Debit Card with nominal balance

Nasqueron

GeoffTF said:

Nasqueron said:

GeoffTF said:

Nasqueron said:

GeoffTF said:

Martico said:

If she carries her phone with her, then the above suggestion of Apple/ Google Pay would seem to be the easiest solution. Phone has to be unlocked before paying, so as secure as a PIN

Google's documentation for Google Pay says that you do not have to unlock your phone to make a payment below the contactless limit "which depends on the jurisdiction" (it may also depend on the bank). Above the contactless limit, the default behaviour is to require the phone to be unlocked. That has the risk that the phone may be stolen when it is unlocked. In the US, at least, there is a way to ensure that payments over the contactless limit can be authenticated without unlocking the phone. I have always taken the view that it is safer to pay by card.

Android, as with iOS has to work with rules in different countries. I have only ever used Google Pay but my old phone did allow you, if you wanted, to pay by tapping without unlocking, it was a setting you could toggle. It should be off by default but it is possible to allow it, I suspect it's similar to say Garmin Pay on your smart watch where you have nothing to unlock

Thank you for that. That clarifies matters. Google Pay is notoriously different in different jurisdictions. Having to unlock your phone to make a contactless payment clearly adds the risk that your phone will be snatched when it is unlocked, and also adds the shoulder surfing risk if you are not using biometrics. I do not understand why anyone would consider it less risky to pay with a £500 mobile phone when they can use a card with £20 on it. I know which one I would rather risk in a swimming pool locker.

Being compliant with different regulatory regions isn't notorious, any more than it is for Apple or any other provider.

Your phone being snatched when unlocked in an enclosed space like a swimming pool cafe or at a till is very unlikely and the thief has to keep the phone unlocked and run into other stores to make purchases, all the while keeping the phone in hand to prevent it locking (which any security conscious person could set at a few seconds)

Risk is relative - if you live in a level of paranoia that people are hanging around swimming pools looking to snatch phones to then run and go on a spending spree then there isn't much point having anything other than a bank basic account which cannot allow OD and keeping £10 in it

It is not notorious that Google complies with local regulations. It is, however, notorious that Google Pay differs in different jurisdictions in ways that do not appear to mandated by local regulations.

Mobile phone theft is very common. If I carry mobile phone, I keep it well hidden away and in "Do not disturb" mode whenever possible, so that it does not announce its presence.

There is surprisingly little card fraud and the banks usually compensate for losses. Nonetheless, there have been nasty cases in which people have been forced to give up their PINs. Tesco Clubcard Pay+ is effectively an ultra-basic bank account that cannot overdraw.

Right but that's nothing to do with what I said in terms of payments and phone unlocking. 

GeoffTF

Nasqueron said:

GeoffTF said:

Nasqueron said:

GeoffTF said:

Nasqueron said:

GeoffTF said:

Martico said:

If she carries her phone with her, then the above suggestion of Apple/ Google Pay would seem to be the easiest solution. Phone has to be unlocked before paying, so as secure as a PIN

Google's documentation for Google Pay says that you do not have to unlock your phone to make a payment below the contactless limit "which depends on the jurisdiction" (it may also depend on the bank). Above the contactless limit, the default behaviour is to require the phone to be unlocked. That has the risk that the phone may be stolen when it is unlocked. In the US, at least, there is a way to ensure that payments over the contactless limit can be authenticated without unlocking the phone. I have always taken the view that it is safer to pay by card.

Android, as with iOS has to work with rules in different countries. I have only ever used Google Pay but my old phone did allow you, if you wanted, to pay by tapping without unlocking, it was a setting you could toggle. It should be off by default but it is possible to allow it, I suspect it's similar to say Garmin Pay on your smart watch where you have nothing to unlock

Thank you for that. That clarifies matters. Google Pay is notoriously different in different jurisdictions. Having to unlock your phone to make a contactless payment clearly adds the risk that your phone will be snatched when it is unlocked, and also adds the shoulder surfing risk if you are not using biometrics. I do not understand why anyone would consider it less risky to pay with a £500 mobile phone when they can use a card with £20 on it. I know which one I would rather risk in a swimming pool locker.

Being compliant with different regulatory regions isn't notorious, any more than it is for Apple or any other provider.

Your phone being snatched when unlocked in an enclosed space like a swimming pool cafe or at a till is very unlikely and the thief has to keep the phone unlocked and run into other stores to make purchases, all the while keeping the phone in hand to prevent it locking (which any security conscious person could set at a few seconds)

Risk is relative - if you live in a level of paranoia that people are hanging around swimming pools looking to snatch phones to then run and go on a spending spree then there isn't much point having anything other than a bank basic account which cannot allow OD and keeping £10 in it

It is not notorious that Google complies with local regulations. It is, however, notorious that Google Pay differs in different jurisdictions in ways that do not appear to mandated by local regulations.

Mobile phone theft is very common. If I carry mobile phone, I keep it well hidden away and in "Do not disturb" mode whenever possible, so that it does not announce its presence.

There is surprisingly little card fraud and the banks usually compensate for losses. Nonetheless, there have been nasty cases in which people have been forced to give up their PINs. Tesco Clubcard Pay+ is effectively an ultra-basic bank account that cannot overdraw.

Right but that's nothing to do with what I said in terms of payments and phone unlocking. 

I thought that we had covered that well enough. If you unlock the phone to make small payments you have the risk that the phone will be stolen in an unlocked state. We agree that is unlikely, but the consequences could be serious. Making payments without unlocking the phone is more convenient. The bank should compensate you if the phone is stolen and used to make contactless payments (unless they tell you otherwise in advance). It is up to each individual to decide for themselves which option they prefer.