Fuel Prices....

Stubod

Great to see that all the petrol stations have all put up their prices due to the "potential" war in the Middle East......best to get ine early and beat the rush.....

...oh, it looks like the threat of war is now over......but best to hike the prices just incase...

Phoenix72

Was there a point to this?

Petriix

If you want cheap fuel then get an EV. If you can charge at home then it's typically about 2p per mile. 

Grumpy_chap

Petriix said:

If you want cheap fuel then get an EV. If you can charge at home then it's typically about 2p per mile. 

That is a partial / optimistic claim only applicable for those with solar and / or time of use tarrifs.

Typical energy price cap rate currently 30 pence / kWh.
Typical 4 miles / kWh (which is the higher end of EV efficiency).
That makes 7.5 pence / mile.  Substantially more than 2 pence / mile.

(For completeness, my current electricity rate is 29.38 pence / kWh - I used the 30 pence figure for easier reading and easier mathematics.)

born_again

Which cars cost 7.5p a mile to run?

Even my old Hybrid @ 50 mpg was 12p a mile.

Grumpy_chap

born_again said:

Which cars cost 7.5p a mile to run?

Energy cost of an EV - electric cars

WellKnownSid

Grumpy_chap said:

That is a partial / optimistic claim only applicable for those with solar and / or time of use tarrifs.

Typical energy price cap rate currently 30 pence / kWh.
Typical 4 miles / kWh (which is the higher end of EV efficiency).
That makes 7.5 pence / mile.  Substantially more than 2 pence / mile.

(For completeness, my current electricity rate is 29.38 pence / kWh - I used the 30 pence figure for easier reading and easier mathematics.)

There are several “charge anytime” tariffs out there, and those of us that drive a sensible EV find 4 miles per kWh quite realistic.  The energy price cap is going down not up so it’s possible EV tariffs will drop further.

I am tempted by solar, but possibly a small wind turbine will be more practical in the winter months. And at night.

Either way - even with charging losses, under 3p per mile is easily achieved.

Arunmor

And how long until EVs take up their fair share of the income the government loses in lost fuel duty?

Some people even think they are being green driving an EV!

MattMattMattUK

Arunmor said:

And how long until EVs take up their fair share of the income the government loses in lost fuel duty?

There is no "fair share", the government will raise (or should, if it were fiscally competent) whatever taxes it needs to adequately fund the country.

Arunmor said:

Some people even think they are being green driving an EV!

It depends how you define green, but on pretty much every measure EVs are better for the environment over sustained period.

Petriix

Grumpy_chap said:

Petriix said:

If you want cheap fuel then get an EV. If you can charge at home then it's typically about 2p per mile. 

That is a partial / optimistic claim only applicable for those with solar and / or time of use tarrifs.

Typical energy price cap rate currently 30 pence / kWh.
Typical 4 miles / kWh (which is the higher end of EV efficiency).
That makes 7.5 pence / mile.  Substantially more than 2 pence / mile.

(For completeness, my current electricity rate is 29.38 pence / kWh - I used the 30 pence figure for easier reading and easier mathematics.)

It has little to do with solar. Since Octopus have been paying 15p per kWh for exports I've only charged my EV from the grid. Yes, it involves a TOU tariff, but that's a good thing because it saves me lots of money on my home usage too.

AIUI around 2/3 households have the potential to charge an EV on a TOU tariff. It's hard to fathom why you personally choose to pay 4 times the going rate. My peak rate is now 27.94p but around 75% of my usage is at the 7.5p off-peak rate. 

Arunmor said:

And how long until EVs take up their fair share of the income the government loses in lost fuel duty?

Some people even think they are being green driving an EV!

It's not worth basing current financial decisions on hypothetical future government action. What if they slap a £1 per mile tax on polluting fossil vehicles?

Let's put some numbers on the 'green' concept: the CO² from the manufacture of my car's battery added approximately 4 tonnes to its overall footprint though the rest of the vehicle generated around 1 tonne less than the equivalent fossil car.

A typical petrol car emits ~ 250g per mile real world (it's likely more including well to pump); that's 1 tonne every 4,000 miles. The UK grid ran at 150g per kWh last year (it's getting lower all the time) which is equivalent to 1 tonne every 24,000 miles.

By 15,000 miles the EV has already broken even. After 100,000 miles it's in credit by over 20 tonnes. When it's eventually scrapped the battery will be recycled for the valuable metals while the fossil car retains nothing of its fuel.

Obviously it's better not to drive at all but, if you do, an EV is vastly better. 

HHarry

MattMattMattUK said:

It depends how you define green, but on pretty much every measure EVs are better for the environment over sustained period.

I’d chalkenge that over the whole life of an EV.  Mining precious elements, safely disposing of batteries, we still have to burn fossil fuels to provide the power.

With EV’s being so new there’s probably not enough data to say for certain, and those with a vested interest will present that data in a way that suits their agenda.