Fence to divide shared land - neighbour dispute

mawk86

There is an area of shared land in-between our and our neighbours house, our neighbour wants to add a fence down the middle - which we are happy to do, but we both have different ideas as to where the fence should sit. 

I have attached a pic of our deeds, our land is blue, the brown section is the shared land. As we’re on the corner of a cul de sac, and with one house being set further back, we’re struggling to work out where the ‘middle’ is, or the angle that the‘dividing line’ comes from, from the corner of the garden behind us. 

Are there any services out there that could provide any impartial advice? We want to avoid a fall out with our neighbours! 

GDB2222

Agree with your neighbour to hire a surveyor to advise you both. You can agree in advance to abide by whatever he says, or you can agree that it’s purely advisory, but you should agree one or the other. 

Section62

mawk86 said:

There is an area of shared land in-between our and our neighbours house, our neighbour wants to add a fence down the middle - which we are happy to do, but we both have different ideas as to where the fence should sit. 

I have attached a pic of our deeds, our land is blue, the brown section is the shared land. As we’re on the corner of a cul de sac, and with one house being set further back, we’re struggling to work out where the ‘middle’ is, or the angle that the‘dividing line’ comes from, from the corner of the garden behind us. 

Are there any services out there that could provide any impartial advice? We want to avoid a fall out with our neighbours! 

Is it 'shared' in the sense it provides access to the rear of the properties (where a garage appears to be)?

Is the access/sharing arrangement set out in the deeds?  If so, then you need to consider having that altered/removed in addition to the physical work of putting the fence up.

Personally I wouldn't agree to this change, having the potential to access the rear of the property is valuable - not just for parking, but also if you want work carried out on the house/garden in the future.  This is more important for you as it looks like the front garden is very limited (for parking) and as your houses are on a turning 'banjo' I assume there is little in the way of on-street parking opportunity.

If you went ahead but didn't get the deeds amended then a future buyer (of either property) may notice they have right of access and want it restored.  If it was the neighbour's property that changed hands then anything you've spent on improving/altering your side would be wasted, and the neighbour may be able to make you pay half the cost of restoring the access/drive to a useable state.

Also, why does the neighbour want to do this?  One reason may be they are planning to extend and need exclusive use of the land in order to build on it.  If so, you could have their extended house built right up the to boundary line - and if you've agreed to remove the access right in the deeds then there would be nothing you could do to stop them.

I can't really see what you have to gain from this arrangement, and you have quite a bit to lose.

silvercar

Don’t do it. At some point either you will want vehicle access that the divide has made impossible or one or other of you will build on what was the shared bit, leaving the other with less light and less access and regret it. 

silvercar

There is no right answer to how to divide, other than ensuring you each gain half the land. Consider these 3 scenarios for the “rectangle”

1. a straight line from the midpoint of the top line of the rectangle to the mid point of the bottom line.

2. a straight line from the top left corner to the bottom right corner (you gain some side/ rear garden at the expense of a narrower front garden)

3. a straight line from top right corner to the bottom left corner ( you gain a squarer front plot at the expense of room at the side/ rear.

mawk86

Section62 said:

mawk86 said:

There is an area of shared land in-between our and our neighbours house, our neighbour wants to add a fence down the middle - which we are happy to do, but we both have different ideas as to where the fence should sit. 

I have attached a pic of our deeds, our land is blue, the brown section is the shared land. As we’re on the corner of a cul de sac, and with one house being set further back, we’re struggling to work out where the ‘middle’ is, or the angle that the‘dividing line’ comes from, from the corner of the garden behind us. 

Are there any services out there that could provide any impartial advice? We want to avoid a fall out with our neighbours! 

Is it 'shared' in the sense it provides access to the rear of the properties (where a garage appears to be)?

Is the access/sharing arrangement set out in the deeds?  If so, then you need to consider having that altered/removed in addition to the physical work of putting the fence up.

Personally I wouldn't agree to this change, having the potential to access the rear of the property is valuable - not just for parking, but also if you want work carried out on the house/garden in the future.  This is more important for you as it looks like the front garden is very limited (for parking) and as your houses are on a turning 'banjo' I assume there is little in the way of on-street parking opportunity.

If you went ahead but didn't get the deeds amended then a future buyer (of either property) may notice they have right of access and want it restored.  If it was the neighbour's property that changed hands then anything you've spent on improving/altering your side would be wasted, and the neighbour may be able to make you pay half the cost of restoring the access/drive to a useable state.

Also, why does the neighbour want to do this?  One reason may be they are planning to extend and need exclusive use of the land in order to build on it.  If so, you could have their extended house built right up the to boundary line - and if you've agreed to remove the access right in the deeds then there would be nothing you could do to stop them.

I can't really see what you have to gain from this arrangement, and you have quite a bit to lose.

Thanks so much for your advice. 

I did contact our Solicitor who we used for purchase asking if we could formally split the land, but was advised the following, with no suggestions of alternative options: 

‘Unfortunately not, sorry. This is the original Transfer from when the property was built and the intention of the developer/builder. If you were to try and amend this you would need to do a Deed of Variation and the original builder would have to agree to it and be party to it. It is unlikely this would be possible due to the age of it.’ 

Section62

mawk86 said:

I did contact our Solicitor who we used for purchase asking if we could formally split the land, but was advised the following, with no suggestions of alternative options: 

‘Unfortunately not, sorry. This is the original Transfer from when the property was built and the intention of the developer/builder. If you were to try and amend this you would need to do a Deed of Variation and the original builder would have to agree to it and be party to it. It is unlikely this would be possible due to the age of it.’ 

I think it would be a bit unusual for the original developer/builder to reserve a right of access for themselves - unless they were a council/New town Development Corporation/Housing Association and were expecting to continue to own the neighbouring property.  Normally for this kind of arrangement each of the neighbours have mirrored rights and responsibilities from/to each other, and the builder no longer has a say.

One exception might be where there was a planning condition requiring vehicular access/parking at the rear and the council required this to be protected via the deeds, but this isn't that common.

If there really is a reason why a deed of variation is impossible then you have your ready-made excuse not to proceed.  If the situation on the ground is not as it legally should be then it may be difficult to sell the properties without indemnity policies and the potential risk of someone deciding to enforce a covenant.

Also worth clarifying the position over the terms "shared" and "split the land".  I would normally expect the land ownership to be split already with each property owning roughly half the land. In which case the brown area is simply one over which both properties have rights and responsibilities - i.e. you don't own the land jointly.

It is also possible for one or the other properties to own the whole area of land, with the other one having (access) rights over it.  You need to know which applies in your case.

The title plan/documents should be the main source of information where the legal boundary lies, and this is where the fence should go (if you agree to it). If the exact position isn't defined then you could go down the route of getting a 'determined boundary' but that can be expensive and could lead to bad feeling and a possible neighbour dispute.