New tenancy agreement - car parking

jake_jones99

I am close to signing a new tenancy agreement that has the following clause:
"The tenant and the landlord agree the tenants, including friends and family are NOT permitted to park in the adjoining car parking spaces at any time during the tenancy."

I contacted the agent, who said that the adjoining car parking spaces are different from the street parking, which I could use with a permit. Is it obvious in the formulation that "adjoining car parking spaces" could not refer to street parking? Thanks!

Section62

jake_jones99 said:

I am close to signing a new tenancy agreement that has the following clause:
"The tenant and the landlord agree the tenants, including friends and family are NOT permitted to park in the adjoining car parking spaces at any time during the tenancy."

I contacted the agent, who said that the adjoining car parking spaces are different from the street parking, which I could use with a permit. Is it obvious in the formulation that "adjoining car parking spaces" could not refer to street parking? Thanks!

IMV no it isn't, and personally I'd want them to be more specific about which spaces the clause refers to.

However, you need to weigh up whether insisting they change the wording might result in the offer being withdrawn.  If the agent has already said in writing that this doesn't mean on-street parking then that might be sufficient.

There could be a long discussion here about whether the landlord has the right to stop you using on-street parking (and therefore whether the vagueness has any practical effect), but I'd take a step back from that and think about whether having that argument with the agent/landlord is something you would want to deal with if it were to come up.

ProDave

It is very vague, but I read it as the landlord owns (or leases) some private off road parking spaces that are not included in your tenancy and you must only park in the public on road spaces with a permit.

user1977

Is there any reason why the landlord would care about you parking in the public road?

born_again

What parking is there round the property?

Veteransaver

Not sure how the landlord could have any jurisdiction over public on street parking so presume it just means the other spaces on the property.
On street parking wouldn't normally be call a "parking space" either.
Do you have an allocated parking space as part of the tenancy, presume the other residents do too so it's reasonable to stipulate you must not use their spaces as well.

Section62

Veteransaver said:

Not sure how the landlord could have any jurisdiction over public on street parking so presume it just means the other spaces on the property.

On street parking wouldn't normally be call a "parking space" either.

The first question is whether the 'street' is public or private - if private then effectively it is no different to any other private land which may be accessed by others.

I don't think it is a question of the landlord having 'jurisdiction' over the public road.  It is down to whether the landlord can lawfully insert a clause restricting the tenants behaviour in that way - that's a tenancy law question which I'm not going to comment on.

However, in some areas the council has put in place restrictions on development requiring that the occupants of properties refrain from applying for resident (on-street) parking permits (or says such applications will be turned down) and very often the nature of the agreement requires the property owner to inform prospective occupants that this restriction is in place.  The line between 'informing' a prospective tenant of such a restriction, and including a clause in a TA saying something like 'you can't park here' is one I'd be interested to hear of any case law on.

Highway and Traffic Authorities tend to use "parking place" to refer to on-street parking, but 'parking space' is also commonly used to refer to positions on a public road where someone can park.

Wonka_2

Section62 said:

However, in some areas the council has put in place restrictions on development requiring that the occupants of properties refrain from applying for resident (on-street) parking permits (or says such applications will be turned down) and very often the nature of the agreement requires the property owner to inform prospective occupants that this restriction is in place.  The line between 'informing' a prospective tenant of such a restriction, and including a clause in a TA saying something like 'you can't park here' is one I'd be interested to hear of any case law on.

You beat me to it on this one - we have a number in our city, especially around student areas. I'm not aware of any legal cases but plenty of disappointed tenants who have to park a significant distance away when they've been refused a permit

NameUnavailable

Wonka_2 said:

Section62 said:

However, in some areas the council has put in place restrictions on development requiring that the occupants of properties refrain from applying for resident (on-street) parking permits (or says such applications will be turned down) and very often the nature of the agreement requires the property owner to inform prospective occupants that this restriction is in place.  The line between 'informing' a prospective tenant of such a restriction, and including a clause in a TA saying something like 'you can't park here' is one I'd be interested to hear of any case law on.

You beat me to it on this one - we have a number in our city, especially around student areas. I'm not aware of any legal cases but plenty of disappointed tenants who have to park a significant distance away when they've been refused a permit

If you can't get a permit you can't park UNLESS you just pay and display for street parking. I think the OP may be looking at a property that has some off road parking but the LL is saying that they or their visitors cannot use it and must therefore park on the road or elsewhere.

OP can you clarify?

Section62

NameUnavailable said:

Wonka_2 said:

Section62 said:

However, in some areas the council has put in place restrictions on development requiring that the occupants of properties refrain from applying for resident (on-street) parking permits (or says such applications will be turned down) and very often the nature of the agreement requires the property owner to inform prospective occupants that this restriction is in place.  The line between 'informing' a prospective tenant of such a restriction, and including a clause in a TA saying something like 'you can't park here' is one I'd be interested to hear of any case law on.

You beat me to it on this one - we have a number in our city, especially around student areas. I'm not aware of any legal cases but plenty of disappointed tenants who have to park a significant distance away when they've been refused a permit

If you can't get a permit you can't park UNLESS you just pay and display for street parking.

Typically in the areas where these agreements are in place there is only resident permit parking - P&D (or now more commonly pay by phone) often isn't an option.

P&D/pay by phone is more usually found in areas where there is an excess of available parking and a high demand for paid parking (e.g. shops or a station).  Pay parking is expensive to administer, so councils now tend to limit it to locations where higher turnover exists, or higher charges can be made.

35har1old

Veteransaver said:

Not sure how the landlord could have any jurisdiction over public on street parking so presume it just means the other spaces on the property.
On street parking wouldn't normally be call a "parking space" either.
Do you have an allocated parking space as part of the tenancy, presume the other residents do too so it's reasonable to stipulate you must not use their spaces as well.

Unless he is the site landlord and some shared excess roads  are not public roads