Moving to UC in ESA contributions based support group will I still need a fit note from GP?

tomtom256

It won't be reviewed straightaway, the decision will pull over and if the period given be the assessor has passed, then a reassessment may start.
However, still a back log in various areas with reassessments so unlikely to happen anytime soon.
There may be a slight delay in the  decision being pulled over, so be sure to tell them, so that they can check and make any easements until notified, as the communication is poor internally with the DWP.

xxxxxxxx

HillStreetBlues said:

What's the time-frame of "straightaway"? Day after? week after? month after?

Depends on what you are asking. 
1st, how long from start of UC until UC puts the ESA 'carry over' LCW/RA onto UC?... does the claimant ask for it to be done?  This can be done within a week or usually within a month, or can be done 2 years later.

2nd, after the LCW/RA 'carry over' has been applied to UC, how long till they are referred for assessment?  It is usually done on the same day, if it is not done on the same day, then according to current working practice it will never be done unless the claimant requests it or the government changes the working practice.

3rd, after the claimant has been referred for assessment, how long until the health report is written?  It is usually within 3 months, it can take a lot longer dependent on the claimant returning the questionnaire/attending the appointment or CHDA availability for appointments. could take up to 2 years

4th after the health report is written, how long to a decision? 1 week to 2 years dependent on events.

HillStreetBlues

xxxxxxxx said:

HillStreetBlues said:

What's the time-frame of "straightaway"? Day after? week after? month after?

Depends on what you are asking. 
1st, how long from start of UC until UC puts the ESA 'carry over' LCW/RA onto UC?... does the claimant ask for it to be done?  This can be done within a week or usually within a month, or can be done 2 years later.

2nd, after the LCW/RA 'carry over' has been applied to UC, how long till they are referred for assessment?  It is usually done on the same day, if it is not done on the same day, then according to current working practice it will never be done unless the claimant requests it or the government changes the working practice.

3rd, after the claimant has been referred for assessment, how long until the health report is written?  It is usually within 3 months, it can take a lot longer dependent on the claimant returning the questionnaire/attending the appointment or CHDA availability for appointments. could take up to 2 years

4th after the health report is written, how long to a decision? 1 week to 2 years dependent on events.

You stated "straightaway" so was enquiring what you meant. It now seems a fuller answer was needed than just "straightaway", as I felt in your post it didn't have any real meaning as there would be variable factors.

xxxxxxxx

I meant straightaway as in... the theory would be that as a result of claiming UC from ESA  new UC claimants are usually put forward for reassessment straightaway at the start of the UC claim,  the process begins theoretically at the start of the new UC claim.

i.e. usually the ESA decision is applied to the UC claim within a month of the new UC claim being made, and on the same day a new health referral is made.  And usually 3 months later, there will be a health report and usually within 2 months of that report, a new decision is applied,... and if it is LCWRA it should be applied from the start of the UC claim with no RP.

Spoonie_Turtle

xxxxxxxx said:

I meant straightaway as in... the theory would be that as a result of claiming UC from ESA  new UC claimants are usually put forward for reassessment straightaway at the start of the UC claim,  the process begins theoretically at the start of the new UC claim.

i.e. usually the ESA decision is applied to the UC claim within a month of the new UC claim being made, and on the same day a new health referral is made.  And usually 3 months later, there will be a health report and usually within 2 months of that report, a new decision is applied,... and if it is LCWRA it should be applied from the start of the UC claim with no RP.

Where is this theory from?  Has this actually happened beyond perhaps isolated cases which could well just be coincidence?

Newcad

Where are you getting this idea that if a reassessment is overdue in ESA then moving to UC will trigger an immediate reassessment?

It just doesn't happen, isn't happening.

It's the same (re)assessment, done by the same assessment provider, with the same backlog and not enogh time to do reassessments - so they are concentrating on brand new first time assessments..
Migrating to UC doesn't change that in the slightest.

At the moment for both ESA and UC they are only doing brand new first time, 'never had one before', assessments - and reassessments if someone who is already in a group notifies a change of circumstances with their health (and insists on having one because their capabilities have got worse).

They may try to fit in a few of the outstanding reassessments if they have time, but that's nothing to do with migrating to UC.

The 'start of claim or 3 AP waiting' stuff that you are talking about above would only apply to someone migrating from ESA who hasn't yet had an assessment at all.
Once they do get their first group award then that will be backdated from week 14 of their ESA claim and then from the start of their UC claim.

PS. My ESA reassessment was due in 2019, I've since migrated myself from ESA to UC in 2021 with my Limited Capability award just carrying over as it should do, my Work Capability reassessment due in 2019 was overdue by about 2 years when I migrated and is still overdue now.

Muttleythefrog

xxxxxxxx said:

I meant straightaway as in... the theory would be that as a result of claiming UC from ESA  new UC claimants are usually put forward for reassessment straightaway at the start of the UC claim,  the process begins theoretically at the start of the new UC claim.

i.e. usually the ESA decision is applied to the UC claim within a month of the new UC claim being made, and on the same day a new health referral is made.  And usually 3 months later, there will be a health report and usually within 2 months of that report, a new decision is applied,... and if it is LCWRA it should be applied from the start of the UC claim with no RP.

I've read your posts carefully to make sure I'm not misreading.. and like others are a little confused. I am not sure this is what happens but always happy to be corrected. My understanding is the status for WCA will be transferred across and any review schedule determined by what already exists (Re: ESA claim)... rather than a claim for UC triggering a review. Where are you picking up details that a review is ordered for UC claimants when their WCA status is transferred in?

xxxxxxxx

Hello Muttley,
You can get an immediate review if:
*ESA is overdue for review, which means, if the ESA decision made in 2018 set the review for 2 years, it would now be overdue.
*The decision maker who adds the award onto UC (from ESA) decides it should be reviewed. This applies if ESA was overdue or not.

As with anything, what individual cogs in the machine do is not always the same, so you might have the ESA office send the wrong ESA review date to UC, (for example, ESA might send the current postponed review date rather than the original review date). Or you might have UC DMs more inclined than others to order an immediate review. 

Newcad

Again that is not what is happening - because of the backlogs.

OK, an ESA or UC Decision Maker can decide to refer for reassessment at any time.
So normally if a reassment was overdue at the point of migration from ESA to UC then a UC DM mght decide to do that referral.

But you have to be practical and if they started to refer all overdue WCA reassessments on migration from ESA to UC then the assessment providers would not be able to cope - so they just don't do it.

We are basically in the same situation now as we were in 2013-2016, with no WCA reassments being done except for changes of circumstance - because the assessment providers can barely cope with first time/new claim ones that they are getting.
Even with switching the majority of first time/new claim WCA's that they are doing from Face-to-Face assessments to telephone assessments they still don't have the required capacity.
(Straying into policy for a second that's one of the real reasons they want to scrap them altogether).

Also remember that if there were no WCA backlog then nobody would be overdue for one anyway at migration from ESA to UC.

Migration from ESA to UC does not in itself 'trigger' a WCA re-assessment.
It never has done, and the UC legislation says that it doesent, the status from ESA carries over.
You may (will be) be overdue for one, most Limited Capability claimants are by this stage - but even if you are overdue for a WCA reassessment the assessment providers just simply do not have the capacity to do them; so UC doesn't refer you for one.

poppy12345

xxxxxxxx said:

Hello Muttley,
You can get an immediate review if:
*ESA is overdue for review, which means, if the ESA decision made in 2018 set the review for 2 years, it would now be overdue.
*The decision maker who adds the award onto UC (from ESA) decides it should be reviewed. This applies if ESA was overdue or not.

As with anything, what individual cogs in the machine do is not always the same, so you might have the ESA office send the wrong ESA review date to UC, (for example, ESA might send the current postponed review date rather than the original review date). Or you might have UC DMs more inclined than others to order an immediate review. 

The point is that a review is not overdue because the timescale they give is just a guide and doesn't mean you will be reviewed at that time. LCWRA/Support Group are ongoing awards until a new decision says otherwise. I also believe for the majority of people that reviews for those with LCWRA and Support Group are still suspended. 

I've heard of many people that claimed UC from ESA back in 2018 and 19 and still not had a review.