I am trying to release him from the mortgage. He wont sign to let me. If he doesn’t sign I have no home so 3 people homeless. I am trying to prevent repossession so neither of us get bad credit. I will give him his % when the court order says its due which is not now. I dont want to remove his charge on land registry. He wanted to cash in our policy to cover mortgage not me. My repayment vehicle to to get a mortgage in my name solely to pay off the current mortgage release him from that and take out a fresh mortgage in my name but he wont sign any paperwork. I am trying to move this forward to adhere to the order. He just refusing to let me. I’m not in breach I am trying to adhere to the order and get a mortgage to pay off the current mortgage with his name on. 

The problem is his charge on the Land Registry. I suspect the paperwork you want him to sign is agreeing to the charge becoming secondary to your new mortgage.

Look at it from his point of view - you've had 21 years to sort it out and your youngest "child" is now 21years old, if not 22 - in those 21 years, he has been unable to get a mortgage in his own name and he has had no use or benefit from his 30% share of the property - how much of a return would he have had on that 30% if invested?

And now to top it off, you've had 21 years to take out a repayment vehicle which you have failed to do. You seem unable to take any responsibility yourself and frankly it sounds like you've been pretty financially exploitative to him - an example - you blaming him for cashing in the Policy - presumably 21 years ago?! Yet despite knowing it's an interest only mortgage you've not put anything else inplace ready for when the loan comes sue?

Let's be honest - your remortgaging because you have no choice. It has nothing to do with getting him off the mortgage - your original loan is now due and in order to extend the terms - changing the original contract - you need his permission & signature. Likewise to remortgage. If it wasn't for that, you'd have happily continued with him tied to the mortgage for YOUR house - regardless of the impact it has on his ability to live his life.

Not trying to be difficult - but I suspect the above is probably how he views the situation and I think you probably do need to understand that so you can understand his motivations - and now because of your failure to put inplace an alternative repayment vehicle, at the time when the mortgage should be repaid back 100% (meaning he'd come off the mortgage anyway), instead your asking him to sacrifice his claim on his 30% of the house in the event you default & the house gets repossessed - since if he signs that paperwork, the mortgage takes priority over his charge.

So where he should have a 30% claim on the house, safe in the knowledge all debts are settled... due to your failure, he's been asked to weaken his claim.

That's the reality he is facing - and this isn't even touching on his not unrealistic expectation to have seen his 30% by now (all your kids are over 21years old!) - back when that court order was signed, far fewer people went to university & even fewer did master degrees! It was poorly worded - there should have been an fixed end date.

The alternative course of action is simple for him - he refuses to sign and forces a repossession - a sale of the house, which then triggers the court order and he gets his 30%.

Right now he's effectively paying to support you and 3 other adults - and it *is* a payment since by not getting his 30%, he's loosing out on any return from that 30% (I.e. if 30% is worth £80,000, a 5% interest on £80,000 is £4000 a year he's loosing, as an example). 

I suspect any legal advice you get will tell you you have no hope of winning - a court will probably look on you extremely negatively given you haven't made any attempt to get him off the remortgage at all - quite literally leaving it to the end of the original mortgage term when the mortgage should be GONE. How is that not a breach of the court order? 

Keep in mind if it comes to a repossession it's you who will suffer - your ex is going to have his house he & his wife have, whilst you & your "kids" (adults) will be homeless - you'll have no prospect of home ownership again since it will show the default on your mortgage report for 6 years, by which point will you still be young enough for a mortgage?

Your ex is probably also wondering why if your remortgaging to pay the original amount back why you won't simply remortgage & pay him his 30% back now? Since the earlier you do it, the less it will be (if house prices rose by 5% each year, his 30% will go up by 5%). He is probably (accurately I suspect) guessing that you actually *can't* remortgage to cover his share - meaning he has no prospect of ever seeing that 30% unless you sell the house, which he probably thinks is unlikely and will therefore need an expensive court battle to enforce....

.... when the alternative is he simply does *nothing*, sits back and watches the repossession take place, getting his 30%?

It really is a no brainer for him - no expensive legal fee's for an extensive court battle in a few years to force you to sell, instead just a relatively modest hit to his 30% value due to YOUR property being repossessed and sold at auction, slightly below market value - plus the legal fee's for the repossession, but those would be deducted from the sale & therefore effectively split on a 70% you 30% him basis - far cheaper than the 100% costs he will carry to force the house sale.

Bonus points no doubt for seeing you homeless, suffering and barred from home ownership whilst he gets to enjoy his house with his wife, probably even more so if he uses his 30% equity from your house to pay off a chunk on his house...

Again - I m just trying to get you to see things from his perspective so you cam hopefully factor it in.

With the above in mind, i would strongly encourage you to compromise - you really are in a bad position whilst he is in an extremely strong one.

Hoenir

In the decade long era of low interest rates there would have been an opportunity to repay some of the capital owing on the mortgage. You would have been reminded some years ago that the interest only mortgage you have would need repaying. The fact that the lender is now unable to help shouldn't be any great surprise as a result. 

DE_612183

I suspect what you should do is work out what equity is in the property - say £100,000 - take 70% of that ( 70k ) add that to whatever you can borrow - and that dictates what property price you should look to pay.

You should also NOT go down the route of interest free - I'm guessing that after 21 years you are possibly mid-40's or older ( maybe younger ) - but you need to ensure that by the time you are 65(ish) the mortgage is fully paid off.

Exodi

ian1246 said:
(I.e. if 30% is worth £80,000, a 5% interest on £80,000 is £4000 a year he's loosing, as an example). 

DE_612183 said:

I suspect what you should do is work out what equity is in the property - say £100,000 - take 70% of that ( 70k ) add that to whatever you can borrow - and that dictates what property price you should look to pay.

The OP suggested earlier that his 30% equity is valued around £60k (so total equity of £200k) (but agree with your comment).

Helpplease2024 said:

He has told the bank he will sign nithing ntil he is guaranteed his 30%! The mesher order is so unfair but it is a court order so what can I do. He has got away without paying anything towards the property but yet walks away with potentially £60,000

MWT

Helpplease2024 said:

I will give him his % when the court order says its due which is not now. I dont want to remove his charge on land registry. He wanted to cash in our policy to cover mortgage not me.

Just a couple of points prompted by the additional details, the 'policy' you refer to, was that something that existed in the past and was cashed in before you split, or is it still in existence now?

Regarding the charge in his favour, it is not that you want to remove it, it is that you need him to agree to having it moved to second place to your new mortgage. It is already in second place to your current mortgage and although your settlement agreement made provision for you selling and buying elsewhere, it did not provide for you remortgaging your current property, nor did it place any obligations on him to facilitate the removal and replacement of the charge. Poorly worded would be a fair description.

 

 

Helpplease2024

With a lower income I can only borrow so much currently. There are health issues involved I am not going to get into. I want to borrow enough to buy him out. If anyone can recommend a good mortgage broker fire ahead.