Response from Ford Credit

Crln

I have received a response from Ford Credit re the commission agreement, but it states they are not able to tell me whether the agreement between them and dealer included discretionary commission.  Has anyone else had a reply like this, and what are the next steps.  They have just told me to go to the Ombudsman if I'm not happy with the response.

Nasqueron

Crln said:

I have received a response from Ford Credit re the commission agreement, but it states they are not able to tell me whether the agreement between them and dealer included discretionary commission.  Has anyone else had a reply like this, and what are the next steps.  They have just told me to go to the Ombudsman if I'm not happy with the response.

They have no records by the sounds of it. Did you provide them with anything like agreement numbers, paperwork etc?

They have to offer you the FOS referral option but the FOS can't force them to repay something they have no evidence of.

DullGreyGuy

Unless you have evidence that they did pay a DCA then you wait until the FCA complete their investigation and issue their instructions. Given the timescales involved there are gong to be vast number of cases where records no longer exist and the FCA will have to give guidance on what it expects to happen in these cases. 

Nasqueron said:
 the FOS can't force them to repay something they have no evidence of.

The FOS can and do base decisions on evidence provided by both parties and will consider what most likely happened in the absence of complete evidence from both parties. So again if the OP does have evidence they were negatively impacted by DCA the FOS could rule against the finance company despite the finance company saying they no longer hold records. 

Of cause the OP has no evidence the DCA even applied to their agreement let alone if it was positive or negative; they are just a victim of MSE red top journalism to whip the masses into a blood frenzy but that doesn't change the principle.

Nasqueron

DullGreyGuy said:

Unless you have evidence that they did pay a DCA then you wait until the FCA complete their investigation and issue their instructions. Given the timescales involved there are gong to be vast number of cases where records no longer exist and the FCA will have to give guidance on what it expects to happen in these cases. 

Nasqueron said:
 the FOS can't force them to repay something they have no evidence of.

The FOS can and do base decisions on evidence provided by both parties and will consider what most likely happened in the absence of complete evidence from both parties. So again if the OP does have evidence they were negatively impacted by DCA the FOS could rule against the finance company despite the finance company saying they no longer hold records. 

Of cause the OP has no evidence the DCA even applied to their agreement let alone if it was positive or negative; they are just a victim of MSE red top journalism to whip the masses into a blood frenzy but that doesn't change the principle.

Selectively quoting a post to make it seem like I said something different is against the forum rules

DullGreyGuy

Nasqueron said:

DullGreyGuy said:

Unless you have evidence that they did pay a DCA then you wait until the FCA complete their investigation and issue their instructions. Given the timescales involved there are gong to be vast number of cases where records no longer exist and the FCA will have to give guidance on what it expects to happen in these cases. 

Nasqueron said:
 the FOS can't force them to repay something they have no evidence of.

The FOS can and do base decisions on evidence provided by both parties and will consider what most likely happened in the absence of complete evidence from both parties. So again if the OP does have evidence they were negatively impacted by DCA the FOS could rule against the finance company despite the finance company saying they no longer hold records. 

Of cause the OP has no evidence the DCA even applied to their agreement let alone if it was positive or negative; they are just a victim of MSE red top journalism to whip the masses into a blood frenzy but that doesn't change the principle.

Selectively quoting a post to make it seem like I said something different is against the forum rules

Then report the post, though dont see how it changed the meaning, all I trimmed of the paragraph is that they have informed the OP of their FOS rights which is irrelevant to how the FOS may respond to a complaint where the complainant has evidence but the the financial company no longer has records. 

robomd85

I’ve had the exact same response to all 4 of my complaints to Ford credit, I find it a bit perplexing Santander where categorical in saying there wasn’t one but this seems to suggest Ford did use them and can’t say for certain if they had one in place or not!
Strikes me as a very easy get out if all they have to say is we can’t find a record so we don’t know and put the onus on me to prove they did, I also find it surprising given all the paperwork etc I had to sign that there is no record of this.
curious if anyone has had an affirmative response from Ford credit as yet?

dunstonh

I’ve had the exact same response to all 4 of my complaints to Ford credit, I find it a bit perplexing Santander where categorical in saying there wasn’t one but this seems to suggest Ford did use them and can’t say for certain if they had one in place or not!

Its possible that Ford credit had it available to use but cant tell if it was used.  Or if it was used, was it used positively or negatively.  DCA could be used to lower the rate and that is ok.

Strikes me as a very easy get out if all they have to say is we can’t find a record so we don’t know and put the onus on me to prove they did, I also find it surprising given all the paperwork etc I had to sign that there is no record of this.
curious if anyone has had an affirmative response from Ford credit as yet?

They may well find out in time.    People complaining now are jumping the gun rather than waiting for the FCA to complete their report.    Old records filed in a way that requires specific search criteria, could well be brought onto systems, as it was with PPI.   That will largely depend on the what the FCA put in their report.

Nasqueron

DullGreyGuy said:

Nasqueron said:

DullGreyGuy said:

Unless you have evidence that they did pay a DCA then you wait until the FCA complete their investigation and issue their instructions. Given the timescales involved there are gong to be vast number of cases where records no longer exist and the FCA will have to give guidance on what it expects to happen in these cases. 

Nasqueron said:
 the FOS can't force them to repay something they have no evidence of.

The FOS can and do base decisions on evidence provided by both parties and will consider what most likely happened in the absence of complete evidence from both parties. So again if the OP does have evidence they were negatively impacted by DCA the FOS could rule against the finance company despite the finance company saying they no longer hold records. 

Of cause the OP has no evidence the DCA even applied to their agreement let alone if it was positive or negative; they are just a victim of MSE red top journalism to whip the masses into a blood frenzy but that doesn't change the principle.

Selectively quoting a post to make it seem like I said something different is against the forum rules

Then report the post, though dont see how it changed the meaning, all I trimmed of the paragraph is that they have informed the OP of their FOS rights which is irrelevant to how the FOS may respond to a complaint where the complainant has evidence but the the financial company no longer has records. 

I am not reporting stuff on this forum because of my own reasons which would probably get me warned or suspended if I gave them

I am simply asking you to be courteous and quote the whole comment which explained the details. Your selective misquoting allowed you to reply "correcting" a comment by adding information that was covered in my complete post e.g. asking if the OP has documentation 

If there is no record of the deal with Ford and OP has no documentation, how could the FOS force Ford to repay something which they have no record of, including what costs were involved, particularly given DCA wasn't always used even among the same firm, wasn't always applicable to some dealers and wasn't always negative?

As I said, if there is no evidence and OP hasn't provided any of the deal, then the FOS cannot force Ford to repay something they don't know about.

hancoxrg

Crln said:

I have received a response from Ford Credit re the commission agreement, but it states they are not able to tell me whether the agreement between them and dealer included discretionary commission.  Has anyone else had a reply like this, and what are the next steps.  They have just told me to go to the Ombudsman if I'm not happy with the response.

I had an identical repsonse, my agreement only finished 12 months ago and they have the account information.  I believe Ford Credit are being purposely obstructive so they can see what te outcome is in September to the high court rulilng.

hancoxrg

I find it hard to believe that this wouldnt be recorded, otherwise how could they work out any commissions that were/had to be made to a dealer.  Mine has gone to the ombusdsman.

dunstonh

hancoxrg said:

Crln said:

I have received a response from Ford Credit re the commission agreement, but it states they are not able to tell me whether the agreement between them and dealer included discretionary commission.  Has anyone else had a reply like this, and what are the next steps.  They have just told me to go to the Ombudsman if I'm not happy with the response.

I had an identical repsonse, my agreement only finished 12 months ago and they have the account information.  I believe Ford Credit are being purposely obstructive so they can see what te outcome is in September to the high court rulilng.

You are wrong.

a) There is no high court ruling coming
b) The complaints process on DCA is suspended until the FCA publish their report. 
c) current information from the FCA is that they are finding many companies are having problems with historic data and the September publishing may be pushed back further.

They don't have to do anything until then.

I find it hard to believe that this wouldnt be recorded, otherwise how could they work out any commissions that were/had to be made to a dealer.  Mine has gone to the ombusdsman.

The FOS are not acting on DCA complaints whilst the FCA has the suspension in place.   

Data protection laws require the destruction of data that is no longer required.    The regulator has its own guidelines on this too.   So, data being destroyed is expected.        It is possible to have DCA that is used positively and DCA that was used negatively.   And where it was available, it wouldn't have been used with everyone.   So, unless they have specifics about an individual, they won't know if it was used or not.