PCN by TPS from cameras - but no proof the car was parked where the permit wasn't valid

Coupon-mad

There's already a 10 minute grace period (mandatory in the existing 'rubbishy' self-serving Codes of Practice) and has been for years!

It really made me laugh when the press picked up on that clause in 2022 as if it's new.  Hilarious, given there is so much better stuff coming in than that supposed 'headline' news (about 10 minutes grace which already exists) and I know because I helped shape the content.

I first broke news of my involvement on the Government Steering group in 2022 in a reply here:

 https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6333036/breaking-news-government-has-announced-the-statutory-code-of-practice-and-enforcement-framework/p1

That thread by bargepole sums up the main changes but the Code was blocked by the rogue industry (course they did!).

That put a major delaying spanner in the works.  Judicial Reviews (plural) saw the Code temporarily withdrawn:

https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/news/driving-law/private-parking-code-of-practice-set-to-be-withdrawn-what-does-it-mean-for/#:~:text=The RAC has learned that,50 –%20down%20from%20£100.

I'm still involved.  My unpaid work continues and the DLUHC have been busy:

https://www.gov.uk/government/calls-for-evidence/private-parking-code-of-practice-call-for-evidence/private-parking-charges-and-debt-recovery-fees-call-for-evidence

https://apply-for-public-appointment.service.gov.uk/roles/7712

The Code is not dead!  Long live the Code.

Hopefully fairly imminent timeline this year:  final Public Consultation for you and everyone to respond to very soon, and the final Impact Assessment.

Then Code laid before Parliament again.

Hopefully before any GE!

Le_Kirk

SouthLondonUser said:

 Complaining to the university to get the fine cancelled is unfortunately not an option.

Why is this please? Plan A in the NEWBIE sticky is quite clear on complaining to landowner. 

SouthLondonUser

Le_Kirk said:

SouthLondonUser said:

 Complaining to the university to get the fine cancelled is unfortunately not an option.

Why is this please? Plan A in the NEWBIE sticky is quite clear on complaining to landowner. 

Yes, the focus of the sticky on this strategy was very clear to me.

However, I have learnt from a number of people affected in a similar way that the university doesn't care, doesn't reply and, when chased hard, tells those affected to suck it up and get lost. 

So maybe I could have rephrased it saying "I understand complaining to the landowner is the recommended starting point, but, based on many recent similar experiences, this is likely to lead nowhere"

If I were to guess, I would guess that the individuals with the power to do anything couldn't be bothered, because there is no threat comparable to that of an angry customer who threatens to refuse to shop again after being fined in the shop car park. Maybe these people would do something only if the £380k a year vice-chancellor gets one of these charges  

https://twitter.com/ucu/status/1652672149268869121

Le_Kirk

.................. and the usual threat of "taking your business elsewhere" won't work because presumably you want to keep studying there.  A tactic that used to be suggested on here was asking the University for the name and serviceable address of someone who will be required to attend a court hearing (if it gets that far).  Might focus their attention!

SouthLondonUser

The keeper challenged it online. The challenge was rejected. They have now received a "final demand" which says the parking charge notice can be appealed. So you appeal it twice? I'm a bit confused

In the appeal the keeper pointed out that there is a valid permit which allows the car to be parked in most of the campus., and that TPS did NOT prove where the car was parked, so did NOT prove that the car was parked in an area where the permit wasn't  valid.

Shall the keeper repeat this appeal again, which will surely be rejected, or just wait for a letter before claim?

I have posted anonymised versions of the 'final demand'. The keeper received a few of these.

https://i.postimg.cc/7YPwQkvj/Final-demand-front-edited.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/13dZ7VPj/Final-demand-back-edited.jpg

Coupon-mad

LOL - they are clueless!  Keep those letters just in case you get a court claim.

They are saying that the £90 is 'including the initial debt recovery cost' (say what now?) therefore admitting that the only actual 'parking charge' is the discounted charge.

That's rubbish but could be v useful for a 'VAT concerns'  complaint about whichever DRA sends you multiple £160 demands.

SouthLondonUser

The whole thing doesn't make sense. On the front it says "pay the parking charge notice. Your time to appeal has now expired"
On the back it says "to appeal this parking charge notice please write to us"

What would you recommend? Just do nothing for now? Try their useless 'appeal' process anyway?

If they want to come after me, what would their next step be? A letter before claim / letter before action? Some kind of court summons? 

Coupon-mad

You can't appeal again.

They have just used the back of a PCN and printed a Final Demand on the front of that stationery. Shoddy!

If course you can't get a court summons. This isn't a criminal matter.  See the second and fourth posts of the NEWBIES thread for advice re what happens when.

SouthLondonUser

I am now being chased for 3 incidents, all allegedly occurred a week from each other.
As per the guidelines on the forum, I am ignoring these debt recovery letters, and won't do anything until and unless I get a letter of claim / letter before action / or whatever the proper term is.

My question is: can / should they consolidate these 3 into one court case?
Or can they take me to court separately for each of these 3?

Coupon-mad

Yes they can and sometimes that's easier to beat if they don't consolidate them!