OPS Worthing x 2

sully62

My wife managed to get two Parking Charge Notices from OPS for parking in Worthing whilst delivery driving for Just Eat.

On both occasions, the time the car was observed was very small - 5 minutes and 9 seconds on one and 2 minutes 14 seconds on the second. The photos provided show that she left the the car on the shorter one and dropped a passenger and waited for the longer one.

We submitted appeals to OPS, which were obviously rejected, but then missed the deadline for a POPLA appeal. Is this a big issue?

Both locations seem to be well signed, but I'm not sure how big the big letters advising the "charge" need to be - they don't look big to me, though larger than the text around them.

So just a few quick questions really, before I put all the details up:

1. Is the POPLA appeal critical and have we messed up by not submitting it?

2. Is the period so ridiculously short as to make a successful defence likely?

3. Is the lettering too small on the signs (see below)?

4. (Long shot) Do delivery drivers have any different allowances for parking bearing in mind they are usually able to move if required, but just need to do a job?

Fruitcake

Plan A is always a complaint to the landowner and your MP.

PoPLA codes last at least 32 days. Are you past that period? If so, then you need to go into ignore mode unless you get a letter of/before claim or a court claim.

Dropping off/picking up is not parking as determined in the Jopson v Homeguard appeal case.
The signs are forbidding and offer nothing to a motorist who does not have a permit, therefore no contract can be formed, therefore there can be no breach of contract.

sully62

Sadly, 32 days from the appeal response was 21 April.

Other relevant dates are:

Offence date 19/01/2024 (1) & 20/01/2024 (2)

PCN Sending dates both 16/02/2024

Appeals for both 17/03/2024

Appeal resonses both 20/03/2024

Thanks for the other notes and the speedy response. It looks like I will have something to hang my case on if I hear from them again.

I'll also try to find land owner details for both sites and write to my MP.

nopcns

If those dates you have stated are correct, neither of the PCNs can hold the keeper liable for the charge as they are not compliant with the strict requirements of PoFA.

Are you sure the "PCN sending dates" is for the original NtK and not a "Reminder"? If so, it's a pity that you missed the POPLA deadline as the could easily have been successfully appealed on that basis alone.

Unless you can get Plan A to work, you are going to have to wait until if/when an LoC is issued. Just safely ignore any and all debt collector letters.

All the above assumes that the drivers identity has not been revealed. Are you or your wife the RK?

sully62

Yes, those dates are correct.
Wife is the registered keeper. I used the standard appeal letter from this site, so no admission of driver has been made.
Thanks.

nopcns

In which case, as long as the keeper has not identified as the driver, they have no idea who was driving. Even with a close up CCTV picture of the driver, they have no way of identifying who that is. There is no legal obligation for the keeper to identify the driver.

Just wait out the debt collector letters and come back if/when the keeper receives an LoC. It is worthwhile re-reading the Newbies/FAQ thread, especially the second post which deals with LoC and claims. Plan A should still be pursued.

sully62

Brilliant. Thanks.

ParkingMad

The landowner of the Broadwater Street West car park is Selits Limited and the managing agent is Stiles Harold Williams. Both companies are owned by the same person (Selits = Stiles backwards). This car park was in the Channel 5 documentary Parking: The Big Con? also featuring our very own @Coupon-mad

https://www.channel5.com/show/parking-the-big-con


This car park has also been in the Sunday Times- 

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/one-parking-solutions-sucker-punch-didnt-knock-me-out-vcttbnjzt

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6221022/one-parking-solution-fine-parking-charge-notice/p1


Did the car drive past where Pay and Display is painted on the road (into the car park), or stop at the entrance by Starbucks? In the past OPS have issued PCNs to cars which have stopped or turned round in the entrance, which is part of the public highway, without actually going into the car park, which is on private land.

Which car park is the other PCN from? 

Coupon-mad

Please show us both sides of both PCNs with the locations and all dates showing (cover all personal data, VRM, car pics and QR codes).

Does the driver know that (apart from bus stops or taxi ranks, or on crossings or school zig-zags) you can park anywhere on street in Worthing to driver goods or drop off passengers?

@ParkingMad and I are both Sussex ladies and we are friends who fight OPS in court. My first ever hearing was in Worthing - a lovely lady Judge - and I've never lost.

Loading/unloading is what single and double yellow lines are for (some drivers don't know this).  It's 'exempt activity' so stay on street.  Can't get a PCN.

Never ever use a car park or side road with OPS black & white signs (look out for them and LEAVE).

Stay on the main street on a double yellow for all deliveries.

sully62

ParkingMad said:

The landowner of the Broadwater Street West car park is Stiles Harold Williams. This car park was in the Channel 5 documentary Parking: The Big Con? also featuring @Coupon-mad

Did the car drive past where Pay and Display is painted on the road (into the car park), or stop at the entrance by Starbucks? In the past OPS have issued PCNs to cars which have turned round in the entrance, which is part of the public highway, without going into the car park, which is on private land.

Which car park is the other PCN from? 

Thanks. I’ll watch the programme later.

Yes, the car went into the car park and turned round, then waited by the entrance for the passenger to re-appear (still beyond the painted lines and signage).

The other location is Ann Street, behind the Guildbourne Centre.

sully62

Coupon-mad said:

Please show us both sides of both PCNs with the locations and all dates showing (cover all personal data, VRM, car pics and QR codes).

Does the driver know that (apart from bus stops or taxi ranks, or on crossings or school zig-zags) you can park anywhere on street in Worthing to driver goods or drop off passengers?

@ParkingMad and I are both Sussex ladies and we are friends who fight OPS in court. My first ever hearing was in Worthing - a lovely lady Judge - and I've never lost.

Loading/unloading is what single and double yellow lines are for (some drivers don't know this).  It's 'exempt activity' so stay on street.  Can't get a PCN.

Never ever use a car park or side road with OPS black & white signs (look out for them and LEAVE).

Stay on the main street on a double yellow for all deliveries.

I will get the PCNs posted shortly. I had prepared them, but took all dates and times out (I thought some unscrupulous former clamper might work out who I was from that information), so will do another redaction.

I did think that deliveries were exempt from some rules but got confused by the over-zealous enforcement around Liverpool Gardens (double yellows), so will have another Google around those rules. Thanks for the heads up and the pointers. I'll let her know.

Our paths may have crossed previously. I had a case that was dropped after I had submitted my defence to the court a few years back. The helpful assistance I got came from someone on the BHA message board. I think it was for a PCN in Burgess Hill (but can't be certain, my wife had a habit of getting these regularly back in the day!).