Parent with Alzheimers, future planning

Jamesp31_2

Hi, hope someone can make some sense of this situation and provide some clarity.
My father is in his eighties and lives on his own in what was the family home.  He has Alzheimers with Dementia and has a carer once a day and at some stage we will need to consider long term care.

At present myself and my 3 siblings stand to inherit 25% each of his estate when he passes.  His house is larger than what he needs and would suit my own family much more, I have made no secret of the fact I would buy it if I had the money, which until I come into some inheritance/lottery win I cant afford! 

He has some considerable savings and if he ends up going into long term residential care this will cost around £1000 per week.  He would potentially also need to sell his home to pay for his care.

My question is, could my father put the house into trust for myself and my siblings?  I will be honest, I am looking at a)protecting his assets as much as possible so that he doesn't end up using all his hard earned cash on care fees, and b) looking at options of being able to buy out my siblings if the time comes.

Is this a possibility?  Would putting the house into trust prevent him having to sell the house if he ends up going into a home?

Just trying to weigh up the best options for him, for us as a family

Gavin83

Jamesp31_2 said:

protecting his assets as much as possible so that he doesn't end up using all his hard earned cash on care fees,

That’s exactly what it’s for.

Ultimately there’s not a lot you can do. Putting the house into a trust doesn’t stop it from being considered for care home fees. On the plus side it does give your father the option of a better care home.

The other option if you want to inherit his assets is to move into the house now and provide whatever care needs he has yourself.

As someone who is currently seeing a potentially large inheritance disappear to care home fees I do have some sympathy. However there is no such thing as an inheritance while someone is still alive. It’s their money and should be spent on giving them the best quality of life possible.

elsien

It’s not about what is best for the family, it’s about what is best for your dad, and money gives him choices.
 Given his age and the state of his health any attempt to lock his money away  so it can’t be used for care costs would count is deliberate deprivation of assets and he would be treated as if he still had the money. 

If anyone has financial power of attorney for your father, they have an obligation to act in his best interests if he is no longer able to manage his finances. 

You may feel his house is better suited to a family rather than to him, but he clearly disagrees, or he could have looked into doing a swap.
Getting rid of his money  so he can’t use it for himself when he needs it is not only not in his best interests it would probably also be a safeguarding issue.

Keep_pedalling

No absolutely not, this is not about protecting his assets it’s about protecting your inheritance. He already has dementia and even if you have power of attorney for him, this is way beyond your authority and certainly not in his best interests. Just be thankful that if he gets to the stage where he needs residential care he will be in a position to fund the best care he can get rather risk ending up in over my dead body grange because the LA can’t afford better.

Speaking of power of attorney, does he have financial and welfare LPAs in place? If not this is something that needs addressing urgently if he still has sufficient mental capacity left to make them. If not you need to apply for deputyship as without these thing will become very difficult, especially without the financial one in place.

KxMx

Your father is in a very positive position in being able to choose where and when he goes into residential care. 
Perhaps you are unaware as to the standard the local authority will fund, and the lengths they will go to to avoid doing so, a friend (supported by a multitude of other professionals) had a 3 year battle to get residental care for a relative suffering from dementia.
Funding was only secured after a hospital admission resulted in staff refusing discharge to anywhere other than a care setting.

tooldle

What does he have in the way of assets and pensions, other than the house? It would be worth ‘tidying up’ his finances now to make it easier for whoever is going to manage the finances going forward. By tidying up, I mean making sure the money is working in Dad’s interest and not languishing in some bank account paying 0.5% interest. I found consolidation of my mum’s money helpful as it was scattered across some 20 Building Society accounts. An IFA provided very useful advice and thus her funds began to generate income. Dad may need to sell his house and sometimes this is best done sooner rather than later to prevent household bills draining his finances and, to save the person who would otherwise have to keep popping in to check the property.
Your Dad is already receiving care and his situation will deteriorate. My mum died of dementia. Believe me a good care facility is worth every penny. I think people often do not realise what end stage dementia looks like.

sew_what

You've been given good advice about LPA & deprivation of assets.  I fear your expectation of the cost of care homes, particularly dementia care are sadly out of date - I don't know where in the UK you are, but https://www.carehome.co.uk/ may give you a better idea.
As others have said - this is what your dad has saved for all his life.

thegreenone

tooldle said:

Believe me a good care facility is worth every penny. I think people often do not realise what end stage dementia looks like.

I think this has to be the best quote of the thread.  

Savvy_Sue

WRT LPA, you may think you've left it too late if Dad has a diagnosis of dementia. That's not necessarily the case: he may have 'capacity' to understand and sign the paperwork, and a Certificate Provider would have to confirm that. 

If, for example, he's on the ball in the mornings but doolally by the afternoon, you have your discussions and do your form filling in the afternoons mornings. Doesn't matter if he has no recall the next morning: did he have 'capacity' the previous day? 

This is one situation where it might well be best to use a solicitor to draw up the paperwork, especially if there might be questions from siblings about who are the best people to be attorneys (always wise to have more than one), and whether they did the right thing. 

(Sadly, at the times when FIL had 'capacity' he was adamantly opposed to granting LPA to anyone, and fortunately we didn't need it, but I'd have been happier if we'd had it! It was one of the first things MIL dealt with after he'd died ...)

elsien

Savvy_Sue said:

WRT LPA, you may think you've left it too late if Dad has a diagnosis of dementia. That's not necessarily the case: he may have 'capacity' to understand and sign the paperwork, and a Certificate Provider would have to confirm that. 

If, for example, he's on the ball in the mornings but doolally by the afternoon, you have your discussions and do your form filling in the afternoons. Doesn't matter if he has no recall the next morning: did he have 'capacity' the previous day? 

This is one situation where it might well be best to use a solicitor to draw up the paperwork, especially if there might be questions from siblings about who are the best people to be attorneys (always wise to have more than one), and whether they did the right thing. 

(Sadly, at the times when FIL had 'capacity' he was adamantly opposed to granting LPA to anyone, and fortunately we didn't need it, but I'd have been happier if we'd had it! It was one of the first things MIL dealt with after he'd died ...)

You might want to reconsider that? 

Savvy_Sue

elsien said:

Savvy_Sue said:

WRT LPA, you may think you've left it too late if Dad has a diagnosis of dementia. That's not necessarily the case: he may have 'capacity' to understand and sign the paperwork, and a Certificate Provider would have to confirm that. 

If, for example, he's on the ball in the mornings but doolally by the afternoon, you have your discussions and do your form filling in the afternoons. Doesn't matter if he has no recall the next morning: did he have 'capacity' the previous day? 

This is one situation where it might well be best to use a solicitor to draw up the paperwork, especially if there might be questions from siblings about who are the best people to be attorneys (always wise to have more than one), and whether they did the right thing. 

(Sadly, at the times when FIL had 'capacity' he was adamantly opposed to granting LPA to anyone, and fortunately we didn't need it, but I'd have been happier if we'd had it! It was one of the first things MIL dealt with after he'd died ...)

You might want to reconsider that? 

Whoops. Perhaps I should consider my own capacity before posting ...