NHS pension paid after passing

Ravens221

Hi all again. Another quick question before I put my paperwork away for the night. 

My dad had a NHS pension. Despite using the Tell Me Once service, they claim they were not notified and continued to pay. I didn't notice it myself as I wasn't keeping my eyes on his account after he passed until i started this process. Never mind, it is what it is. Of course it needs to be paid back and NHS pensions are happy for it to be paid back once everything is settled. 

There is a schedule for pensions IHT409 which i answered 'No' to all relevant questions as there is no Death Benefit or changes/transfers as a NHS pension stops in this circumstance, as no spouse to pass on to and neither child dependent on him. 

I have had a quick skim through the IHT400 to see if there is anywhere to declare these overpayments, but i can not spot it. Because these were payments after he passed they are not included on his bank account balance on date of death.

I know these over payments won't be included as part of his estate, so I am not worried about being charged for them - but just so i know, so can look out for it will there be anywhere to note these overpayments?

Thanks in advance. 

pjs493

Consider it like you might a debt, and class it as money owed from the estate. The same way you would a credit card balance. 

I thought I was going to be in a similar situation when my husband died (a few days before his monthly pay day) and I’d owe some of his salary back. I expected the MOD to give me a figure at some point of how much I needed to repay (equivalent to a few days pay), in my situation it turned out they owed the estate money due to him having a leave balance I hadn’t even thought about. In my case I’m the sole beneficiary of my husband’s Will barring a charitable donation and some sentimental bequests. 

I do know that in another case where an elderly relative died a year or two ago, their spouse had to repay DWP for overpaid pension payments. In that case the sum was small so they just paid it over the phone when they received a letter outlining what was owed. They were the only beneficiary of their spouse, barring a couple of sentimental bequests (eg the family Bible was left to their eldest child). When the relative dies their estate will split between their two children. 

Just keep a record of all the figures, bank balances (on date of death and any variables eg interest on an ISA and the date of the final balance), credit cards, etc. If there is a mortgage take note of the balance due on date of death and be aware that interest will still accrue. I’ve made the maximum overpayment I can to reduce interest because I know the balance will be due when Probate is granted. 

I’ve set up an excel spreadsheet to administer my husband’s estate. I listed assets in one tab, debts in another, a tab for payments incoming and outgoing since the date of death for bills paid and incoming payments from bank account closures etc, and an additional tab for the administration period (my husband owned a flat that is rented out so until Probate is granted and the flat changes into my name, everything to do with the flat needs to be dealt with separately). 

Ravens221

pjs493 said:

Consider it like you might a debt, and class it as money owed from the estate. The same way you would a credit card balance. 

I thought I was going to be in a similar situation when my husband died (a few days before his monthly pay day) and I’d owe some of his salary back. I expected the MOD to give me a figure at some point of how much I needed to repay (equivalent to a few days pay), in my situation it turned out they owed the estate money due to him having a leave balance I hadn’t even thought about. In my case I’m the sole beneficiary of my husband’s Will barring a charitable donation and some sentimental bequests. 

I do know that in another case where an elderly relative died a year or two ago, their spouse had to repay DWP for overpaid pension payments. In that case the sum was small so they just paid it over the phone when they received a letter outlining what was owed. They were the only beneficiary of their spouse, barring a couple of sentimental bequests (eg the family Bible was left to their eldest child). When the relative dies their estate will split between their two children. 

Just keep a record of all the figures, bank balances (on date of death and any variables eg interest on an ISA and the date of the final balance), credit cards, etc. If there is a mortgage take note of the balance due on date of death and be aware that interest will still accrue. I’ve made the maximum overpayment I can to reduce interest because I know the balance will be due when Probate is granted. 

I’ve set up an excel spreadsheet to administer my husband’s estate. I listed assets in one tab, debts in another, a tab for payments incoming and outgoing since the date of death for bills paid and incoming payments from bank account closures etc, and an additional tab for the administration period (my husband owned a flat that is rented out so until Probate is granted and the flat changes into my name, everything to do with the flat needs to be dealt with separately). 

Thanks for replying with all this helpful info. I am so sorry for your loss. 

Runner_Duck

I seem to recall that Tell Me Once did not cover private pensions, only the State Pension. I know we had to contact Mum's pension providers individually.  Yes you probably will have to repay any overpayments.  We stopped Mum's private payments asap and then spent the next 6 months trying to get the £130 she was owed by one of them.  There is a section #56 of IHT400 to include any pension arrears at the time of death.
My Excel spreadsheet was invaluable, I tracked everything in it

SiliconChip

Ravens221 said:

My dad had a NHS pension. Despite using the Tell Me Once service, they claim they were not notified and continued to pay. I didn't notice it myself as I wasn't keeping my eyes on his account after he passed until i started this process. Never mind, it is what it is. Of course it needs to be paid back and NHS pensions are happy for it to be paid back once everything is settled. 

As long as you included your dad's NINO when completing the Tell Us Once information (and he was a pensioner for one of England, Wales or Scotland NHS) I'd consider making a complaint to NHS Pensions as it's very clear that they are informed as part of the process, and if that's fallen down it's not your fault. They may consider writing off some or all of the overpayment.

"You’ll also need their National Insurance number if they were getting money or paying into any of the following pension schemes:

• NHS Pensions for NHS staff in England and Wales
• Scottish Public Pension Agency schemes for NHS staff, teachers, police and firefighters in Scotland"

https://www.gov.uk/after-a-death/organisations-you-need-to-contact-and-tell-us-once

Flugelhorn

Runner_Duck said:

I seem to recall that Tell Me Once did not cover private pensions, only the State Pension. I know we had to contact Mum's pension providers individually.  Yes you probably will have to repay any overpayments.  We stopped Mum's private payments asap and then spent the next 6 months trying to get the £130 she was owed by one of them.  There is a section #56 of IHT400 to include any pension arrears at the time of death.
My Excel spreadsheet was invaluable, I tracked everything in it

I used Tell Me Once and was specifically asked if the deceased had a public sector pension - they used the service to stop the NHS pension and there were no further payments into mother's account

Torry_Quine

Wasn't the bank informed and the account closed?