Euro car parks Morrisons POPLA appeal advice

SamP92

Ah okay. Not yet have drafted first appeal for popla, was waiting for feedback before submitting 

Le_Kirk

Given the time of year,  you could be waiting a while for some critique, which is fine if you have time before your POPLA deadline expires. Providing you have covered all the usual points as explained in NEWBIE sticky, third post you should be fine.

Etccarmageddon

Within a few days of sending your popla appeal it should appear and then you only have 7 days to comment on it.  So you have to be on the ball 

SamP92

POPLA appeal was submitted and received the below comments from ECP today:

This location is managed by Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) technology which takes a picture of the vehicle entering and exiting the site, these pictures are timed and therefore the duration of the stay can be calculated. All vehicle registration numbers are then matched against the data produced by the various means of paying for parking and a list of registration numbers where no payment has been made or where the motorist has stayed longer than the period paid is produced. After requesting vehicle keeper details from the DVLA, a Notice to keeper is sent to the keepers of the vehicles on this list. As a consequence at ANPR locations there will be no PCN issued to the windscreen neither will there be photographic evidence of the windscreen supplied in operator evidence packs.

Parking Charge Notice ***** was issued to vehicle **** for breach of terms and conditions: 

Your vehicle was parked longer than the maximum period allowed at ****. This car park operates a maximum stay ANPR operation.

Statement: ***** stated that she is writing to ECP as the registered keeper and

it would be grateful if ECP would please consider my appeal for the reasons. The amount 

demanded is a penalty and is punitive, contravening the Consumer Rights Act 2015.

Section 18.3 of the British Parking Association’s (BPA) code of practice explains that signs 

“must be conspicuous and legible and written in intelligible language, so that they are easy to see, read and understand. 

Signage on site is clear, when parking on private land it is the driver’s responsibility to 

read the signage displayed and parked accordance with the terms and conditions as 

stated. Euro Car Parks have provided photographic evidence showing that the appellant 

remained at the site for 3 hour(s) 26 minute(s) (Figure 1)

The signage clearly states the terms and conditions of parking, all drivers are required 

to adhere to the maximum stay on site.

Signage is visble when entering and inside of the car park and when entering private 

land it would be the driver’s responsibilty to read the terms and conditions and adhere 

to them. (Figure 2 – See Section 7). Also, please note the time and date stamped images 

of the signage on site.

Any form of parking ticket or ‘notice’ is issued under the law ‘of trespass and Contract Law’. A driver who is invited (or chooses) to park on private land and use the car parking facilities and pays a fee/s does so under a contract (signage) with the car park operator. The parking contract sets out the terms that apply to the parking service, including the price. 

Figure 3 confirms that the NTK is POFA compliant.

Automatic Number Plate Recognition systems are effectively image processing and micro processor devices with an internal reference clock based around a set of components referred to as the ‘Real Time Clock chipset’ or RTC. The chipset uses a quartz crystal reference source and will provide a reliable time reference dependant on a drift characteristic determined by variations in local camera temperature. High fluctuations in local ambient can cause the RTC to drift as much as 30 seconds a month and to counteract this an NTP server is utilised. The NTP server is effectively a computer situated in a control room and takes a reference time source from a GPS satellite and provides a hyper accurate time reference. All camera systems operated by ECP are configured to request a time synchronisation from the NTP on a sixty second basis. This ensures that all cameras have a universal time reference which is accurate to a few thousandths of a second. Cameras also report a ‘heartbeat’ to our back office environment, again on a sixty second basis, and this is used to establish camera operation; logs of these transactions from all cameras are retained for approximately six months. On 

capture of an ANPR read this is transmitted to a similar back office environment where the time difference between that tagged on the raw capture and the ‘real time’ of the servers is again tested. 

All ANPR cameras used by ECP are compliant under the home office approval framework as 

stated under NAAS/NASP.

The Site is operated by an Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) system. ANPR 

cameras have captured an image of the vehicle registration mark **** entering and 

leaving The Site and calculated the duration of stay. 

Parking at The Site is limited to 180 minutes. Your vehicle entered at 18:40:30 and exited 

at 22:06:06 therefore was parked longer than the maximum period allowed. 

Signage located throughout The Site clearly details the terms and conditions. On entry 

to private land, it is the responsibility of the driver to ensure all terms and conditions as 

detailed on the signage are adhered to. 

Please be advised that it is the registered keeper’s responsibility to inform of the full 

name and UK serviceable address of who was driving the vehicle within 28 days 

beginning with the day after the notice was given. If the full amount remains unpaid, 

under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (‘the Act’), Euro Car Parks 

have the right subject of the Act to recover from the keeper of the vehicle at the time it 

was parked so much of that amount which remains unpaid. 

As you have not provided a UK serviceable address, liability has been transferred back 

to you as the Registered Keeper. 

Any form of parking ticket or ‘notice’ is issued under the law ‘of trespass and Contract 

Law’. A driver who is invited (or chooses) to park on private land and use the car parking 

facilities and pays a fee/s does so under a contract (signage) with the car park operator. 

The parking contract sets out the terms that apply to the parking service, including the 

price. 

The contract (signage) clearly states the extra charges are that the driver will incur and 

have to pay if they decide to break the contract terms − for example, by parking longer 

than the time paid for or exceeding the maximum time limit applicable. 

With regards to the reference to “Pre-Estimate of Loss/breach of consumer contracts 

1999.” Please be advised that the Supreme Court has made judgement (04/11/15) that 

clearly sets out the issue of parking charge notices on private land (law of contract 

applies) and in particular pre-estimate of loss. The parking charge notice is enforceable 

on the basis that it protected a legitimate interest when the driver failed to adhere to the 

terms and conditions and was not extravagant, exorbitant nor unconscionable. The 

parking charge is not an unenforceable penalty and does not breach the Unfair Terms in 

Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999. 

-It’s the driver’s responsibility to check the signage prior to leaving the vehicle on site. 

-Contract Law Applies

Figure 1 (IMAGES OF THE VEHICLE)
Figure 2 (SIGNAGE ON SITE)
Figure 3 (NTK SAMPLE)
Figure 4 (CONTRACT BETWEEN LANDOWNER AND ECP)
Signage location plan and images of signage on site

Coupon-mad

Normal. You know what to do as the NEWBIES thread explains it.

Etccarmageddon

Check figure 3 is actually correct as most of mine was just like yours a copy and paste template and the figure 3 was the most shocking failure on their part.

Another laughable and offensive bit of trash on their document stated that their PCN is POFA compliant as they have had it confirmed by their solicitor Gladstone's who i then Googled and found they had a trust pilot rating if 1 star.  Might as well have said a man down the pub had approved it!

Etccarmageddon

Are the signs clear when you enter the car park ?  Is the parking charge value on the sign in small print?   

SamP92

So I have been awaiting for an update from POPLA appeal and Morrisons using the link that was sent and received the below by email

Thank you for your patience.

I’d like to confirm that your Parking Charge Notice has been cancelled.

If you need a bit more time when shopping with us you can always pop to the customer service desk with your registration number.

Any further issues please let me know.

Kind regards,

Thanks everyone for your help! 

Coupon-mad

Very good!

Shame the signs don't tell you about your right to claim more time...