Completion Money Lost From Mortgage Lender

kingstreet

If you try to enter inactive solicitor details in the Santander system, it rejects them and you have to establish the correct details before being able to proceed. If Santander has acceptable details in its system and those were the details on the reservation or memorandum of sale, the application would be "submittable."

dteezle

tooldle said:

Funds tend to arrive for completion and from what you say above, the funds were sent for completion to occur on 15th so not a solicitor error.  What does the receiving bank branch say? There are really only two things that could happen, either the funds are with the receiving bank or the monies have been returned / on the way back to the lender. In our last but one move our funds got ‘lost’ in the system for a couple of hours. 

The lender says the funds have not been returned, as you say if it was lost it would probably be returned in a couple of hours or at least by the end of the day.

The receiving bank claims they have not received it and are asking for proof it is sent.

Lender are saying they might be able to fax a letter with information on the transfer.

housebuyer143

dteezle said:

tooldle said:

Funds tend to arrive for completion and from what you say above, the funds were sent for completion to occur on 15th so not a solicitor error.  What does the receiving bank branch say? There are really only two things that could happen, either the funds are with the receiving bank or the monies have been returned / on the way back to the lender. In our last but one move our funds got ‘lost’ in the system for a couple of hours. 

The lender says the funds have not been returned, as you say if it was lost it would probably be returned in a couple of hours or at least by the end of the day.

The receiving bank claims they have not received it and are asking for proof it is sent.

Lender are saying they might be able to fax a letter with information on the transfer.

Money isn't returned the same day, it's the banking system. You need to allow one or two days for money to bounce back and it be picked up by the bank and then the account updated. 
I'm not sure why your solicitor has tasked you with resolving this because they surely submitted the details for where the money is to go? Even if they didn't, should they not check these things before requesting huge sums of money.

dteezle

kingstreet said:

If you try to enter inactive solicitor details in the Santander system, it rejects them and you have to establish the correct details before being able to proceed. If Santander has acceptable details in its system and those were the details on the reservation or memorandum of sale, the application would be "submittable."

How do you know this is the case? So even previously valid details would be not pass this check? Do you think it's therefore more likely solicitor's bank that has it but failed to route it?

dteezle

user1977 said:

dteezle said:

user1977 said:

dteezle said:

user1977 said:

dteezle said:

Surely the solicitor should have requested funds as soon as exchange occurs?

You haven't told us when they requested the funds, but I don't see that's relevant anyway. The funds would not be arriving until immediately before completion - they don't sit in the solicitors' account for weeks in advance.

Does this not usually occur as soon as exchange occurs?

What do you mean by "this"? As I said, the funds wouldn't be sent until shortly before completion. It's not clear that the solicitors were aware the bank had the wrong account details for them.

As in usually a solicitor will make the request with the lender for the completion funds to be transferred on the proposed completion date once exchange has occurred? Surely this request is not made on the day under normal circumstances or is it? I understand the funds aren't transferred until day of completion

Like I said, I don't see what difference that makes here, if the error wouldn't be spotted until the day when the funds were meant to arrive.

I think the error should have been picked up by the solicitor ahead of the completion date is my point. It shouldn't be picked up by the bank and certainly shouldn't have got to the point of being transferred to the wrong account. The solicitor asking for a last minute call on Friday makes me think they left it to the last minute to check these things ahead of completion. 

They are claiming they noticed the error last week and spoke to santander to rectify and received an updated mortgage offer Monday morning 15th. We haven't verified this yet with santander. 

dteezle

loubel said:

The solicitor's bank details would have been on the funds request they sent to the lender. When they submitted this is not relevant as you say that funds were released on time, just to the wrong account. The pertinent question is whether the solicitor put the correct bank details on the funds request?

However, regardless as to whether it is the lender or the solicitor in error, the lender needs to speak with their bank to establish when the funds will be returned. If the account they were sent to is closed then this should happen automatically.

As in we should speak to santander to find out when they would usually bounce bank? Or solicitor needs to speak to their bank?

dteezle

Thanks for the responses so far

user1977

dteezle said:

user1977 said:

dteezle said:

user1977 said:

dteezle said:

user1977 said:

dteezle said:

Surely the solicitor should have requested funds as soon as exchange occurs?

You haven't told us when they requested the funds, but I don't see that's relevant anyway. The funds would not be arriving until immediately before completion - they don't sit in the solicitors' account for weeks in advance.

Does this not usually occur as soon as exchange occurs?

What do you mean by "this"? As I said, the funds wouldn't be sent until shortly before completion. It's not clear that the solicitors were aware the bank had the wrong account details for them.

As in usually a solicitor will make the request with the lender for the completion funds to be transferred on the proposed completion date once exchange has occurred? Surely this request is not made on the day under normal circumstances or is it? I understand the funds aren't transferred until day of completion

Like I said, I don't see what difference that makes here, if the error wouldn't be spotted until the day when the funds were meant to arrive.

I think the error should have been picked up by the solicitor ahead of the completion date is my point. 

How would they pick it up? You haven't said the solicitors were told about the incorrect bank details in advance. Were they?

dteezle

user1977 said:

dteezle said:

user1977 said:

dteezle said:

user1977 said:

dteezle said:

user1977 said:

dteezle said:

Surely the solicitor should have requested funds as soon as exchange occurs?

You haven't told us when they requested the funds, but I don't see that's relevant anyway. The funds would not be arriving until immediately before completion - they don't sit in the solicitors' account for weeks in advance.

Does this not usually occur as soon as exchange occurs?

What do you mean by "this"? As I said, the funds wouldn't be sent until shortly before completion. It's not clear that the solicitors were aware the bank had the wrong account details for them.

As in usually a solicitor will make the request with the lender for the completion funds to be transferred on the proposed completion date once exchange has occurred? Surely this request is not made on the day under normal circumstances or is it? I understand the funds aren't transferred until day of completion

Like I said, I don't see what difference that makes here, if the error wouldn't be spotted until the day when the funds were meant to arrive.

I think the error should have been picked up by the solicitor ahead of the completion date is my point. 

How would they pick it up? You haven't said the solicitors were told about the incorrect bank details in advance. Were they?

Thanks for you responses. Well who is responsible for providing the lender with these details? And who is responsible for checking the details are correct with the lender? I would assume this is part of the solicitor's role, to check all details and documents are correct ahead of the transfer taking place?

It has transpired that on the 5th April, Santander notified the solicitor of the details being incorrect and they were still not updated on the 12th April. They were only updated on the 15th April.

EssexHebridean

dteezle said:

user1977 said:

dteezle said:

Surely the solicitor should have requested funds as soon as exchange occurs?

You haven't told us when they requested the funds, but I don't see that's relevant anyway. The funds would not be arriving until immediately before completion - they don't sit in the solicitors' account for weeks in advance.

Thanks for responding. Does this not usually occur as soon as exchange occurs? Would this be considered malpractice? I can find this out but like you say Santander said funds were transferred at 2pm on Monday.

When the funds would be requested depends on the timescale between exchange and completion- if there is a clear week, the certificate of title would usually be submitted immediately on exchange. More than that, and it might be done sooner. If there is only a small gap between exchange and completion (for example, thanks to delays with our buyer's solicitors, we ended up with only two days gap) then it would normally be done ahead of completion. 

As a rule, when requesting funds, they would be requested for the day prior to completion - so in the case of your Mum's matter, I would have expected the solicitor to request the funds to be sent on Friday 12th. This also helps to avoid any risk of issues like this arising.  

2pm on completion day would be unusually late for funds to be sent - as a rule the expectation is that funds should be in place first thing so that completion can take place during the morning, through to lunchtime.  I take it Santander are refusing to answer a question from your Mum along the line of "Please confirm when the certificate of title was received you your organisation"? If they won't answer that from her, get her broker to ask the same question. That will help to work through the question of when the request for funds was made. Only once you know that will you be able to establish whether there is any error on the part of the solicitors.