Economy 7 doubling in cost

robert125

Our electricity bill (mostly night rate economy 7) is about to double in January, and I wonder if anyone else is worried by this and I also wonder why edf are even allowed to double the rate from 8.9 pence per unit to almost 16 pence per unit?

la531983

Its not doubling, one rate is going up and the other rate is going down.

paulcoleman

I've posted exactly the same comment elsewhere. I find navigation round this site difficult. See https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6493111/economy-7-tariffs-from-1-1-24 for more

JSHarris

robert125 said:

Our electricity bill (mostly night rate economy 7) is about to double in January, and I wonder if anyone else is worried by this and I also wonder why edf are even allowed to double the rate from 8.9 pence per unit to almost 16 pence per unit?

Our's (EDF) is going up by 22.5%, so I've been looking around.  Just had a reply from UW and it looks as if they are holding their off-peak E7 rate down, although I need to check further as I think there are conditions attached to the price they've just given me of 11.19p/kWh (southern region).

MWT

robert125 said:

Our electricity bill (mostly night rate economy 7) is about to double in January, and I wonder if anyone else is worried by this and I also wonder why edf are even allowed to double the rate from 8.9 pence per unit to almost 16 pence per unit?

All the E7 standard variable tariffs have to remain at or below the Ofgem cap for multirate metering and that is set based on an assumed split of 58% Peak and 42% off-peak.

Different suppliers will make different choices where to set their rates, but they will all be within the allowed cap on that 58/42 basis.

So it is perfectly allowable for EDF to increase one rate if they make a sufficient change in the other to keep the total below the cap.

What matters is how far your own consumption skews in either direction, and yes, it does seem to have become normal for suppliers to move towards lower peak rates and hence higher off-peak rates over winter.

Scot_39

robert125 said:

Our electricity bill (mostly night rate economy 7) is about to double in January, and I wonder if anyone else is worried by this and I also wonder why edf are even allowed to double the rate from 8.9 pence per unit to almost 16 pence per unit?

Do you use 100% night rate ?

If not then your bill is not doubling - only one of the 2 energy rates cost components.

The latest Ofgem data shows a reduction in average night rate usage split for profile class 2 (multirate) meters - to 40% night.

But it decided not to change from current 58% day to 42 % night split - that is the basis it assumes when pricing multirate electric cap.

Which edf have to comply with - just as every other supplier.

Others using less than that average split - have been asked to pay a significantly higher day rate than with other suppliers to balance that heavily lowered night rate you now complain about losing.

And EDF have received criticism for many in the past the way they handled pricing.  Other regions lost their sub 10p - arguably all EPG distortion / anomalies anyway - months ago.

Winter demand for night energy increases - for those with night storage devices, batteries, hot water tanks, EVs etc.  Prices reflect that.

There are several equally inaccurately titled threads on this price rise already.

Few - not directly benefitting - see any issue with what if anything is simply a normalisation of pricing across suppliers and regions.

And as an EDF customer - you may well have had the oppertunity to fix at those anomalous rates over the last few months - others here did.

Variable tariffs are just that - variable.

JSHarris

My personal (and extremely biased!) view is that Ofgem need to review the way the cap is applied to stop suppliers gaming the system.  Suppliers are fully aware that many  E7 customers will use massively more off-peak electricity in winter, compared with summer, after all, E7 was created as a heating tariff.  The arbitrary 58/42 split is over a whole year, not the coldest months of the year.

I'm getting fed up with having to switch suppliers in winter just because many disproportionately increase their off-peak rate.

Scot_39

The whole basis of 58:42% split is dubious.

Ofgem - who dont source the data for it direct - make no distinction between those with electric storage heating, off peak hot water tanks, evs etc. when setting the splits.

Only the meter types.  

Theirs a bit in their latest tdcv decision letter covering some of the weaknesses in data behind it.

Arguably as demand higher prices are higher.

My night rate has gone up by twice the day rate in pence - a 10% increase in off peak vs 2.5% on peak - straddling the Ofgem multirate cap rise. 

But it's still over 10% below last January's EPG compensated rate.

But as a low user the loss of EBSS dwarfs my unit saving - so net costs higher this year (near £300 when calculated at July rates on a sub £1000 annual bill estimate)

What wasn't normal was just one supplier in one region at c9p vs most others at c13-15p.

JSHarris

Scot_39 said:

The whole basis of 58:42% split is dubious.



What wasn't normal was just one supplier in one region at c9p vs most others at c13-15p.

It is, very dubious.  Houses with storage heating are definitely going to be more like a 30%/70% peak to off-peak usage in winter, I think.  We're extreme, as we average about 0.5%/99.5% peak to off-peak split (hence my bias!).

I've mapped a few suppliers to see which in our region is still offering a decent off-peak tariff:

EDF = 16.433p/kWh

Coop = 15.313p/kWh

Octopus = 15.310p/kWh

BG = 14.89p/kWh

Sainsbury's = 14.208p/kWh

E.On = 12.895p/kWh

UW = 11.19p/kWh

MWT

JSHarris said:

My personal (and extremely biased!) view is that Ofgem need to review the way the cap is applied to stop suppliers gaming the system. 

If you were to get your wish, the likely consequence would be that the price balance they use in the winter would become the same for the rest of the year, not the other way around.

That might suit some more, but certainly wouldn't help those using E7 for its main purpose, heating...

It is the lower off peak use outside of winter that lets the prices go low as they become subsidised by the higher peak rate prices... that can't be sustained in winter... 

dunstonh

It is, very dubious.  Houses with storage heating are definitely going to be more like a 30%/70% peak to off-peak usage in winter, I think.  We're extreme, as we average about 0.5%/95% peak to off-peak split (hence my bias!).

And we are 30% peak and 70% off peak on our annual use and we dont even have heating/water via electric.

I've mapped a few suppliers to see which in our region is still offering a decent off-peak tariff:

EDF = 16.433p/kWh

Coop = 15.313p/kWh

Octopus = 15.310p/kWh

BG = 14.89p/kWh

Sainsbury's = 14.208p/kWh

E.On = 12.895p/kWh

UW = 11.19p/kWh

My 8p fixed rate with EDF finishes next September but assuming they cannot return to a low off peak rate next summer, it looks like a move away from EDF will be in order.

All of us that moved to EDF in 2022 - early 2023 to get the 8p rates are likely to be the same types that move away if they cannot get a decent rate out of EDF.