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Do I need planning? Has anyone used Studio Charrette

dllive
Posts: 1,275 Forumite



Hi,
Im looking to replace my porch which is literally falling down. The porch is currently 4sq m, but Id like to increase the floor area to about 6sq m.
Ive been on the Planning Portal, which recommends a company called Studio Charrette. They said they will do a Planning Appraisal for me.
Has anyone used them? Or perhaps I should just apply for Planning Permission direct?
Im replacing a tin roof shack thats literally falling down, with something thats much more in-keeping with the house. Yes, Ill be increasing the floor area by 2 sq m, but do you think this is Permitted Development?
I will be selling the house in a few years time, so I dont want this to be a sticking point when selling, or have to apply for retrospective planning.
Thanks
Im looking to replace my porch which is literally falling down. The porch is currently 4sq m, but Id like to increase the floor area to about 6sq m.
Ive been on the Planning Portal, which recommends a company called Studio Charrette. They said they will do a Planning Appraisal for me.
Has anyone used them? Or perhaps I should just apply for Planning Permission direct?
Im replacing a tin roof shack thats literally falling down, with something thats much more in-keeping with the house. Yes, Ill be increasing the floor area by 2 sq m, but do you think this is Permitted Development?
I will be selling the house in a few years time, so I dont want this to be a sticking point when selling, or have to apply for retrospective planning.
Thanks
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Comments
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Are your measurements taken from the inside of the porch area.
You are likely to need planning permission for
6 square metres.
We had to when we did oursmake the most of it, we are only here for the weekend.
and we will never, ever return.1 -
dllive said:
Im looking to replace my porch which is literally falling down. The porch is currently 4sq m, but Id like to increase the floor area to about 6sq m.
...
Im replacing a tin roof shack thats literally falling down, with something thats much more in-keeping with the house. Yes, Ill be increasing the floor area by 2 sq m, but do you think this is Permitted Development?No. The plan area limit on porches is 3sqm, so your 4sqm one already exceeds the allowance. You can't use the 3sqm PD as an addition to an existing porch.Do you know if the existing porch had planning consent?The planning process for something like a porch or small extension isn't that difficult. You probably don't need a consultant to help you, so long as you can get the plans drawn up.0 -
Section62 said:dllive said:
Im looking to replace my porch which is literally falling down. The porch is currently 4sq m, but Id like to increase the floor area to about 6sq m.
...
Im replacing a tin roof shack thats literally falling down, with something thats much more in-keeping with the house. Yes, Ill be increasing the floor area by 2 sq m, but do you think this is Permitted Development?No. The plan area limit on porches is 3sqm, so your 4sqm one already exceeds the allowance. You can't use the 3sqm PD as an addition to an existing porch.Do you know if the existing porch had planning consent?The planning process for something like a porch or small extension isn't that difficult. You probably don't need a consultant to help you, so long as you can get the plans drawn up.
The chap I spoke to at the consultants said Id likely not need permission. But I dont know if thats because he wants me to use his services.
Is the simple fact that it is going to be bigger than 3sqm - even by just a couple of metres - enough for it to need planning permission? Even though its replacing something that looks awful and is falling down with something that is much more in-keeping with the house? If so, then I suspect the consultant is being disingenuous.
As you say, I can Photoshop some plans detailing dimensions, materials used etc. But I was hoping that - for the sake of £100 to get a Planning Consultant to give a definitive "This can be done under PD" or "This cant be done under PD". But by what you say - by virtue of the slightly increased floor print - it cant be done under PD?
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And of course, I dont want to wait 16 weeks for a result. I suppose I could apply for retrospective planning, but then I run the chance of not getting it, and worst case, have to demolish it all! How likely this would be I have no idea. As I say, its only going to enhance the visual appeal of the property, albeit at a very slightly enlarged footprint.0
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dllive said: The chap I spoke to at the consultants said Id likely not need permission. But I dont know if thats because he wants me to use his services.
Is the simple fact that it is going to be bigger than 3sqm - even by just a couple of metres - enough for it to need planning permission? Even though its replacing something that looks awful and is falling down with something that is much more in-keeping with the house? If so, then I suspect the consultant is being disingenuous.The existing porch is 4m² which you intend to demolish - That would (generally) need planning permission. You then intend to rebuild the porch with a 6m² footprint. That is twice the area for permitted development, so you will need to apply for planning permission.You could go ahead and rebuild the porch without the appropriate permissions in place, but it would be you the council pursue, not the "consultant". Even if the council doesn't spot the new porch and initiate enforcement action within the allotted time limits, solicitors will pick up on it when you come to sell. Some potential buyers may even pull out if the right paperwork is not in place. For the sake of saving a few hundred pounds, it isn't really worth it.
Her courage will change the world.
Treasure the moments that you have. Savour them for as long as you can for they will never come back again.1 -
When building a front porch a lot of people seem to take an interest in it and come up and talk about it. Build an extension at the back and nobody seems to notice.
Unless it's well out of the way, there's a fair chance when building a large porch of the council finding out.1 -
Thanks. Yes, Id rather get all the paperwork in order beforehand as I will be look to sell in a few years. I was just hoping that the Consultant would give me a definitive Yes/No to PD. But it seems on this thread that the answer is a definitive "No, it wont be PD". This is helpful thanks. I wont pay the consultant for his planning appraisal (his initial thoughts were that it was PD!) and I will come up with the relevant plan etc myself and submit to Planning.0
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dllive said:Section62 said:
Is the simple fact that it is going to be bigger than 3sqm - even by just a couple of metres - enough for it to need planning permission? Even though its replacing something that looks awful and is falling down with something that is much more in-keeping with the house? If so, then I suspect the consultant is being disingenuous.Yes. Planning is a rules based system. The rule is that to be permitted development various criteria need to be met, including that "the ground area (measured externally) of the structure would [not] exceed 3 square metres".If the ground area of the porch exceeds 3 square metres (in theory even by the smallest amount) then it isn't permitted development.Replacing something that looks awful and is falling down, and being more in-keeping with the house, are potential considerations when the council considers the application, but in themselves don't allow the application process to be bypassed.Also the appearance of a structure and a wish to make it more 'in-keeping' don't always count for much when you apply for planning consent. It is fairly common for people to believe that their development proposal which is more 'in-keeping' should make it a done deal to get planning consent, but this isn't how the system works. There are other factors - such as massing and proportion - that will probably carry more weight when considering a porch application (technically an 'extension').The only reason I can think of why the planning consultant said it would be PD is if the "porch" is on the side or rear of the property and building a larger structure would be acceptable under the extension PD rules. The rules for porches are very specific, because generally porches are wanted on the front of a property and here they have the greatest impact on the streetscene.However, a porch could also be on the side(s) or rear of the property... can you clarify where yours is because that may make all the difference.1 -
Thanks so much for details post @Section62 .
It seems Ive inadvertently missed out some important detail! (apologies). The new porch is to be a side porch.
Heres what it currently looks like
And heres my photoshop mockup of what I would like to replace it with:
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dllive said:It seems Ive inadvertently missed out some important detail! (apologies). The new porch is to be a side porch.In which case you need to look at PD for an extension - in effect the special class for porches is to potentially allow them in positions where an extension would never be PD. But if what you want to do would be PD as an extension then you wouldn't be limited to 3sqm.However, you've got a lot of glass in your mockup, so you might run into difficulties with building regulations (in terms of thermal efficiency) if it is treated as an extension as part of the habitable area of the house. You are in a bit of a grey area between 'porch'/'conservatory'/'extension' - it might be a good idea to have a conversation with an architect about the best way forward as the shape of the increased space may not be the most useful.On a detailed point - you've got the end wall of the porch right next to and touching the side/corner of the chimney. That will make it quite difficult to achieve a weather/damp proof connection between the porch and the existing structure. Either keeping a gap (less than ideal, but like the present arrangement) or else making the porch longer and higher to make that little triangular area of tiles internal to the porch, would make the roof less complicated to do and more likely to be weather/damp proof.Also check you have full PD rights - and there is no limitation due to conservation areas/listed buildings/Article 4 directions.1
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