Shared outbuilding with party wall - housing association want to demolish their half

idealmelody

I own my property and share a brick out house with my neighbour who rents from a housing association. Today she told me that she had received notice that  her half was going to be demolished as it is unsafe after she reported that plaster was falling off the internal ceiling and there were areas of damp. My side in contrast is sound. After an initial survey reported the building  was unsafe she asked for a second opinion and was advised by another surveyor that it just needed basic remedial pointing / plastering repairs like those done on a neighbouring property last year.
In short the building is solid brick and is structurally sound. No one from the housing association has contacted me or checked my property or informed me of any issues or their intended actions. Is this right or even legal?
It's like using a sledgehammer to crack a nut.i think it may due to costs but surely they would have an obligation to repoint the party wall if they demolish my neighbours side?
I'm concerned demolition of one side will damage my concrete  roof and supporting wall and structurally weaken my half of the outhouse, plus it will look like an eyesore so I am not prepared to let this happen.
 My neighbour doesn't want it to be demolished either just the repairs to be carried out so she objects to it as well.

 Please can you advise how can I dispute this? Has lawful process been followed?
Do the housing association need planning permission or a party wall agreement? Do I need to seek legal advice? 
I'm grateful for any advice, thank you 🙏

twopenny

I don't know the legal bit but I've dealt repeatedly with a housing association.
I'd start by writting to them, a proper letter, saying politely that it has come to your attention that they may be wanting to do this.
Including a plan, even hand drawn, of what they are refering to.
Add that if they propose to do this that would like their assurance that no damage will be made to your property and it will be made sound and weather proof. Ie the now internal wall will become external
Add the address of the person you are sending it to at the bottom.
Date is important. I wouldn't include a phone number. You want the reply in writing.

I usually type these up on a computer so that I have a copy to refer to further down the line should the result not be what you agree to.

idealmelody

Thanks so much for your advice. I'm going to obtain a copy of the letter the housing association sent to my neighbour and ring them up on Monday. I've got visions of them turning up unannounced with pickaxes! I thought they had to issue a 2 month notice at least. 
 I can't help but think there is something shady with the first surveyor and how they have conducted themselves re: the lack of consultation. It doesn't seem very professional or above board.

Emmia

idealmelody said:

Thanks so much for your advice. I'm going to obtain a copy of the letter the housing association sent to my neighbour and ring them up on Monday. I've got visions of them turning up unannounced with pickaxes! I thought they had to issue a 2 month notice at least. 
 I can't help but think there is something shady with the first surveyor and how they have conducted themselves re: the lack of consultation. It doesn't seem very professional or above board.

Email the housing association, don't call as you need a written record.

ThisIsWeird

Wouldn't the PartyWallAct apply here?
If so, enact, and insist on them employing a surveyor on your behalf - if it becomes clear that they intend to proceed with this. That should ensure that their plans are thought out carefully enough to include fully making good your side.
Tbh, from what you describe, this seems stupidly impetuous, so I wonder if it's one maverick surveyor who won't actually get anywhere with their 'decision'? It seems poorly thought through.
But, get everything in place in case they do! 
I agree with the others - get this in writing. If you are really concerned that they could turn up any day without notice - I doubt very much they will - then call them  too, but only to say "I've emailed you about this, which I recommend you read", and "I will be enacting the PWA if this proceeds".
Make your email unemotive - purely factual.
If another surveyor or builder turns up just to have a look, turn on your phone to record and approach them nicely to ask what their intentions are. If it includes 'demolish', then say, "I haven't received your party wall notice yet - when will that be?"
Do you have Legal Protection on your house insurance? If so, call them up.
Bottom line, tho', is that they can do what they like with their building, but must ensure - PWA or not - that your part is protected. For a semi, I'd certainly be insisting on a PWA surveyor, as I'd like to see in advance how they propose to make good your side.
The physical party wall between you - any idea of its construction? And the rest of the outbuilding's walls? 

twopenny

Phone calls can be easily dismissed. 'Their in a meeting, out etc'
Emails put off, you don't know who they'll be passed to - but better than phone as you have a copy.
A letter has to go to the appropriate desk and dealt with. And filed. 

You could do both. Phone and ask for the name of the person dealing and tell them that is so you can write. You could get their personal email too.

Good idea about the neighbours letter. Take a photocopy of it so you have a copy and one to the company. There should be a name and reference on it too.
References come as initials ie SM/BW the first two letters are the person dealing. The second the person typing it.

Emmia

twopenny said:

Phone calls can be easily dismissed. 'Their in a meeting, out etc'
Emails put off, you don't know who they'll be passed to - but better than phone as you have a copy.
A letter has to go to the appropriate desk and dealt with. And filed. 

You could do both. Phone and ask for the name of the person dealing and tell them that is so you can write. You could get their personal email too.

Good idea about the neighbours letter. Take a photocopy of it so you have a copy and one to the company. There should be a name and reference on it too.
References come as initials ie SM/BW the first two letters are the person dealing. The second the person typing it.

Do they?

References on letters I write (typists don't really exist in the public sector anymore) are usually a numerical code, and the "from" can be just the name of the team which the person responding is in... 

E.g. it could be signed "council demolitions" with a reference 123456

This approach is also used by the building management company of the flats I live in.

twopenny

Indeed it can be several ways.
But I didn't actually say typists. The first set of initials is the person it's allocated to.
If it's a number that can also easily be used or the op can ask who if phoning.
But that's a digression.

idealmelody

ThisIsWeird said:

Wouldn't the PartyWallAct apply here?
If so, enact, and insist on them employing a surveyor on your behalf - if it becomes clear that they intend to proceed with this. That should ensure that their plans are thought out carefully enough to include fully making good your side.
Tbh, from what you describe, this seems stupidly impetuous, so I wonder if it's one maverick surveyor who won't actually get anywhere with their 'decision'? It seems poorly thought through.
But, get everything in place in case they do! 
I agree with the others - get this in writing. If you are really concerned that they could turn up any day without notice - I doubt very much they will - then call them  too, but only to say "I've emailed you about this, which I recommend you read", and "I will be enacting the PWA if this proceeds".
Make your email unemotive - purely factual.
If another surveyor or builder turns up just to have a look, turn on your phone to record and approach them nicely to ask what their intentions are. If it includes 'demolish', then say, "I haven't received your party wall notice yet - when will that be?"
Do you have Legal Protection on your house insurance? If so, call them up.
Bottom line, tho', is that they can do what they like with their building, but must ensure - PWA or not - that your part is protected. For a semi, I'd certainly be insisting on a PWA surveyor, as I'd like to see in advance how they propose to make good your side.
The physical party wall between you - any idea of its construction? And the rest of the outbuilding's walls? 

Thanks for your advice, I've spoken to my neighbour who confirmed that she objected to the surveyors advice to demolish her side of the flat roofed outbuilding / brick shed we share which is separated by an internal wall on the  boundary line. Her Housing Association then sent out a builder to assess it (not another surveyor). He advised he could repair it and reported back but was obviously not listened to. She confirmed the property 3 doors down from me had the same issues with their outbuilding but worse but it was repaired after the tenant was initially told it would be removed (ie demolished).
I've seen the letter confirming removal but no reasons were set out by the surveyor who the builder said he had had run-ins with before, so your assumptions about him being an impetuous maverick appear to be correct. 

Would any of you forumites be able to assist with suggested wording I could use please as I have no experience in this area? 
 Many thanks

ThisIsWeird

To be frank, I don't think you have any say over what they decide to do with that outbuilding - it's theirs. All you can do is remind them that they have a responsibility to make good the exposed side so that your side remains unaffected, and that you will hold them responsible for any damage caused.
If you add that you will insist on a PWA surveyor, this will likely add at least £1k to their bill, so this might help to persuade them to go for repairs instead.
Not sure what else you can do.
You don't have LegProt?

idealmelody

I think I have legal protection through my buildings insurance. Demolition seems so unnecessary as the outhouse building is solid brick dating from the early to mid 1950's and was refurbished in the mid 80's and my side of it is fine.  The letter relating to the surveyors report does not even give any reasons why demolition is necessary which makes me suspicious and no one has had the courtesy to contact me even though it will impact my property.