ECO4 - It is great but beware!!

BarelySentientAI

funkifee said:

I got a new boiler fitted under the Eco4 scheme by a company called Mearns Energy Solutions Ltd, run by Muhammed Zubair. The company ended up flooding my flat and the neighbour below because they failed to secure a pipe from the new boiler to the sink outlet. The damage has cost me £800 and I asked the company for their Public Liability Insurance provider but got no reply, I don't know if this means they don't have this insurance, which under the Eco4 rules they should have in order to get paid the grant or if they just don't want to give me it.

Does anybody know what other steps I can take to get this company to pay up?
             TIA

You should have claimed on your own insurance and then let them chase on your behalf.

Might be too late for that now though.

MP1995

funkifee said:

I got a new boiler fitted under the Eco4 scheme by a company called Mearns Energy Solutions Ltd, run by Muhammed Zubair. The company ended up flooding my flat and the neighbour below because they failed to secure a pipe from the new boiler to the sink outlet. The damage has cost me £800 and I asked the company for their Public Liability Insurance provider but got no reply, I don't know if this means they don't have this insurance, which under the Eco4 rules they should have in order to get paid the grant or if they just don't want to give me it.

Does anybody know what other steps I can take to get this company to pay up?
             TIA

Was this through your Energy company as first point of contact? If so raise a complaint with them in the first instance.

Is the company that caused this issue still trading?

Swipe

BarelySentientAI said:

funkifee said:

I got a new boiler fitted under the Eco4 scheme by a company called Mearns Energy Solutions Ltd, run by Muhammed Zubair. The company ended up flooding my flat and the neighbour below because they failed to secure a pipe from the new boiler to the sink outlet. The damage has cost me £800 and I asked the company for their Public Liability Insurance provider but got no reply, I don't know if this means they don't have this insurance, which under the Eco4 rules they should have in order to get paid the grant or if they just don't want to give me it.

Does anybody know what other steps I can take to get this company to pay up?
             TIA

You should have claimed on your own insurance and then let them chase on your behalf.

Might be too late for that now though.

What's the betting that the insurance company would just say that they weren't informed any work was taking place and refuse to pay out?

BarelySentientAI

Swipe said:

BarelySentientAI said:

funkifee said:

I got a new boiler fitted under the Eco4 scheme by a company called Mearns Energy Solutions Ltd, run by Muhammed Zubair. The company ended up flooding my flat and the neighbour below because they failed to secure a pipe from the new boiler to the sink outlet. The damage has cost me £800 and I asked the company for their Public Liability Insurance provider but got no reply, I don't know if this means they don't have this insurance, which under the Eco4 rules they should have in order to get paid the grant or if they just don't want to give me it.

Does anybody know what other steps I can take to get this company to pay up?
             TIA

You should have claimed on your own insurance and then let them chase on your behalf.

Might be too late for that now though.

What's the betting that the insurance company would just say that they weren't informed any work was taking place and refuse to pay out?

Extremely low.  Fitting a new boiler isn't work that requires notification to insurance.

NedS

Vikingbysea said:

Oh no!  Anyone had anyone positive outcomes?! - I am about to finish being on benefits as my daughters have almost finished school, so I wanted to get a new boiler as my old 16 year old one works OK now, but I wont be able to afford the £7K needed in the future! - So I thought this would be a good bet!! - It sounds like a lot of extras - you mentioned rendering - which I spent a fortune getting redone a couple of years back!!

We have recently had our house updated on ECO4 scheme and had a positive experience, eventually.

We had a number of surveys with different companies, and got varying distances into the process before each pulled out saying they were unable to do the work. Some were more honest as to the reasons than others - it seems to me there are plenty of companies out there that just want to cherry pick the easy jobs and once they see it is complex and not a straight-forward retrofit (and not many are), they lose interest.

Anyway, on to our 4th or 5th company, and we found a winner.

As others have mentioned, the most common business model for these firms seems to be the main firm sub-contracts out all the work, and simply project manages and is responsible for claiming the grant money. We were lucky inasmuch as our project manager was good, and very quickly chased up any small niggles and got them resolved. The 3 sub-contractors, for internal wall insulation, ASHP and solar installations were all excellent, and we were very pleased with the work carried out.

I think expectations are important here - firstly we had a very good idea before entering into the process of exactly what we wanted, and going through 3-4 extensive surveys and quotes before setting on a company only strengthened that. We were also very realistic about the time frame for works and the disruption it would cause - you cannot retrofit these types of measures into a family home without causing significant disruption, and to expect anything less is totally unrealistic.

To add context, coincidentally two of our immediate neighbours have had their properties done under ECO4 at almost the same time - one had a bad experience with contractors not turning up and poor workmanship, the other had a better experience with a good outcome but said the project management did lack as they never knew in advance what was happening when, and contractors just seemed to turn up at random to begin work (which makes it near impossible to plan for the expected disruption).

It seems we have been quite fortunate, but I like to attribute at least some of that good fortune down to our own planning.

mab6aloft

Thank-you AverageConsumer23 and others on this thread. I started the ECO4 process early this year. Seemed to go well and then was passed on to another Company without my being notified. Had to start from scratch and the second survey made different recommendations - in my view not suited to my property or circumstances. Think wrf12345's comment 'one size fits all' has a ring of truth.  

To top it all the last surveyor went cold-calling through the neighbourhood using my project as a reason why others should join in.

Communication is very poor and I think I would be wise to pull out as I am losing trust. I lack the experience and energy to cope with any installation glitches.

Ruby-Tuesday

Reading this thread with interest as I have been approved for ECO4 funding for an air source heat pump, solar panels and additional loft insulation. The company is Warma UK. They have a score of 4.5 on Trustmark and are accredited by all the relevant schemes e.g MCS but I'm keen to find out if Warma UK will be the installer or if they will sub-contract out the work and if so, who will be doing the work. It seems if there are problems or it can be hard to hold the relevant company to account.

jlan456you

We are in a similar situation. Can any recommend a company that they have had success with. It does not create much confidence in this grant system if companies are setting with via opaque practices saying they can save us money with grants and when we qualify they still cherry pick which part to apply for. I have had my insulation part done and now have not heard anything since. Another firm told us we have to contribute as the funding is now scarce for ASHP and solar panels. They have asked us to contribute nearly £7000 for solar and ASHP and asked about funding and how our details are used, we are not provided with any clear process of how they use our information. Sounds rife for scams and data breaches as they are asking usually poor and vulnerable who are lured into saving money etc. Can anyone recommend a company that seems to work to all the standards and are transparent and professional in their dealings with you?

EcoBop

AverageConsumer23 said:

ECO 4 is great, but beware! Anyone else is this same position? Anyone resolved the issues?
Last April (2023) I did some research on the ECO4 scheme, via my Local Council website. I selected a company, based on the location and also the relevant certifications required (MCS, TrustMark) and started the process. I was delighted to discover I was eligible, they carried out a survey of the house, including room measurements, and let me know that they would install -

• Air Source Heat Pump 
• External and Internal Wall Insulation, Loft Insulation and 
• Solar PV. 

I went through all the checks, and we agreed to commence the work in May. I was informed it would take 4-6 weeks. Slowly the problems began. All work was sub-contracted out, there was no project management or communication, tradesmen were coming and going. by the end of June I was pressured into signing off the work, so that the grant was then fully paid out.

Fast forward to November 2023. After a summer of hell, I decided to formally complain. This has been really difficult, as there is no one body to go to, each element has a different complaint process. So you have to navigate OfGem, MCS, NCIECC, Trustmark, and British Gas (the ultimate funder). I have started with MCS/NCIECC. The first step being to write a formal complaint. Which I did in November and have forwarded that to the NCIECC.

So, what are the issues?

• Heating does not work, and barely gets up to 15 degrees and that is with the ASHP on for hours, and only 10 degrees in some rooms.
• Leak in my roof and water trailing down the front of the house as the tiles installed to accommodate the EWI were attached without any felt underneath and the gutters placed too high, they made a hole in roof when pushing the tiles under the existing tiles, with damage to my ceiling.
• The solar panels are not attached correctly to the roof and the cables are loose
• Render to the back of the house (which I have to pay for as not eligible through the grant) has been applied right down to ground level. 

These are the major issues, alongside many others, over the last 9 and including trashing my garden, and stone driveway, causing electrical faults due to cutting connections, the list goes on, poor behaviour and attitude of contractors.  

What have I learnt that I can pass on?

• Make sure the contractor has all the right quality standards, that doesn't mean they are good, but it does mean that you have access to a complaints process when it doesn't go well
  
• The main contractor should follow the Trustmark etc code, so you should receive a contract (even if a grant), heat loss survey, consumption comparisons and a bunch of other stuff that I did not receive.  

I also wish I had know about The Heating Hub, a great place to find resources for understanding what is required and how to manage this type of contract and when things go wrong. 

Where am I now? Still in dispute, sitting in a cold house, with a leaking roof. Communication and any action from the regulatory bodies is slow, and the contractor has gone quiet. I know they will be in the area this week as someone else is using them and has the same issues, but I know their style, they will just turn up, because I am sole occupant, so they try to intimidate and catch you unawares and ill prepared. 

Any advice or stories of success in navigating the process? Would be interested to hear them. In the meantime, if my post has helped one person avoid the problems I have had, then I feel something good has come out of something bad. Reciprocity! 

Hi #AverageConsumer23,

I'm in a very similar situation and currently entering the Ombudsman process with Consumer Energy Solutions, after attempting a resolution through HIES (The Home Insulation & Energy Systems Quality Assured Contractors Scheme).  

Also had ASHP installed that doesn't get up to temperature.
Costs an absolute fortune as home not properly insulated.
Winter 1 - freezing cold house with no affordable heating and heating not working at all below zero degrees.
Consumer Energy Solutions falsified survey data, producing a heat loss calculation that was a huge departure from reality.
Roof 'surveyed' for solar panels, but again incorrect data used (presumably to secure the ECO4 scheme contract / funds).
Roof then banged and cracked for months - something was clearly badly wrong.
Had a structural engineer investigate and found that the purlins were underspecced and joists were badly bowed
Quoted £7k to replace the purlins, which CES agreed to pay
Then, builder left site after taking part of the roof off, realising that the whole roof needed replacing (the rafter / joist connections were severed completely!)

This is where things got really bad

Unable to find another builder / roofer to replace the one that scarpered (skilled people in short supply where I live)
Water flooding through house during worst winter on record 
No roofing skills of my own and trying to recover from 4 - 5 years of severe chronic insomnia
Had to re-roof the house from scratch with support from whoever I could find at short notice
Fast track 8 months and the roof is still off
Water still pouring through house
Still no heating at all
Consumer Energy Solutions refusing to offer any help or support - not their problem apparently!
Out of time / money - house going to ruins

Ombudsman process can take up to 2 months, so possibly no heat by Christmas.

These people have absolutely no moral backbone and seem only to care about money.

Please avoid this company like the plague.

If anyone has similar experiences, or wishes to discuss / form a support group, please get in touch.

srg506

EcoBop said:

AverageConsumer23 said:

ECO 4 is great, but beware! Anyone else is this same position? Anyone resolved the issues?
Last April (2023) I did some research on the ECO4 scheme, via my Local Council website. I selected a company, based on the location and also the relevant certifications required (MCS, TrustMark) and started the process. I was delighted to discover I was eligible, they carried out a survey of the house, including room measurements, and let me know that they would install -

• Air Source Heat Pump 
• External and Internal Wall Insulation, Loft Insulation and 
• Solar PV. 

I went through all the checks, and we agreed to commence the work in May. I was informed it would take 4-6 weeks. Slowly the problems began. All work was sub-contracted out, there was no project management or communication, tradesmen were coming and going. by the end of June I was pressured into signing off the work, so that the grant was then fully paid out.

Fast forward to November 2023. After a summer of hell, I decided to formally complain. This has been really difficult, as there is no one body to go to, each element has a different complaint process. So you have to navigate OfGem, MCS, NCIECC, Trustmark, and British Gas (the ultimate funder). I have started with MCS/NCIECC. The first step being to write a formal complaint. Which I did in November and have forwarded that to the NCIECC.

So, what are the issues?

• Heating does not work, and barely gets up to 15 degrees and that is with the ASHP on for hours, and only 10 degrees in some rooms.
• Leak in my roof and water trailing down the front of the house as the tiles installed to accommodate the EWI were attached without any felt underneath and the gutters placed too high, they made a hole in roof when pushing the tiles under the existing tiles, with damage to my ceiling.
• The solar panels are not attached correctly to the roof and the cables are loose
• Render to the back of the house (which I have to pay for as not eligible through the grant) has been applied right down to ground level. 

These are the major issues, alongside many others, over the last 9 and including trashing my garden, and stone driveway, causing electrical faults due to cutting connections, the list goes on, poor behaviour and attitude of contractors.  

What have I learnt that I can pass on?

• Make sure the contractor has all the right quality standards, that doesn't mean they are good, but it does mean that you have access to a complaints process when it doesn't go well
  
• The main contractor should follow the Trustmark etc code, so you should receive a contract (even if a grant), heat loss survey, consumption comparisons and a bunch of other stuff that I did not receive.  

I also wish I had know about The Heating Hub, a great place to find resources for understanding what is required and how to manage this type of contract and when things go wrong. 

Where am I now? Still in dispute, sitting in a cold house, with a leaking roof. Communication and any action from the regulatory bodies is slow, and the contractor has gone quiet. I know they will be in the area this week as someone else is using them and has the same issues, but I know their style, they will just turn up, because I am sole occupant, so they try to intimidate and catch you unawares and ill prepared. 

Any advice or stories of success in navigating the process? Would be interested to hear them. In the meantime, if my post has helped one person avoid the problems I have had, then I feel something good has come out of something bad. Reciprocity! 

Hi #AverageConsumer23,

I'm in a very similar situation and currently entering the Ombudsman process with Consumer Energy Solutions, after attempting a resolution through HIES (The Home Insulation & Energy Systems Quality Assured Contractors Scheme).  

Also had ASHP installed that doesn't get up to temperature.
Costs an absolute fortune as home not properly insulated.
Winter 1 - freezing cold house with no affordable heating and heating not working at all below zero degrees.
Consumer Energy Solutions falsified survey data, producing a heat loss calculation that was a huge departure from reality.
Roof 'surveyed' for solar panels, but again incorrect data used (presumably to secure the ECO4 scheme contract / funds).
Roof then banged and cracked for months - something was clearly badly wrong.
Had a structural engineer investigate and found that the purlins were underspecced and joists were badly bowed
Quoted £7k to replace the purlins, which CES agreed to pay
Then, builder left site after taking part of the roof off, realising that the whole roof needed replacing (the rafter / joist connections were severed completely!)

This is where things got really bad

Unable to find another builder / roofer to replace the one that scarpered (skilled people in short supply where I live)
Water flooding through house during worst winter on record 
No roofing skills of my own and trying to recover from 4 - 5 years of severe chronic insomnia
Had to re-roof the house from scratch with support from whoever I could find at short notice
Fast track 8 months and the roof is still off
Water still pouring through house
Still no heating at all
Consumer Energy Solutions refusing to offer any help or support - not their problem apparently!
Out of time / money - house going to ruins

Ombudsman process can take up to 2 months, so possibly no heat by Christmas.

These people have absolutely no moral backbone and seem only to care about money.

Please avoid this company like the plague.

If anyone has similar experiences, or wishes to discuss / form a support group, please get in touch.

I am currently going down the complaints route with consumer energy solutions. 4 attempts to install solar panels, was told the new boiler would be compatible with my HIVE thermostat, was told artex containing asbestos would be removed to insulate the ceiling slopes but then was told it will cost them £3k to remove so the ceiling slopes would bot be insulated. Was told there is 280mm of loft insulation when the debth between the plasterboard and loft boards is only 250mm. Wires and pipes hanging from walls for 6 weeks before anyone came to refit them. I had to fit the electrical fixings myself because my 3 year old was interested in them and kept playing with them. Work started on the 11th of November 2024 and still not complete and loads of problems still need sorting. Plaster cracking, skirting boards missing, no extractor fans but a 4inch hole in my kitchen wall where 1 needs to go. I will keep on complaining about this outfit until I am finally happy or I take my last breath which ever 1st but I am not giving up! All I want is the work finished properly and a boiler that works with my HIVE system as I was promised. I'm not asking much. I'm sorry I even applied for this work. Much more hassle than it's worth honestly