Service charge for communal Flora areas

Trout69

I've been recommended to post here also.

My Mum has rented a council house for over 40 years now, I was brought up there. Recently the housing association has added a 'service charge' to maintain the so-called bushy areas on the road. The road is now pretty much privately owned, I think out of 40 houses there may be 8 that are still council.

Why is the landscaping cost only charged to those who still rent from the local housing association on this road (it may happen on other roads in my district)? Surely a service cost should apply to all residents?

This is public land and in my opinion should be covered with council tax. The council maintain grass verges, roundabouts and many other public spaces in my village.

Something isn't sitting well with this. There has been many other issues but this one seems a bit underhand.

Trout69

My Mum has rented a council house for over 40 years now, I was brought up there. Recently the housing association has added a 'service charge' to maintain the so-called bushy areas on the road. The road is now pretty much privately owned, I think out of 40 houses there may be 8 that are still council.

Why is the landscaping cost only charged to those who still rent from the local housing association on this road (it may happen on other roads in my district)? Surely a service cost should apply to all residents?

This is public land and in my opinion should be covered with council tax. The council maintain grass verges, roundabouts and many other public spaces in my village.

Something isn't sitting well with this. There has been many other issues but this one seems a bit underhand.

poppy12345

You've posted in the welfare benefit section. You would  be better posting in the housing, renting, selling section.https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/categories/house-buying-renting-selling

Robhfds

Could you maybe write to the housing association and ask this question to them. They may be asking for this amount from home owners too, or do you know for sure they're just charging council tenants?  May be worth looking at the tenancy agreement that your mum has and if there's anything there that would allow this charge. If it is allowed, might be worth asking for a breakdown of exactly what the charge is paying for. If it's for plants and grass trimming then maybe the homes could get together and do it themselves.  It really all depends on that tenancy agreement. If need arises maybe you could get advice from your local Citizens Advice office.

Trout69

Robhfds said:

Could you maybe write to the housing association and ask this question to them. They may be asking for this amount from home owners too, or do you know for sure they're just charging council tenants?  May be worth looking at the tenancy agreement that your mum has and if there's anything there that would allow this charge. If it is allowed, might be worth asking for a breakdown of exactly what the charge is paying for. If it's for plants and grass trimming then maybe the homes could get together and do it themselves.  It really all depends on that tenancy agreement. If need arises maybe you could get advice from your local Citizens Advice office.

Thank you for your reply, my Mum has spoken to her neighbours who have purchased their properties from the council and they were shocked and had no idea. It's a very trivial amount but it's the first I have heard of a 'service' charge for council properties. It's a 'Close' made up of 3 bed houses council built in 1980 ish, all identical. In the grand scheme of things it isn't a lot per year (more than I pay for my allotment) but it still sounds off when it's only council tenants that have this service charge.

The HA has changed hands so many times in the last 40 years, that there does not seem to be a legally signed tenancy. When questioned it's a very BBB situation.

fatbelly

I think your local councillor should get involved. Input your postcode here and a template email is generated.

https://www.writetothem.com/

eddddy

Are you sure that it's just the 8 council tenants that are contributing - and not the other 32 privately owned houses as well?

And is your mum being asked to contribute 1/8th of the maintenance costs or 1/40th? (Assuming there are 40 houses on the road.)

But more generally, I'll leave others to say whether council tenants can 'suddenly' become liable for a service charge after 40 years - because I don't know.




FWIW, these days, when a council house is sold, the council would ensure that the buyer signs a deed agreeing to pay a service charge (for maintenance of communal areas etc).

But some people say that in the early days, when council houses were sold, the councils weren't savvy enough to get a deed signed.

So it could even be that some house owners pay a service charge and others don't. But even then, those that pay a service charge should only really pay 1/40th of the costs.

pjs493

I have family members who live in houses that were once council houses but they bought them privately. The housing estate they live on was always a mix of council tenants and private owners, but over the years many of the council houses were bought by tenants from the council and subsequently sold on. All the communal areas, and front gardens that aren’t fenced in, are maintained by the council. 

I assume council tax covers the cost of this maintenance. When I visited recently I noticed that a lot more landscaping was in place than previously such as attractive features, flower beds and a lovely large stone carved with the name of the estate as one enters it from the main road. It certainly looks more appealing than it did 30 years ago. None of them have been charged for any of this improvement work. I suspect the council just has the extra money to improve the area. 

As someone has stated above, write to the local councillor, ask if there was a consultation period and what the rationale is for the charge. One thing to note, I believe, although I could be wrong, that if the occupant is on certain benefits, service charges are taken into account when working out their entitlement. So it may be that they are able to have any benefits adjusted to cover the cost of this new charge. 

Trout69

eddddy said:

Are you sure that it's just the 8 council tenants that are contributing - and not the other 32 privately owned houses as well?

And is your mum being asked to contribute 1/8th of the maintenance costs or 1/40th? (Assuming there are 40 houses on the road.)

But more generally, I'll leave others to say whether council tenants can 'suddenly' become liable for a service charge after 40 years - because I don't know.




FWIW, these days, when a council house is sold, the council would ensure that the buyer signs a deed agreeing to pay a service charge (for maintenance of communal areas etc).

But some people say that in the early days, when council houses were sold, the councils weren't savvy enough to do this.

So it could even be that some house owners pay a service charge and others don't. But even then, those that pay a service charge should only really pay 1/40th of the costs.

Yes, the service charge is only applied to the rental amount of the council tenants. The houses were all built around 1980, my Mum moved in around 1984. Through the years most have been privately bought. It's quite a close knit community so when the service charge was added maybe 2-3 years ago my Mum discussed it with both of her direct neighbours, one is a council tenant the other is private. The privately owned house didn't know anything about it. Neither did the other private owners who we've known since the 80's, who purchased their properties from the Council.

I'd like to think the HA must have checked the legality of it, but as things stand lately I'm not too sure. I'd really like to get some more information on it. I've sent an email to the HA questioning it so will post back if i get a response. I'm doubtful I will.

eddddy

Just to emphasize, a Service Charge will almost always be a percentage (or fraction) of the the actual amount spent by the HA.

So, for a simple example, the calculation might be:

Cost of Gardeners and plants: £3700
Admin costs: £300
--------------------------------
Total cost : £4000

40 houses in the street, so each house should be paying 1/40th = £100

(But typically, you pay an estimated amount during the year, and it's adjusted at the end of the year.)


So if it's determined that your mum has to pay a service charge, you can check that it's being calculated correctly and fairly.

If other houses aren't paying (for whatever reason), it shouldn't mean that your mum has to pay more to cover the shortfall.

BarelySentientAI

eddddy said:

40 houses in the street, so each house should be paying 1/40th = £100

Not true.  HA expense should not be covered by non-HA property owners unless there was a covenant in the sale requiring contribution.

eddddy said:

If other houses aren't paying (for whatever reason), it shouldn't mean that your mum has to pay more to cover the shortfall.

If the other eligible houses aren't paying, this is true.  If houses that don't have any obligation don't pay, well they shouldn't have been anyway.