Collecting new car - proof of insurance

forgotmyname

They want to know your insured when you jump into the car and stick it in the wrong gear and plough into all their nice
shiny vehicles for sale?

Heard a few stories where people buying and/or collecting cars from garages have caused damage to other vehicles.
Even where someone reversed into a parked vehicle and claimed the dealer was at fault.

Policy rather than legal.

Stateofart

boxosox said:

My dealer is insisting on seeing proof of insurance before I can collect my new car.  I'm just intrigued why it matters to them that the car is insured.  Is this some sort of legal requirement?

It's due diligence. They need to know you are correctly insured, if not they are part culpable.

Nobbie1967

CAUSING OR PERMITTING ANOTHER TO DRIVE WITHOUT INSURANCE:

An offence is committed if a person causes or permits another to use a motor vehicle on a road without a valid insurance policy covering that use (S143(b) Road Traffic Act 1988). 

This offence carries the same penalty as using the vehicle (see above).

Maybe it’s the above that they’re worried about, so the more diligent dealers like to get confirmation?

Jaybee_16

Took delivery of my car in October, dealership never asked for proof of insurance. They did the paperwork for the VED and V5 arrived a few days later. 

Car_54

Nobbie1967 said:

CAUSING OR PERMITTING ANOTHER TO DRIVE WITHOUT INSURANCE:

An offence is committed if a person causes or permits another to use a motor vehicle on a road without a valid insurance policy covering that use (S143(b) Road Traffic Act 1988). 

This offence carries the same penalty as using the vehicle (see above).

Maybe it’s the above that they’re worried about, so the more diligent dealers like to get confirmation?

The dealer is not 'causing'. The buyer is driving of his own free will, not under instruction from the dealer.

And the dealer is in no position to 'permit'. The new owner does not need the dealer's permission.

So if they're worried about that they're deeply misguided.

macman

Jaybee_16 said:

Took delivery of my car in October, dealership never asked for proof of insurance. They did the paperwork for the VED and V5 arrived a few days later. 

They don't need to. When they tax it online the DVLA system will check it's insured. No insurance, VED.

Aretnap

Car_54 said:

Nobbie1967 said:

CAUSING OR PERMITTING ANOTHER TO DRIVE WITHOUT INSURANCE:

An offence is committed if a person causes or permits another to use a motor vehicle on a road without a valid insurance policy covering that use (S143(b) Road Traffic Act 1988). 

This offence carries the same penalty as using the vehicle (see above).

Maybe it’s the above that they’re worried about, so the more diligent dealers like to get confirmation?

The dealer is not 'causing'. The buyer is driving of his own free will, not under instruction from the dealer.

And the dealer is in no position to 'permit'. The new owner does not need the dealer's permission.

So if they're worried about that they're deeply misguided.

Personally I think it's at least arguable that if the dealer sells the the car to someone who isn't insured to drive it and hands then the keys knowing that they are going to jump straight into the car and drive it away, that the dealer is permitting that person to drive uninsured.

It's a very different situation to the new owner driving it without insurance or letting someone else do so at some undefined point in the future - that's obviously something that's outside the dealer's control.

So if the dealer wants to see proof that the person who they are handing the keys to is insured in order to avoid any risk of being accused of permitting them to drive uninsured then maybe they are being a little over-cautious, but I'm not sure that they're being ridiculously over-cautious.

Bigwheels1111

macman said:

Jaybee_16 said:

Took delivery of my car in October, dealership never asked for proof of insurance. They did the paperwork for the VED and V5 arrived a few days later. 

They don't need to. When they tax it online the DVLA system will check it's insured. No insurance, VED.

The garage use its traders insurance to get the road tax.
Ive tax my cars loads of times on a trader’s policy.

user1977

Aretnap said:

Car_54 said:

Nobbie1967 said:

CAUSING OR PERMITTING ANOTHER TO DRIVE WITHOUT INSURANCE:

An offence is committed if a person causes or permits another to use a motor vehicle on a road without a valid insurance policy covering that use (S143(b) Road Traffic Act 1988). 

This offence carries the same penalty as using the vehicle (see above).

Maybe it’s the above that they’re worried about, so the more diligent dealers like to get confirmation?

The dealer is not 'causing'. The buyer is driving of his own free will, not under instruction from the dealer.

And the dealer is in no position to 'permit'. The new owner does not need the dealer's permission.

So if they're worried about that they're deeply misguided.

Personally I think it's at least arguable that if the dealer sells the the car to someone who isn't insured to drive it and hands then the keys knowing that they are going to jump straight into the car and drive it away, that the dealer is permitting that person to drive uninsured.

Is that offence ever actually used where you have "permitted" another party to drive their own (not your!) vehicle? That kind of suggests everybody has to police everybody else's driving if they happen to have awareness of the insurance cover...

Aretnap

user1977 said:

Aretnap said:

Car_54 said:

Nobbie1967 said:

CAUSING OR PERMITTING ANOTHER TO DRIVE WITHOUT INSURANCE:

An offence is committed if a person causes or permits another to use a motor vehicle on a road without a valid insurance policy covering that use (S143(b) Road Traffic Act 1988). 

This offence carries the same penalty as using the vehicle (see above).

Maybe it’s the above that they’re worried about, so the more diligent dealers like to get confirmation?

The dealer is not 'causing'. The buyer is driving of his own free will, not under instruction from the dealer.

And the dealer is in no position to 'permit'. The new owner does not need the dealer's permission.

So if they're worried about that they're deeply misguided.

Personally I think it's at least arguable that if the dealer sells the the car to someone who isn't insured to drive it and hands then the keys knowing that they are going to jump straight into the car and drive it away, that the dealer is permitting that person to drive uninsured.

Is that offence ever actually used where you have "permitted" another party to drive their own (not your!) vehicle? That kind of suggests everybody has to police everybody else's driving if they happen to have awareness of the insurance cover...

No idea. But it's a very specific situation, not something that implies that everyone has a general duty to police everybody else's driving.

Whether or not money has actually changed hands yet, the car is in the possession and under the control of the dealer, and the OP cannot drive it without a positive act on the part of the dealer (shaking hands, handing over the keys, generally completing the sale). If the OP can't or won't provide an insured driver to take possession of the car and drive it away then arguably the dealer should refuse to complete the sale and if necessary offer the OP his deposit back instead, rather than permit the OP to commit a crime. Criminal law would override any contract that that OP already has with the dealer.

It's a completely different situation to, I dunno, noticing that your neighbour drives his car without insuring it; that involves no positive act on your part and you are obviously not required to rush out of your house and wrestle him to the ground to stop him getting into his car.

It's also a different scenario to the OP cancelling his insurance the moment he gets the car home - what the OP does with the car once he has taken possession of it is obviously not something that the dealer can control, but whether to let the OP take possession in the first place is something that he can control.