Faulty product nightmare Desperately need help

Hi all Im after some advice. im not good at this type of thing.
Im really sorry but this is slightly long.

I brought a lighting transformer from a company online who I have used before with no issues. The transformer arrived and when fitted didnt work. I contacted the seller straight away and told them it was faulty and could they send a replacement and a return label for the faulty one. I was told its not faulty, it was tested before being sent and they do not issue replacements foc. I would also have to pay to send the item back via recorded delivery for testing before a replacement was sent. They suggested a few things to make sure it was faulty but the instructions were quite vague so I called their number which is a 0871 number, unbeknown to me at the time it charged me £3.15 as its a premium number. I did the tests as instructed at an extra cost to me.
Despite the tests, Its still faulty. I contacted the company again explaining this and asked again for a replacement which i think is a reasonable request. I also said again i would like to return the faulty one,
I also questioned the phone number and charges and they said its not a premium rate number its a standard call charge and if id been charged that much i would have been on the phone for half an hour and that they had no calls for that duration, you must have called someone else. 
I can say It was definitely them as they explaind how to test the item. 

I said either a refund or a working replacement would be acceptable and if they were willing to do so I would accept either solution. I also said its their resposibility for the cost of return as its a faulty item. I checked the consumer rights 2015 before putting that in the email.
 
All i got in reply was "please see below in red" with my quoted email along with aggressive red bold lettering entered in between the sentences answering questions. They also accused me of threatening them in the email.
I just said "At this point in time either option would be an ideal solution to the problem (Either a replacement or a refund and i would return the faulty goods at their cost as its faulty). However if this is not an acceptable solution for you WE do have other options".  

The other options were: I could return the item personally as they are fairly local but I would want a refund not another transformer (all faith in the company has been lost at this point) or I could contact paypal to sort it out. 
I just didnt tell them what the other options were. I wanted to give them a chance to resolve things properly and they took it personally. 

Their reply

I am not sure what your last sentence is insinuating however I would think very carefully as to your next email. Staff are not here to be threatened or have customers imply threats.
This is unacceptable.


I didnt threaten or insinuate anything all i gave were facts. 
This reply made me not want to deal with them any more, I dont trust anything about them so I just called paypal to sort it out. Why keep trying the same thing over and over again expecting a different result.

This is their email to me after i called paypal. 

We have been made aware of your Chargeback claim through Paypal and will defend it.
It is now clear exactly what your email meant when you insinuated you had other options. In simple terms going over the head of the retailer to file a Chargeback. In the retail world this is called 'Friendly Fraud' by falsing a refund with a payment provider. Very suspicious behaviour if I say so. As you have not given us the chance to inspect and test the product we cannot verify your claim that the goods are defective.
I strongly recommend you return the goods to us as any consumer is obligated to do. If you retain the goods and receive funds back we will pursure the return of the funds as per our T&C's.
We await the return of the goods.

No "friendly fraud" here, Ive asked them nicely for a replacement and to cover the postage costs to return the faulty item, i just want a working product like i am entitled to. The one they supplied doesnt work, they can have it back but unfortunately this is what i am up against.

I am at a loss now to know what to do. 

Can anyone advise please I am livid, desperate and stuggling mentaly with this. I've not been aggressive, ive tried things they suggested at an extra cost to me, ive tried to be straight with them and exercise my consumer rights without being snotty so Im horrified that they've accused me of threatening their employees, accused me of lying about the phone charges and that im a 'Friendly Fraud' and i am falsing a refund. 


I just need to know what to say or whether I say anything at all.
Do I reply to the email ? I just dont trust them at all from the way they respond
Ive already stated I have no problems returning the faulty item. They just keep turning it round to make me look like im trying to rip them off. 

While searching for info I found a few reviews of this company and it looks like im not the first to be treated like this. I should have looked first!

Again im so sorry for such a long post i just dont know what to do.


lee
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Comments

  • Alderbank
    Alderbank Posts: 2,698
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    I'm very sorry to read that you have been left 'livid, desperate and stuggling mentaly'.

    No one, on either side of the counter, should ever feel like this after a simple retail transaction. They were very out of order with the 'Friendly Fraud' nonsense. To be generous to them, emails can be impersonal and may be misread by the receiver as more aggressive than the sender intended, but that's not an excuse.

    The phone call is not covered by consumer rights. I think premium rate numbers are a poor business practice but there is no obligation even for them to offer any phone number.

    Consumer rights do say that they are entitled to have the goods back to examine them to confirm that they are faulty. You said they are local so I would just take it back to the shop, with a friend for moral support. Just stay calm and polite and I think the store manager will replace it.

    How much did it cost?
  • Did you open a Not As Described dispute with Paypal OP or do they mean something else by mentioning "chargeback"?

    If it's a NAD Paypal should tell you to return it tracked, you can use RM Tracked 24/48 if the item is less than £150 available with Royal Mail here:

    https://send.royalmail.com/

    Depends on the terms as to what is right with regards to you returning or them collecting the goods, they can inspect goods customers claim have a fault 

    You are allow to say which website you've purchased from if you wish to?  
  • DullGreyGuy
    DullGreyGuy Posts: 9,182
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    087 numbers are not strictly speaking "Premium rate" but are more expensive than others... for a home phone their charge is capped at 13p per minute but naturally mobiles can be more expensive. 

    The story is hard to follow for a variety of reasons... it's hard to write these things calmly when it's such an emotive matter for you. 

    Ultimately it sounds like you have submitted a chargeback and so you just need to sit back and see the outcome of that. 
  • Alderbank said:
    I'm very sorry to read that you have been left 'livid, desperate and stuggling mentaly'.

    No one, on either side of the counter, should ever feel like this after a simple retail transaction. They were very out of order with the 'Friendly Fraud' nonsense. To be generous to them, emails can be impersonal and may be misread by the receiver as more aggressive than the sender intended, but that's not an excuse.

    The phone call is not covered by consumer rights. I think premium rate numbers are a poor business practice but there is no obligation even for them to offer any phone number.

    Consumer rights do say that they are entitled to have the goods back to examine them to confirm that they are faulty. You said they are local so I would just take it back to the shop, with a friend for moral support. Just stay calm and polite and I think the store manager will replace it.

    How much did it cost?
    Hi Alderbank, it was £30 but when you dont earn a lot thats an expense you cant afford to waste. I dont cope well with conflict so this is very trying. I dont even know if i can return it in person and if i do and take a friend I will probably be accused of intimidating them as im a big chap and so is the friend id take with me. I'm not so botherd about the premium call ( it was from my mobile, no land line) I am starting to calm a little now but I cant let this company beat me down. Thanks for your reply. 
  • 087 numbers are not strictly speaking "Premium rate" but are more expensive than others... for a home phone their charge is capped at 13p per minute but naturally mobiles can be more expensive. 

    The story is hard to follow for a variety of reasons... it's hard to write these things calmly when it's such an emotive matter for you. 

    Ultimately it sounds like you have submitted a chargeback and so you just need to sit back and see the outcome of that. 
    HI, yes im sorry its a bit confusing, so much has gone on in emails theres a lot to write. However any emails sent were very carefully worded to be polite and straight to the point, sadly the replies were not. I actually called paypal as i didnt know what to do online, its all too confusing. I explained to the advisor what was going on and they did what they did. 
    Thanks for your reply
  • Wait and see what happens with the chargeback.  If successful, you'll need to return the transformer.  If challenged and reversed, come back here for advice.
  • Did you open a Not As Described dispute with Paypal OP or do they mean something else by mentioning "chargeback"?

    If it's a NAD Paypal should tell you to return it tracked, you can use RM Tracked 24/48 if the item is less than £150 available with Royal Mail here:

    https://send.royalmail.com/

    Depends on the terms as to what is right with regards to you returning or them collecting the goods, they can inspect goods customers claim have a fault 

    You are allow to say which website you've purchased from if you wish to?  
    Hi the_lunatic_is_in_my_head,  I actually called paypal and explained that i had a faulty item as that was not an option to choose and explained what had gone on and that the company are being awkward. The operative said hold on for a minute and said its logged and to wait up to 7 days. 

    I've just looked on my account and this is what its logged under.

    Additional Information
    Your note:
    item arrived defective, seller is not willing to issue a refund
    Item issues:
    DEFECTIVE
    Item details
    Item name:
    HUIBOLONG HTV60C1 ELECTRONIC TRANSFORMER
    Item description:
    Product ID: 1769
    Item number:
    HTV60C1
    Quantity:
    1
    Item name:
    HUIBOLONG HTV60C1 ELECTRONIC TRANSFORMER #HTV60C1
    Quantity:
    1
    Issue:
    Not as described

    I have stated on every email im willing to return the item but I dont want to incur any more costs. I dont actually trust the seller to refund me if I did. 

    T
    hanks for the info I will look into how i need to proceed from here. With this company i think very carefully. 
  • Wait and see what happens with the chargeback.  If successful, you'll need to return the transformer.  If challenged and reversed, come back here for advice.
    No problem returning the product as long as I get a refund. I will be back if the challenge is reversed. 
    thanks
  • the_lunatic_is_in_my_head
    the_lunatic_is_in_my_head Posts: 7,319
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    edited 24 November 2023 at 2:14PM
    If it's the company I looked at  their terms are poor and their attitude in the terms seem poor (but I may be looking at the wrong place). 

    What you've pasted from Paypal looks like a NAD case to me rather than a card chargeback but hard to say, if it is NAD I would expect Paypal to advise you to return the goods tracked and then refund what you paid when the tracking is updated to delivered, be sure to use the address Paypal give for the return rather than any other address the sellre may provide

    If you did return and the company refuse to refund the £3.29 then it's probably easier to write that amount off.

    If, aside from what Paypal do, the company inspect the goods and say they aren't faulty (just a what if :) ), you'd need to post a link to the website so we can check the terms to see whether the change of mind cancellation period is extended or not.
  • Niv
    Niv Posts: 2,457
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    I found the company you purchased from , they sound awful. Fingers crossed that you get your money back.
    YNWA

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