Council Tax Maths

hugheskevi

Since Council Tax referendums were introduced for increases above a particular amount in 2012/13 our Council Tax (Croydon, Band D) has increased from £1,457 to £2,367 in 2024/25. 

The above figure is based only on the bottom line, ignoring however the authority wishes to segment the Council Tax bill.

That's a total increase of 62.5%, or an average annual increase of slightly above 4.1% p/a.

Over a similar period (April 2012 - January 2024), CPI is up 37.8%, or 2.7% p/a.

The increase is less than I expected - it has felt like much higher increases over the years.

dealyboy

ColdIron said:

dealyboy said:

@Coldiron said:

dealyboy said:

I queried my Council Tax bill category increases, you might be interested in the reply.

Lucky old you. Sadiq Khan has increased my GLA precept by 8.6%

What was last year's precept? this year's precept? and what is your overall CT increase percentage? ...out of interest.

Band D Council Tax	2023/24 £	2024/25 £	Change £	Change %
General Precept	1,278.06	1,321.37
Adult Social Care Precept	171.62	200.61
Band D exc. WPCC	1,449.68	1,521.98	72.30	*5.0%
GLA Precept	434.14	471.40	37.26	8.6%

Thanks @ColdIron,

Similar to mine ... your Croydon Borough Council and my Herts County Council plus North Hert District Council ... your 'General Precept' and my HCC and NHDC precepts, we both have Adult Social Care Precept, our increases are 2.99% and 2.0% respectively according to the prescribed accountancy method.

I then have the Herts Police Authority at 5.5%, you have the GLA Precept at 8.6%.

Different structures ... do you have a separate category for the police? What is your overall Council Tax increase? Mine is 4.8%.

ColdIron

dealyboy said:

ColdIron said:

dealyboy said:

@Coldiron said:

dealyboy said:

I queried my Council Tax bill category increases, you might be interested in the reply.

Lucky old you. Sadiq Khan has increased my GLA precept by 8.6%

What was last year's precept? this year's precept? and what is your overall CT increase percentage? ...out of interest.

Band D Council Tax	2023/24 £	2024/25 £	Change £	Change %
General Precept	1,278.06	1,321.37
Adult Social Care Precept	171.62	200.61
Band D exc. WPCC	1,449.68	1,521.98	72.30	*5.0%
GLA Precept	434.14	471.40	37.26	8.6%

I then have the Herts Police Authority at 5.5%, you have the GLA Precept at 8.6%.

Different structures ... do you have a separate category for the police? What is your overall Council Tax increase? Mine is 4.8%.

No, as it's the Met I guess it comes from the GLA

My bottom line increase is 6.86%. Those unused cycle lanes won't pay for themselves

Grumpy_chap

Zanderman said:

[Deleted User] said:

I'm guessing our bill is going up by circa £36 to cover increased water charges as the CT element appears identical.

Water charges? Where does water come into Council Tax?

Northern Ireland.

danny13579

Grumpy_chap said:

Zanderman said:

[Deleted User] said:

I'm guessing our bill is going up by circa £36 to cover increased water charges as the CT element appears identical.

Water charges? Where does water come into Council Tax?

Northern Ireland.

Northern Ireland doesn't have "Council Tax", it has a rates system.

Northern Ireland doesn't have domestic water charges, though that's currently under consultation. 

Picklejuice

ZeroSum said:

Picklejuice said:

I have a similar issue.
I live in Croydon and the Mayor sent out a letter along with the Council Tax bill saying he'd upheld his pledge to keep the Council Tax at 4.99%. It's 5% on the bill with the Croydon cost at 3% not 2.99%

I looked deeper into this and found that the increase for the Greater London Authority precept is in their documents (and presumably budget) at 8.58%.
This is 8.6% on the bill.
I cant post the full link but it's found at democracy.croydon.gov.uk/ieDecisionDetails.aspx?ID=2178#:~:text=1.5.,Adult%20Social%20Care%20precept%20levy.
Basic maths tells me that these figures are not the same.

If they were planning to round up the figures then why isn't that documented? Why are these numbers so specific?

I'm on the spectrum so please excuse me if there's a simple answer that makes sense but this feels dishonest and underhand to proclaim one figure but use another. It certainly doesn't feel moral.
Is this legal?
Who can I raise this discrepancy with?

Also is this extra 0.03% going?
It's not a large amount on a single bill but given that a recent census has Croydon at 150,100 households, it's a not insignificant amount of money to not have a place to go during the continual rises in the cost of living and energy rates.

Thank you

Have you calculated the actual increase to 2dps? As there's a chance that charge is the lower amount & just rounded the % on the bill

Ooh that's a good call, thank you.

So the Greater London Auth is close enough at 8.583%
However the Croydon Council amount actually works out at 3.399%, jumping from £1588.31 to £1642.29
Also the Adult Social Care Precept has gone fron £217.11 to £253.22 in what they claim is a 2% increase..


I'm no mathematician so please advise if I've calculated- it wrong.
I multiplied last years figure by the percentage then changed that until the numbers matched ie x 1.03 for the original with 3% added.
 

Kim_13

So the Maths is essentially off because: 

a) The legislation allows them to include last year’s Health and Social Care precept when calculating this year’s General Expenditure increase 
b) Police/Fire/Parish Council (or lack of it) are not subject to any maximum in a way that the other elements are.

If Council Tax went up by CPI, a lot more wouldn’t be able to pay it. At least when inflation goes up you have some control over the food/clothing/fuel you buy - cheaper brands/mend and make do if you think it’s too expensive/walk or public transport, health and routes permitting/less TV/no using the oven until the price goes down to something you’re willing to pay. When council tax goes up you don’t - moving is expensive and most people don’t have the luxury of just packing up their lives even if they could afford to. And the new council could just get special permission next year…

Here the council expect the full bill paid at £10,000 of savings - there’s still an entitlement to some UC at that level!

Kim_13

hugheskevi said:

Since Council Tax referendums were introduced for increases above a particular amount in 2012/13 our Council Tax (Croydon, Band D) has increased from £1,457 to £2,367 in 2024/25. 

The above figure is based only on the bottom line, ignoring however the authority wishes to segment the Council Tax bill.

That's a total increase of 62.5%, or an average annual increase of slightly above 4.1% p/a.

Over a similar period (April 2012 - January 2024), CPI is up 37.8%, or 2.7% p/a.

The increase is less than I expected - it has felt like much higher increases over the years.

I'm surprised to see that CPI would have resulted in a lower figure since 2012, but thinking about more there were a lot of low inflation years in there where the council never seems to fail to raise by the maximum allowed. I doubt it will be that way going forward, and in the last few years, the 5% rise has almost seemed like a good deal.

We had a letter with ours boasting that they had reserves they hadn't used and were in a better position than many other councils - but still a maximum rise.

Milarky

I'm frustrated so I did an 'AI search' today

"Please list dates of all referendums held under the Localism Act 2011 on the level of council tax?"

Based on the provided search results, the following dates of referendums held under the Localism Act 2011 on the level of council tax are mentioned:

• 7 May 2015: A referendum was held in Surrey County Council, but the proposal to increase council tax by 15% was rejected by 69.5% of voters.

Please note that this is the only specific date mentioned in the provided search results. If there were other referendums held under the Localism Act 2011 on the level of council tax, they are not mentioned in the provided information.

So the total stands 'at least one'. If I were running the country I would call that a measure of the satisfaction of local electorates, wouldn't you?

[ Thinking about that. The ONLY reason the search found it must be because that's a DM type of story .. leafy South of England ... large increase proposed ... large turnout of 'non-low-information voters' swung it. ("Take That, 'Hitlers of Whiehall' !" ]

gt94sss2

From https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN05682/SN05682.pdf

One referendum has been held on a rise in council tax, by the Bedfordshire Police and Crime Commissioner, Olly Martins. He proposed a rise in council tax of 15.8% in 2015/16. This would have equated to an extra £24.80 on a Band D council tax bill in Bedfordshire. The poll was held on 7 May 2015. 91,086 voters (30.5%) supported the proposal, whilst 207,551 (69.5%) opposed it.

Surrey County Council proposed to hold a referendum on a 15% increase in council tax for 2017/18, but later dropped the proposal

For those interested in Council tax  https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/council-tax-levels-set-by-local-authorities-in-england-2024-to-2025/council-tax-levels-set-by-local-authorities-in-england-2024-to-2025 has various stats for England