Current Shell customer: SMS Plc knocking on my door re: smart meter installation

QrizB

Gerry1 said:

prowla said:

Who says you have to accept a meter change?

Which says you can refuse...

https://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/advice/do-i-have-to-accept-a-smart-meter-aLLKl9O63dbM

Ofgem also agrees.

"You can choose not to accept an offer to have a smart meter fitted. You can also request to have one at a later date without being charged. Choosing not to have a smart meter might mean you have a limited choice of energy tariffs. Some smart tariffs could be cheaper."

https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/information-consumers/energy-advice-households/getting-smart-meter

Selective quoting there, Gerry!

You can choose not to accept "an offer", but Ofgem make it clear there are circumstances where it isn't "an offer" but a requirement:

frosch411

MultiFuelBurner said:

The least I'd expect is some form of communication and not a done deal to which no consent had been given. To my knowledge,

You said you had been pestered with calls (none answered, all blocked)and texts so at what point had they not tried to communicate it appears you ignored everything.

Yes, because the calls were unsolicited and a quick check online revealed they were all nuisance calls.
Text messages were also unsolicited and only asked for responses if I wanted to go ahead and book the suggested appointments, which I did not

frosch411

EssexHebridean said:

That approach would annoy me, too - regardless of what it related to - so I can understand your annoyance. I’m not a fan of people being made to feel railroaded into things - regardless of how beneficial that thing would probably be, as I feel it usually just makes them feel more negative about it. 

One thing to bear in mind - are you being told that the meter is nearing end of life and requires replacement? If so, then you will need to organise it and don’t have the right to refuse a smart meter as the replacement. If this is just off the back of the standard SM roll-out though, you don’t have to have anything done if you don’t want to yet. 

It’s not clear from your post whether you are anti-smart meter, whether you genuinely think you can’t get the meter changed due to renting, or whether it is just the nature of the approach that’s made you dig your heels in. If the first, then I’d suggest you might want to set out your reasons for it here as often we find that the reasons for people being “anti” are based on misunderstandings, fake news, or outdated information, and we can help to provide reassurance with the correct information. If the second, as already explained, the meters don’t belong to the landlord any more than they belong to you, so you don’t need consent for the replacement. And if the third, then personally I’d be inclined to wait for the change to Octopus then make the appointment at your own convenience as there are lots of advantages to smart metering - not least the ability to save money, perhaps! (No - not from watching the little In Home Display as “Einstein” would have you believe, but from the access to cheaper tariffs!) 

Thanks @EssexHebridean
 
To my knowledge there is no need to change the meters because they near their end of life or need replacing.
Neither my bust provider nor Shell had mentioned anything to that effect.

Re: rational for not wanting to change the meters, it's a good question.
I am not anti-smart meters and can see their benefit (plus my understanding is the current generation of them is more reliable than earlier versions). The landlord is likely to be sympathetic to the idea of having them so don't envisage issues from his side.
For now, I am happy to do monthly meter reads to ensure my bills are accurate, so a degree of control is the most pressing matter for me, not to mention I don't want the hassle of no heating/electricity for a day when it's still cold and I work from home. And the fact that the Octopus takeover was also looming means I'd also like to wait until the transfer of my Shell account has been fully completed so that I don't have to potentially deal with two companies if there were any issues. 

It's really mostly been the cheek of this guy turning up and telling me it's all a done deal when there's been no reason to have them changed nor was anything organised/agreed from my side/landlord's side (after all, I am responsible for the bills as they are not included).
If Octopus need their customers to have smart meters (or if I need them to get a better tariff from them, which might well be the case), I am more than happy for them to approach me and we can sort this out once I am an official Octopus customer, and not be left between two companies. 

GingerTim

frosch411 said:

EssexHebridean said:

That approach would annoy me, too - regardless of what it related to - so I can understand your annoyance. I’m not a fan of people being made to feel railroaded into things - regardless of how beneficial that thing would probably be, as I feel it usually just makes them feel more negative about it. 

One thing to bear in mind - are you being told that the meter is nearing end of life and requires replacement? If so, then you will need to organise it and don’t have the right to refuse a smart meter as the replacement. If this is just off the back of the standard SM roll-out though, you don’t have to have anything done if you don’t want to yet. 

It’s not clear from your post whether you are anti-smart meter, whether you genuinely think you can’t get the meter changed due to renting, or whether it is just the nature of the approach that’s made you dig your heels in. If the first, then I’d suggest you might want to set out your reasons for it here as often we find that the reasons for people being “anti” are based on misunderstandings, fake news, or outdated information, and we can help to provide reassurance with the correct information. If the second, as already explained, the meters don’t belong to the landlord any more than they belong to you, so you don’t need consent for the replacement. And if the third, then personally I’d be inclined to wait for the change to Octopus then make the appointment at your own convenience as there are lots of advantages to smart metering - not least the ability to save money, perhaps! (No - not from watching the little In Home Display as “Einstein” would have you believe, but from the access to cheaper tariffs!) 

Thanks @EssexHebridean
 
To my knowledge there is no need to change the meters because they near their end of life or need replacing.

If you know the model of your electricity meter your can work out when its certification will expire from: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1126202/schedule-4-december-2022.pdf

frosch411

Just another post to thank everyone for their swift responses

And to clarify: to my knowledge the current dumb meters haven't reached their end of life nor pose any risk. At least no communication from either Shell or any other party to that effect.

frosch411

GingerTim said:

frosch411 said:

EssexHebridean said:

That approach would annoy me, too - regardless of what it related to - so I can understand your annoyance. I’m not a fan of people being made to feel railroaded into things - regardless of how beneficial that thing would probably be, as I feel it usually just makes them feel more negative about it. 

One thing to bear in mind - are you being told that the meter is nearing end of life and requires replacement? If so, then you will need to organise it and don’t have the right to refuse a smart meter as the replacement. If this is just off the back of the standard SM roll-out though, you don’t have to have anything done if you don’t want to yet. 

It’s not clear from your post whether you are anti-smart meter, whether you genuinely think you can’t get the meter changed due to renting, or whether it is just the nature of the approach that’s made you dig your heels in. If the first, then I’d suggest you might want to set out your reasons for it here as often we find that the reasons for people being “anti” are based on misunderstandings, fake news, or outdated information, and we can help to provide reassurance with the correct information. If the second, as already explained, the meters don’t belong to the landlord any more than they belong to you, so you don’t need consent for the replacement. And if the third, then personally I’d be inclined to wait for the change to Octopus then make the appointment at your own convenience as there are lots of advantages to smart metering - not least the ability to save money, perhaps! (No - not from watching the little In Home Display as “Einstein” would have you believe, but from the access to cheaper tariffs!) 

Thanks @EssexHebridean
 
To my knowledge there is no need to change the meters because they near their end of life or need replacing.

If you know the model of your electricity meter your can work out when its certification will expire from: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1126202/schedule-4-december-2022.pdf

Thanks for this 😊 For the certification period is states 25.. not sure of that is good or bad. 

Netexporter

frosch411 said:

GingerTim said:

frosch411 said:

EssexHebridean said:

That approach would annoy me, too - regardless of what it related to - so I can understand your annoyance. I’m not a fan of people being made to feel railroaded into things - regardless of how beneficial that thing would probably be, as I feel it usually just makes them feel more negative about it. 

One thing to bear in mind - are you being told that the meter is nearing end of life and requires replacement? If so, then you will need to organise it and don’t have the right to refuse a smart meter as the replacement. If this is just off the back of the standard SM roll-out though, you don’t have to have anything done if you don’t want to yet. 

It’s not clear from your post whether you are anti-smart meter, whether you genuinely think you can’t get the meter changed due to renting, or whether it is just the nature of the approach that’s made you dig your heels in. If the first, then I’d suggest you might want to set out your reasons for it here as often we find that the reasons for people being “anti” are based on misunderstandings, fake news, or outdated information, and we can help to provide reassurance with the correct information. If the second, as already explained, the meters don’t belong to the landlord any more than they belong to you, so you don’t need consent for the replacement. And if the third, then personally I’d be inclined to wait for the change to Octopus then make the appointment at your own convenience as there are lots of advantages to smart metering - not least the ability to save money, perhaps! (No - not from watching the little In Home Display as “Einstein” would have you believe, but from the access to cheaper tariffs!) 

Thanks @EssexHebridean
 
To my knowledge there is no need to change the meters because they near their end of life or need replacing.

If you know the model of your electricity meter your can work out when its certification will expire from: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1126202/schedule-4-december-2022.pdf

Thanks for this 😊 For the certification period is states 25.. not sure of that is good or bad. 

The year (last 2 digits) of manufacture is usually following the letter(s) at the start of the serial number. If the serial number is just a string of numbers it is almost certainly out of certification. Newer meters generally have the year of manufacture in full, in addition.

BobT36

QrizB said:

Gerry1 said:

prowla said:

Who says you have to accept a meter change?

Which says you can refuse...

https://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/advice/do-i-have-to-accept-a-smart-meter-aLLKl9O63dbM

Ofgem also agrees.

"You can choose not to accept an offer to have a smart meter fitted. You can also request to have one at a later date without being charged. Choosing not to have a smart meter might mean you have a limited choice of energy tariffs. Some smart tariffs could be cheaper."

https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/information-consumers/energy-advice-households/getting-smart-meter

Selective quoting there, Gerry!

You can choose not to accept "an offer", but Ofgem make it clear there are circumstances where it isn't "an offer" but a requirement:

That's also selective quoting, just like your first post that only states he "can't" reject. 
You failed to mention in your very first post that's only in the SPECIFIC above situations, and where "replacing a meter" is actually REQUIRED, such as if it's end of life or some other fault / customer request. 

As Gerry posted, as long as it's not one of the above SPECIFIC situations (so, the default), he absolutely CAN reject. 

Spoonie_Turtle

BobT36 said:

QrizB said:

Gerry1 said:

prowla said:

Who says you have to accept a meter change?

Which says you can refuse...

https://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/advice/do-i-have-to-accept-a-smart-meter-aLLKl9O63dbM

Ofgem also agrees.

"You can choose not to accept an offer to have a smart meter fitted. You can also request to have one at a later date without being charged. Choosing not to have a smart meter might mean you have a limited choice of energy tariffs. Some smart tariffs could be cheaper."

https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/information-consumers/energy-advice-households/getting-smart-meter

Selective quoting there, Gerry!

You can choose not to accept "an offer", but Ofgem make it clear there are circumstances where it isn't "an offer" but a requirement:

That's also selective quoting, just like your first post that only states he "can't" reject. 
You failed to mention in your very first post that's only in the SPECIFIC above situations, and where "replacing a meter" is actually REQUIRED, such as if it's end of life or some other fault / customer request. 

As Gerry posted, as long as it's not one of the above SPECIFIC situations (so, the default), he absolutely CAN reject. 

At the time of posting it was not known whether the OP's meter was nearing certification expiry.  (Still not 100% certain, but they have stated nothing was said about it.)

BobT36

Spoonie_Turtle said:

At the time of posting it was not known whether the OP's meter was nearing certification expiry.  (Still not 100% certain, but they have stated nothing was said about it.)

Then why would anyone just presume that and omit the default? 
Surely the default is "you don't need to accept". And the exception / caveat is "If at end of life" (or faulty).