Should I pay an overdue British Gas bill which is incorrect ?

Robin9

Can you confirm that your Mum is billed on a Pay on receipt of Bill tariff with paper bills ?

There are cheaper ways 

MWT

TheRedPhone said:

@Robin9  Unfortunately, I have as yet not been able to locate any bills prior to September 2023

Can you post the meter readings from the bill that covered September please?

We can compare that to these readings:

06519 - Actual read 15 Jan 2024

07350.8 - Estimated read 8 Mar 2024

831.8 gas units at 39.2 calorific value

I from what you have posted so far it is not likely that the back-billing rules are going to be any help as your queries are all well within the previous 12 months.

MeteredOut

TheRedPhone said:

@Alnat1

My current gas reading as of 24 March 2024 is 07560 325F

The type of gas meter we have is a Siemens Adaptive E65 . It also has a yellow label stuck on it which says "Transco Gas".

From my last bill dated 8 March 2024 it states :

15 Jan 2024 - 8 Mar 2024 : 9,262.4 kWh at 7.327p per kWh

( The above is written in bold  type ) Then below that & covering the same time period is written :

06519 - Actual read 15 Jan 2024

07350.8 - Estimated read 8 Mar 2024

831.8 gas units at 39.2 calorific value

Thanks for your swift response and apologies for my late reply.

E65 or E6S? Can you post a picture of the meter (with the serial number obfuscated)?

Just in case....https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6452074/gas-meter-still-increasing-whilst-gas-isolated-siemens-landis-gyr-e6s

Alnat1

It does appear that a fairly large volume of gas has been used but the estimate wasn't far out, so would appear to be around what BG were expecting your mum to use. This will need to be paid for. 

Rather than blaming BG for a big bill, I think you need to spend time investigating how much has been used (in kWh not £) is this similar to last winter but has simply cost more because no government £400 rebate this winter?

Have a look at the heating/thermostat settings and perhaps have the gas appliances checked to make sure there isn't a leak. Although the amount is quite large, it isn't a crazy amount and you might just need to accept this is how much it does cost to keep the house warm. Consider more insulation, thicker curtains or thermal linings etc. before next winter.  

BooJewels

To give you some benchmark of how much is being used, sticking your numbers in my calculation spreadsheet, a bill would arise of a bit over £912.23 for the period of 15th January to 24th March (the 2 actual readings given) = 69 days = 1041 m³ = 11,591.97 kWh @ 7.327p +VAT - an average daily cost of £13.22.  I say a bit over, as your unit price is higher than mine (I did use yours), but that means your Standing Charge probably will be too, so it'll add a bit to the number above. 

My own use for almost the same period, with the heating on at 18°C during the day, 18.5°C in an evening and 15°C overnight is under 500m³, so that seems to be pretty high usage.  My usage is down on the same period last year with the same arrangement, so it's certainly been milder this period.  Last week, my heating was only firing for an average of around 3 hours or less per day. 

I do wonder, if your father passed recently, maybe speaking to the bereavement department might allow a little more sensitivity to be applied to sorting out your Mum's account.  But I also think that registering for an on-line account for her might give you access to older bills, if you don't have that now.  I think there must be some rolling debit on the account for it to have risen to the numbers quoted, because the period I've worked out above should be the highest bill of the year.  You need to find some point in time when it was all correct and work forward to now.

EssexHebridean

Allowing that it appears that you have now established the it is likely the use that is high, it would certainly make sense to change to Direct Debit payment - either standard or variable - as a 7% saving over the sort of use your Mum seems to have is going to be well worth having. 

You also probably want to get to the bottom of whether the use was in fact much higher than last winter, or not, just to rule out any issues either with the meter or with appliances.

BooJewels

EssexHebridean said:

Allowing that it appears that you have now established the it is likely the use that is high, it would certainly make sense to change to Direct Debit payment - either standard or variable - as a 7% saving over the sort of use your Mum seems to have is going to be well worth having. 

You also probably want to get to the bottom of whether the use was in fact much higher than last winter, or not, just to rule out any issues either with the meter or with appliances.

I also meant to mention, that if Mum is not well and awaiting surgery, she's maybe not moving about so much, so possibly is feeling the cold and has the heating on higher than might have been the case in previous years.  I broke my leg in December and for a few weeks, I moved about much less than usual and definitely felt the cold more - I know that I used the boost function on my phone app to the thermostat a few times - I don't think I've used it before.  So I'm pretty sure that my own bill this winter is likely a bit higher than it might have been without a poorly paw.

Robin9

@TheRedPhone Once you've got the gas sorted it may be worth posting on the Benefit's Board to ensure your Mum has all she is entitled to - I'm thinking attendance allowance /  pension credit ................

Scot_39

Your mums use over Jan to Mar - works out at roughly £100 pw on average.

The energy consumption - c11800 kWh - in that 9-10 weeks - Jan 16 to your Mar 24 - actual higher than the most quoted Ofgem cap average (11,500 kWh for gas - based on 2-3 in 2-3 bed iirc).

And the Mar 24 reading seems to suggest the Mar 8 estimate sensible as well.

And that despite the milder weather in much of late Jan / Feb / Mar here at least.

Can I take even that high a use and extrapolate it to the £2100 from Dec to mid Mar bill - not very easy - but I could imagine a common enough scenario where it might.

Allowing just a few extra £100 for colder weeks (Feb was a record high temp in Eng) and adding a bit of a billing correction carried forward from Dec.

So would really need earlier bills and their readings - I missed it at first - in the talk of bills before Sep - as you didnt provide a reading - but you specifically mentioned the £1400 covered 22 Dec 2023 to Jan 16th 2024 - but only gave the Jan 2024 reading

What was the Dec 22nd reading - and importantly actual or estimate ?

It's possible if the Dec 22nd reading estimated - that carried forward an underpayment into the Jan bill - only revealed when historic compared against the Jan 16th actual reading.

(In a more hidden fashion - but thats the pernicious nature of estimates - they cascade / compound - and then appear as a step correction - and when energy companies do the corrections - often demanded on unrealistic timings)

Personal example

Mum had 4 estimated bill / statements - 6m cycle at the time - from SG (they had 4 readings on file, she / sister trusted them to use, but they never applied to billing and so never adjusted her DD).

When I called to get it sorted, the bill for well over £600 demand for immediate payment - close to a years estimated use - came with 2 readings - c10 days apart - one from the last estimated bill - the other the date of my submitted reading. (A similar problem can occur when meter readings are taken in error - then correctred with true ones later. )

But it wasnt truly just a bill for for 10 days - but for 2 years plus of error.

 

In the end we got it - the £ demand - rolled into next 12 months DD - I could have paid on card - but my mum couldn't have - seen others get such debts rolled into 24 months when similar errors occured - into £1000s of debt when emerges these days.  So try asking.

The main point reason I'm telling you this - is the £600 wasn't for the sub 10 day bill period - just as your £1400 might not be purely for Dec 22 to Jan 16 c4 weeks.

(And in a comment re the debt letter - a neighbour - in hospital at time - got a SC paper bill and a debt agency team letter - dated c5 weeks apart - some big energy companies are not renowned for their patience in that respect these days.)

Jast as the £2100 debt includes the £1400, the £1400 itself may include longer term errors - often hidden by estimated billing  - which can suddenly appear once a real measurement is applied.

Thats why as above if you have any - even just Dec and Sep 23 or in between readings it might show clues as to where or if that £1400 was really just 1m (as unlikely as that seems) - 1m real + 3-4 months of catch up - or in the event Sep also estimated - potentially even longer period of catch up.

(The error though AFIAK - would have to be compounding from last Mar and before - for back billing to apply - it doesn't protect the last 12 months - only the period prior to it.  The supplier can correct the last years worth of billing at any time  e.g. on a meter reading.)

Subject to meter accuracy not being the issue. (Rare but not impossible - just scan some other threads here)

Longer Term

Your mums use is or appears to be very high.

You really need to see if the home needs - and whether schemes can help her - fund / fit improved insulation.

Some big ones are run via councils - some are limitted to those on benefits - others cover folk on low incomes - in past my mum benefitted from free cavity wall and another 6" in loft - owners / tenants etc.

Your local CA - might be able to help - with what might be available in the area.