Appealing job interview after rejection

bobblebob

So a friend of mine has been doing an NHS role for 18 months on a secondment basis. They got the funding to make it permanent so they said you can apply to get it permanently. Bit annoying she had to apply for her own job but guess they have to do it all official. Shes good at her job, management are happy with he so we all thought it was just a formality really. 

She got an interview and one of the questions asked was "please can you describe the differences between your current role and this role your applying for?"

She said well i cant really answer that I've been doing the role for 18 month, there is no differences to my current role. As questions are score based, she will have received zero points of that question. In my opinion you cant ask that question to someone who is doing the role, its not fair and discriminates against her. Her current manager was on the interview panel so they knew the situation, and also it was mentioned in her application

Shes found out she didnt get the job, and she suspects its because she couldnt answer this question. I said to her ask for the interview scoring sheet they used and if thats the case, does she have ground to appeal to HR? 

marcia_

bobblebob said:

So a friend of mine has been doing an NHS role for 18 months on a secondment basis. They got the funding to make it permanent so they said you can apply to get it permanently. Bit annoying she had to apply for her own job but guess they have to do it all official. Shes good at her job, management are happy with he so we all thought it was just a formality really. 

She got an interview and one of the questions asked was "please can you describe the differences between your current role and this role your applying for?"

She said well i cant really answer that I've been doing the role for 18 month, there is no differences to my current role. As questions are score based, she will have received zero points of that question. In my opinion you cant ask that question to someone who is doing the role, its not fair and discriminates against her. Her current manager was on the interview panel so they knew the situation, and also it was mentioned in her application

Shes found out she didnt get the job, and she suspects its because she couldnt answer this question. I said to her ask for the interview scoring sheet they used and if thats the case, does she have ground to appeal to HR? 

 Yes she can make a subject access request for the scoring sheet if they wont hand it over after requesting it. 

 I would make an appeal. 

Undervalued

bobblebob said:

So a friend of mine has been doing an NHS role for 18 months on a secondment basis. They got the funding to make it permanent so they said you can apply to get it permanently. Bit annoying she had to apply for her own job but guess they have to do it all official. Shes good at her job, management are happy with he so we all thought it was just a formality really. 

She got an interview and one of the questions asked was "please can you describe the differences between your current role and this role your applying for?"

She said well i cant really answer that I've been doing the role for 18 month, there is no differences to my current role. As questions are score based, she will have received zero points of that question. In my opinion you cant ask that question to someone who is doing the role, its not fair and discriminates against her. Her current manager was on the interview panel so they knew the situation, and also it was mentioned in her application

Shes found out she didnt get the job, and she suspects its because she couldnt answer this question. I said to her ask for the interview scoring sheet they used and if thats the case, does she have ground to appeal to HR? 

I don't know how often it has to be said on this forum but.....

"Discrimination" is perfectly lawful unless it is on one of the handful or grounds prohibited by law.

Virtually all aspects of employment involve "discrimination" such as who to appoint, who to promote, who to award a pay rise. Nothing says it has to be the highest qualified candidate.

HR are not a neutral arbiter. They are there to do the management's bidding, not to overrule them. 

bobblebob

Undervalued said:

bobblebob said:

So a friend of mine has been doing an NHS role for 18 months on a secondment basis. They got the funding to make it permanent so they said you can apply to get it permanently. Bit annoying she had to apply for her own job but guess they have to do it all official. Shes good at her job, management are happy with he so we all thought it was just a formality really. 

She got an interview and one of the questions asked was "please can you describe the differences between your current role and this role your applying for?"

She said well i cant really answer that I've been doing the role for 18 month, there is no differences to my current role. As questions are score based, she will have received zero points of that question. In my opinion you cant ask that question to someone who is doing the role, its not fair and discriminates against her. Her current manager was on the interview panel so they knew the situation, and also it was mentioned in her application

Shes found out she didnt get the job, and she suspects its because she couldnt answer this question. I said to her ask for the interview scoring sheet they used and if thats the case, does she have ground to appeal to HR? 

I don't know how often it has to be said on this forum but.....

"Discrimination" is perfectly lawful unless it is on one of the handful or grounds prohibited by law.

Virtually all aspects of employment involve "discrimination" such as who to appoint, who to promote, who to award a pay rise. Nothing says it has to be the highest qualified candidate.

HR are not a neutral arbiter. They are there to do the management's bidding, not to overrule them. 

Fair enough that might have been the wrong word, but when you get asked a question in an interview you physically cannot answer through no fault of your own that doesnt seem very fair

LightFlare

bobblebob said:

So a friend of mine has been doing an NHS role for 18 months on a secondment basis. They got the funding to make it permanent so they said you can apply to get it permanently. Bit annoying she had to apply for her own job  - It was a secondment, so not "hers" but guess they have to do it all official. Shes good at her job, management are happy with he so we all thought it was just a formality really. 

Rarely is

She got an interview and one of the questions asked was "please can you describe the differences between your current role -- easy to replace with her substantive role and this role your applying for?"

She said well i cant really answer that I've been doing the role for 18 month, there is no differences to my current role. As questions are score based, she will have received zero points of that question - not necessarily . In my opinion you cant ask that question to someone who is doing the role, its not fair and discriminates against her. Her current manager was on the interview panel so they knew the situation, and also it was mentioned in her application

Shes found out she didnt get the job, and she suspects its because she couldnt - see below answer this question. I said to her ask for the interview scoring sheet they used and if thats the case, does she have ground to appeal to HR? 

Imo - there was still an answer to be made from that question.

She could have explained how different from her previous role (substantive) this one was -- stating any particular sucesses shes had, whats shes learnt, what she can offer, what shes brought to the role etc etc

If the points are that close (depends on the marking scheme) - there may be a case. BUT if there is another, or more questions where she scored less, then no case to be made

Elliott.T123

She can try to appeal all she wants, it will go nowhere and they have done absolutely nothing wrong with the process. They can hire whoever they want to as long as no legal discrimination takes place.

HR will have less than zero interest in this, HR are not there to help employees, HR are there to protect the company/organisation/management from lawsuits

Undervalued

bobblebob said:

Undervalued said:

bobblebob said:

So a friend of mine has been doing an NHS role for 18 months on a secondment basis. They got the funding to make it permanent so they said you can apply to get it permanently. Bit annoying she had to apply for her own job but guess they have to do it all official. Shes good at her job, management are happy with he so we all thought it was just a formality really. 

She got an interview and one of the questions asked was "please can you describe the differences between your current role and this role your applying for?"

She said well i cant really answer that I've been doing the role for 18 month, there is no differences to my current role. As questions are score based, she will have received zero points of that question. In my opinion you cant ask that question to someone who is doing the role, its not fair and discriminates against her. Her current manager was on the interview panel so they knew the situation, and also it was mentioned in her application

Shes found out she didnt get the job, and she suspects its because she couldnt answer this question. I said to her ask for the interview scoring sheet they used and if thats the case, does she have ground to appeal to HR? 

I don't know how often it has to be said on this forum but.....

"Discrimination" is perfectly lawful unless it is on one of the handful or grounds prohibited by law.

Virtually all aspects of employment involve "discrimination" such as who to appoint, who to promote, who to award a pay rise. Nothing says it has to be the highest qualified candidate.

HR are not a neutral arbiter. They are there to do the management's bidding, not to overrule them. 

Fair enough that might have been the wrong word, but when you get asked a question in an interview you physically cannot answer through no fault of your own that doesnt seem very fair

Maybe, but it doesn't have to be "fair", only lawful.

Unless she genuinely believes that there has been unlawful discrimination (e.g race, gender etc) demonstrating that she was the best candidate on certain criteria doesn't mean she has to be offered the job.

saajan_12

bobblebob said:

...
As questions are score based, she will have received zero points of that question. In my opinion you cant ask that question to someone who is doing the role, its not fair and discriminates against her. 
...
Shes found out she didnt get the job, and she suspects its because she couldnt answer this question. I said to her ask for the interview scoring sheet they used and if thats the case, does she have ground to appeal to HR? 

So she doesn't know it was because of that question? Sounds fairly unlikely to be that robotic. 
Worth asking her manager if it was just that and potentially easier than a SAR. It may well just be other questions on soft skills or how interested she seemed etc. 

bobblebob

saajan_12 said:

bobblebob said:

...
As questions are score based, she will have received zero points of that question. In my opinion you cant ask that question to someone who is doing the role, its not fair and discriminates against her. 
...
Shes found out she didnt get the job, and she suspects its because she couldnt answer this question. I said to her ask for the interview scoring sheet they used and if thats the case, does she have ground to appeal to HR? 

So she doesn't know it was because of that question? Sounds fairly unlikely to be that robotic. 
Worth asking her manager if it was just that and potentially easier than a SAR. It may well just be other questions on soft skills or how interested she seemed etc. 

Not yet but she said she feels she answered all other questions well as they directly relate to the job, which of course she knows inside out doing it for 18 months. She is going to ask though

LightFlare

Being brutal -- if shes been in the role for 18 months, then she started with a massive advantage over all other applicants.

Its unlikely that she lost out on just one question

Undervalued

bobblebob said:

saajan_12 said:

bobblebob said:

...
As questions are score based, she will have received zero points of that question. In my opinion you cant ask that question to someone who is doing the role, its not fair and discriminates against her. 
...
Shes found out she didnt get the job, and she suspects its because she couldnt answer this question. I said to her ask for the interview scoring sheet they used and if thats the case, does she have ground to appeal to HR? 

So she doesn't know it was because of that question? Sounds fairly unlikely to be that robotic. 
Worth asking her manager if it was just that and potentially easier than a SAR. It may well just be other questions on soft skills or how interested she seemed etc. 

Not yet but she said she feels she answered all other questions well as they directly relate to the job, which of course she knows inside out doing it for 18 months. She is going to ask though

Maybe she did, although (also to be brutal) self praise is no recommendation.

Maybe they are looking for somebody with potential beyond her current position or maybe another candidate applied who was far better qualified?